2020 U.S. Presidential Election - It's never too early to start!

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Who is the best choice for President of the United States in 2020?


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The Pink Panther

Get Sneed's Feed, Then You Get The Seed
True & Honest Fan
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Ashy the Angel

The Cultural Marxist under your bed
kiwifarms.net
lol

Bernie is most certainly not the Dem equivalent of Tramp. Bernie lacks the charisma and energy right off the bat. Try again, freebie boy.
Oh yeah, I definitely agree with you. He's not like Trump in any tangible sense whatsoever. But to liberals he's just as bad as Trump because people...I dunno. Actually defend him and debate other candidates' supporters instead of just bowing down to Biden or Warren. Liberals absolutely loathe Bernie because he dared to criticize Hillary and is farther to the left than they are. To liberals, running against their Chosen One (Especially if they're a woman) makes you a Trump clone for some idiotic reason.
 

Coh

マリア様 止めないで 胸の火が誘うのよ 明日の日を占うの イエス様 眩しいわ
kiwifarms.net
Funny you should mention that...


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The Dem equivalent to Trump probably would be Jim Webb since they both appeal to the Democratic Party's (former) blue collar base in both policy and substance. Bernie is basically just a meme for dumb socialist millennials to fall for.
 

No Ma'ams Land

Read Sutter Cane
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If outright claims of sexual assault didn't sink Trumps campaign why would unsubstantiated claims from literal Warren staffers hurt Bernie? Neo libs have been pushing this dumbass "h-he's a misogynist" attack line for so long its laughable. They can't attack him on his policies so they go for identity politics.
I, too, forgot about poor Al Franken.
 
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It's HK-47

Meatbag's Bounty of Bodies
Supervisor
True & Honest Fan
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Had someone pass these out at the subway station, refute their arguments.

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"He's a million years old, he lost the last election, and he's already had a heart attack."

It's laughable that his first campaign point there is, "A welcoming and safe America for all" considering that every other word out of his mouth is dripping with venom for anyone who voted for supports Trump, and to my knowledge he's never made so much as a single effort to try and decry whenever people in red hats get attacked. If anything he just stokes the fire.

He's been in politics longer than I've been alive and he's accomplished next to nothing. I liked him in 2016. I have no idea why I ever thought he was worth caring about, now. I am amused, though, that the Democrats are using the economy less and less in their talking points as time goes on. They know it's good and they don't want to talk about it, so they have to shift off to this other hippie-dippy shit that isn't remotely economically feasible.

You could give literally every single homeless person in the entire country a free house and a month later maybe 5% of them would still be in that house. Access to housing isn't the problem, free college is ultimately useless if you don't know why you're going, the Green New Deal is just Woodstock policy on meth, and I have no fucking idea what "workplace democracy" is supposed to be but considering that he hacked the paychecks of his own staff when they complained, I sincerely doubt that it means anything.
 

KiwiLedian

Hands up, don't U-Turn
kiwifarms.net
wtf is "workplace democracy"

is it literally seize the means of production?
Unions. He wants to promote unions heavily and while the idea is charming, unions are practically a shitty way to enforce equality in the workplace. Sure they give you a voice but it's all on the union to actually fight for things and you better pray to the lord above you don't get a union that's lazy and in it for the monthly fees they take from you.
A better way to go about it is to actually fucking regulate things. I'm all for a small government but enforcing maternity leave and paid leave isn't going to massively overexpand the government and would do wonders to actually boost workforce morale and average happiness in the US.

Tell me, would you rather have unions or have the government mandate paid leave and maternity leave? I bet most average Americans would pick number two.
Will companies complain and downsize because of it? Of course, anything to save money but the short term downside is outweighed by the net positive in the general workforce. People might actually be more willing to work if they knew they at least get a vacation guaranteed.
 

Harvey Danger

getting tired of this whole internet thing
kiwifarms.net
Who's the Republican equivalent of Bernie? I'm not sure it's !Jeb since i think !Jeb had something that resemble a job at some point
Ron Paul

Both him and Bernie have a huge following online and its mostly comprised of Millennials and both of them will never be President of the United States.

Except Ron Paul actually had a job and his college degree is actually useful.
Plus Ron Paul was also screwed over by his party's political machine. Not as badly as Bernie--he lost fair and square, no rigging necessary. But never let it be forgotten that in 2012, the "party of ideas" decided a facade of unity was more important than doing the hard work of reconciling ideological differences.

To borrow an old joke, "and then suddenly, for no reason at all, Cheeto Hitler was elected".
 

Kiwi Farms Lurker

I swear, there's no «Mexican» corona in my honey!
kiwifarms.net
NO! He was my fucking favorite; no matter what face you paused the screen on it always was meme tier. Not to mention that majestically shiny bald head. All well, rip Cory, please give a shout out to DAT_NIGGA_REEE for me.
Don't you worry, his time will come someday.
b26.jpg
 

MaoBigDong

Pamela Swain Gave Me Ass Cancer
kiwifarms.net
Workplace democracy is an anarcho communist idea, not sure why a demsoc would even be remotely interested in that. It’s basically a “hierarchy” without the “leader” because anarkiddies like to think that any person leading them is a boot that is being licked. The theory is that if this workplace leader were to be democratically elected then there would be no boot to lick. and everyone would be happy not being oppressed yadda yadda. I think most Bernie supporters are in support of workplace unions, so perhaps he could be conflating that idea with the idea of everybody just joining a union and democratically bargaining for better wages and benefits? I don’t think Bernie is radically left enough to actually support a system in which this could be implemented.

I’m fairly sure a lot of far leftists believe that anarcho communism is the stateless utopia after communism has been established and that there should be a bridge to get to a place where we can have democratically elected workplaces and townships. Something like liberal democracy>socialism>communism>anarcho-communism. Bernie could never pave the way to something like that because America has a very polarized voting base. I would argue that most of Bernie’s supporters aren’t true socialists in the traditional sense, rather young liberals that got so tired of being labelled socialist for moderately left policy that they decided to “reclaim” the label in a way.

The thing about doing that is that far leftists can actually co-opt these self proclaimed “socialists” and bring them further left. I would argue that the same thing is happening with “nazis” and the far right. If moderates continue to label someone communist or nazi they’ll eventually get drawn further and further to that ideology out of spite which is why we’re being further polarized. This is most apparent on the internet, especially spaces like Reddit or Twitter, where you have safe spaces for both of these groups flinging shit at one another without actually engaging in civil discussion about socio-economic policy.

I suppose that’s why I like the farms more than most websites to discuss or research politics. While I absolutely think that this website has a hard right leaning base there’s no reason for us to hurl insults unless it’s warranted by sheer re.tarded behavior e.g. Ashy sperging over Bernie. As a hard leftist it’s difficult to find places on the internet where people are willing to have actual discussion instead of spouting one-line praxis tweets at one another. Yeah it might be autisti.c to say it but damn I love this place.
 

millais

The Yellow Rose of Victoria, Texas
True & Honest Fan
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Ashy the Angel

The Cultural Marxist under your bed
kiwifarms.net
It's laughable that his first campaign point there is, "A welcoming and safe America for all" considering that every other word out of his mouth is dripping with venom for anyone who voted for supports Trump, and to my knowledge he's never made so much as a single effort to try and decry whenever people in red hats get attacked. If anything he just stokes the fire.
To my knowledge Bernie has never attacked Trump supporters. I actually tried to look up if he's ever done anything like that and this was the first article that came up:

Trump supporters tend to do this thing where they think an attack on Trump is an attack on them as well, which probably explains your weird fabrication of shit he's done. Trump himself stokes this by whipping up a cult of personality around him, tweeting out shit like this:

He makes his problems and flaws into his voter's problems and flaws. The red hat shit is an extension of that...you're no longer just a supporter, you're a walking billboard for your political views. You're willingly making yourself into a visible part of a collective, like decking yourself out in your favorite sports team's gear. Someone else's failings become your failings. Thus whenever Trump is criticized (especially on this forum) Trump supporters feelings get incredibly hurt.

He's been in politics longer than I've been alive and he's accomplished next to nothing. I liked him in 2016. I have no idea why I ever thought he was worth caring about, now.
I'd actually like to know what changed between then and now. I noticed in your critique of his policies you didn't mention healthcare. I guess you still believe in singlepayer, or did that go out the window too once Trump won?
 

Syaoran Li

How The West Was Fun!
kiwifarms.net
I'd actually like to know what changed between then and now. I noticed in your critique of his policies you didn't mention healthcare. I guess you still believe in singlepayer, or did that go out the window too once Trump won?
Bernie's policies became even more horrifying and his idiocy became more apparent post-2016.

In 2016, a lot of people (including myself) supported Bernie as a "least of three evils" because he wasn't a complete and total unknown like Trump and he wasn't an evil establishment neolib like Hillary Clinton was. However, Trump won and is surprisingly not as bad as we thought he was going to be.

America has not been turned into a Christian theocracy even with Pence in his empty suit position, the economy is doing well (unless you're a pretentious Millennial with a Gender Studies degree or something similar) and America is finally growing a spine despite the wailing of the Left.

I lost any and all respect for Bernie when he supported the Green New Deal.

Nuclear energy is the only way to effectively combat climate change. No sane person wants to live in the woke vegan socialist dystopia outlined in the Green New Deal.

Bernie is a grifter and you are a useful idiot, Ashy.
 

No Ma'ams Land

Read Sutter Cane
kiwifarms.net
I dunno if I'd call him a grifter. He feels genuine, or at least did in 2016. His adoption of the GND makes him a True Believer, maybe. He certainly has the support base of someone completely zealous in their ideals. That's why the establishment fears him this time around: his base, as far as I can tell, will not be a Blue No Matter Who voter if this doesn't pan out, especially if they sense any sort of voter-y shenanigans. That will be a fatal outcome for the DNC going into the general.
 

MrJokerRager

I like me some nice big boobs
kiwifarms.net
If Bernie gets cucked by some BLM niggers at a potential contested democratic convention then hk47 is right that he basically worth nothing. His supporters have the zeal but the man himself dropped cenk ugyher, shows how much loyalty is worth to him while Trudeau, Ralph northam and our very own Donald Trump have dealt with worse and still going good.
 

It's HK-47

Meatbag's Bounty of Bodies
Supervisor
True & Honest Fan
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I'd actually like to know what changed between then and now. I noticed in your critique of his policies you didn't mention healthcare. I guess you still believe in singlepayer, or did that go out the window too once Trump won?
I've seen how government-controlled healthcare works thanks to the V.A., I've seen how socialized medicine works thanks to French hospitals, and at a time in my life when I needed it the most, I was declined for Obamacare and left to choose between dying or paying for chemotherapy out-of-pocket. Every time that I've personally seen the government stick its hand into healthcare it's been an astronomical fuck-up.

Trump's promised to do a lot about healthcare industries too, but I never talk about that either, because actions speak louder than words. If he manages to do it, fantastic. If he doesn't, I won't be surprised. America's healthcare system is such a cluttered mess that I won't fault anyone for failing to find a fix for it, but I've also seen how fucked up healthcare is in other countries, and I wasn't that keen on the three-month waiting-list concept. Do you save a lot of money? Yeah. Do you risk dying waiting for a slot to open up? Yeah, and that's probably the point.

I don't care what politician promises to do what horseshit to what hospital or medicine, it's probably a lie. I'm not the slightest bit interested in what a politician says they're going to do, I'm interested in what they actually do, and Bernie can never decide what the fuck he wants to do. For example, in 2005 he voted in favour of the Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act, something designed to protect gun manufacturers from being held liable if a criminal commits a crime with one of their guns. Sanders' entire voting history was pretty pro-gun or in the very least neutral on the issue, but as soon as the 2016 election reared his head, he suddenly decided guns bad and he's only gotten more anti-gun as time has gone on.

I am an exceedingly pro-firearm kind of person to the point where I want the Citizen Marksmanship Program back in schools. I believe that every single person in this country of sound mind and able body should be allowed to openly carry a firearm and be properly trained in its use. I believe that firearms should be in every woman's purse because it's "the Great Equalizer" and one Hell of a fast way to deter an assailant. A politician that is not pro-firearm does not interest me because they're telling me that in order to be safe, we need to give up our largest means of self-defense. That makes no fucking sense.

People are more than free to vote for him if they want to, I just don't personally believe any of the hype anymore. Ironically though, Bernie and Trump do share a similar weakness and strength: Their voter bases only want them. This plays well in Trump's hand because his support inside of the Republican party is through the roof; he has almost unanimous support inside of his own party. For Bernie it's a weakness because he does not have a similar amount of support. Whether he wins or loses the nomination, he creates a massive rift in his wake.

There's a large pocket of people who will only vote for Bernie Sanders, and a large pocket who will never vote for him. Trump doesn't have that problem with the Republican party. His internal support base is upwards of 90%-95%.

"Bernie or Bust" is still alive and well, and it could very easily spell the death of the Democratic nominee, whoever that ends up being. Personally? I'd rather Bernie take the nomination. Joe doesn't know where he fucking is half the time, Warren has the personality of damp tree bark, and literally no one else on the list is worth caring about for me. Bernie would make the campaign trail the most interesting out of all of the choices, and I want a Bernie VS Trump ticket so we can get it over with once and for all.

Capitalism VS Communism let's fucking do it.

Beyond that, though, it's looking like the latest Veritas leaks are going to be putting a lot of heat on Sanders' campaign. I'm interested in seeing what else his campaign staff have been saying behind closed doors.
 
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