A real potential start to the American Civil War - What would happen within America during a retaliatory power outage lasting months during a Sino-American War of Hacking?

[Haim Arlosoroff]

America's power infrastructure was designed back during a more peaceful time when large scale terrorism and cyberattacks were simply not going to occur against a power grid. Much as when the Soviet Military cartographers created hundreds of thousands of maps and filled them with detailed notes on the terrain and infrastructure of every place on Earth, all nations today map their opponents in order to attack vulnerable secrets and doctrinal oversights.

Imagine the following facts are true:

• China and America have both mapped out each other's infrastructure physically and digitally
• China attacks Microsoft's email exchange servers and maps out American business email exchangers (internet routes from sending server to receiving server)
• One day China decides to slow American business dealings during a trade war or after a trade deal went south
• America hits Chinese hacker farms
• China halts Wall Street (on purpose or accidentally)
• America shuts down Beijing in some isolated manner
• China crashes the entire Western Interconnection Power Grid
• America intended to crash the Xinjiang power grid but somehow it triggers a Nuclear Power Plant located in Zhejiang China to go near catastrophic meltdown
• China crashes the entire Eastern Power Grid as well in order to stop the cyber attacks and disconnects their nation from the internet putting their navy to sea and their military on high alert.

A power outage on its own is hardly the end of America. However what historically happens to nations in decline is that they fell apart very clearly in the afterward history books but very covertly in the day-to-day society at the time. During the death of the Eastern Roman Empire, the Byzantine–Ottoman wars, there were numerous civil wars or disputes that erupted allowing the Ottoman's to seize many places such as Adrianople without even declaring war or suffering reprisal. Why, when the nation was being eaten, were the people more divided? This puzzled historians looking back only on the official accounts, but once modern research was possible a different picture entirely arose.

Byzantine, like America, had cracks which were thought to be mendable and not at all hopeless as similar problems had happened before and the nation had an invincible Greatness which had mended the cracks then and so would mend them again. However these weren't new cracks, but the old cracks yawning wider than ever before. Social issues which had been ignored and allowed to fester were becoming undeniable rather than new problems merging from seemingly nowhere. America has old racial and class issues not new, they are simply painted over by Hollywood, Journalist, and Academic agents thinking the people have no opinions but the ones they tell them.

America is sleep-walking into a period of world history where if pushed into a humiliation like a ten-week power grid starving citizens of fuel and food, suddenly new leadership and radical social and political directions become possible in the chaos and the aftermath.

TL;DR: Power grid very fragile, China goes boom & Americas really hurt. Big scary men take power then, maybe?

 

[Pocket Dragoon]

China doesn't even need hacking or an EMP; all they need are a couple crews with shotguns and/or rifles, and a few minutes of alone time around transformer farms or substations.

Hell.... there's already been a couple test runs in multiple states over the years.

 

[Haim Arlosoroff]

China doesn't even need hacking or an EMP; all they need are a couple crews with shotguns and/or rifles, and a few minutes of alone time around transformer farms or substations.

Hell.... there's already been a couple test runs in multiple states over the years.

Like with Racism and anger over Civil Liberties being curtailed, a severe power outage lasting a long enough time would cause people to shift their politics away from Washington and towards the fringe. I don't see Biden having a thought in his head, and I don't see it being about bulking the security around the power grid even after Texas.

 

[Pocket Dragoon]

Like with Racism and anger over Civil Liberties being curtailed, a severe power outage lasting a long enough time would cause people to shift their politics away from Washington and towards the fringe. I don't see Biden having a thought in his head, and I don't see it being about bulking the security around the power grid even after Texas.

The thing is.... power grids are operated by the state; the .gov doesn't have a hand in them other than subsidies for bullshit alternatives. It'd take nationalisation of the entire system to make any progress, and good luck with that, even in states like CA.

If anything, the obsolence & unintentional compartmentalization of our grid means that even something like regional sabotage or disaster still won't take down the rest of the country.

 

[Frank D'arbo]

Didnt you steal half of this shit from Southland Tales?

 

[Large]

1. The Ram Ranch cow boys take prince Henry hostage
2. Ram Ranch is under siege
3. American civil war

 

[Monolith]

1. The Ram Ranch cow boys take prince Henry hostage
2. Ram Ranch is under siege
3. American civil war

I won't accept any civil wars unless it's somehow started by the feds attacking the Tranch.

 

[DeadFish]

The electric grid. That what everyone says they'll target.
Look up the metcafe attack. Didn't do shit.

There are other ways to cause damage.

The riot thread demostrated that.

The entire Pacific north west had reports of arsonists setting fires. So a couple of retards were able to cause mass chaos with very little


There are other things if attacked could cause just as much damage as a shot up substation. Yet requires far more to get the job done

Someone mentioned in a thread (I think the gas bombing Xmas thread) they were thankful the bomber didn't attack a major fed ex hub. Rioters over 2020 attacked post office annexes. If those went down people would be just as fucked as a grid attack.

 

[Niggernerd]

I won't allow a civil war until slavery is back on the table. Deal or no deal.

 

[Large]

Anyways, here's a way simpler US destruction plan for Xi Jinping:
1. Stop giving loans to the US
2.

3.

4.

 

[DJ Grelle]

China doesn't even need hacking or an EMP; all they need are a couple crews with shotguns and/or rifles, and a few minutes of alone time around transformer farms or substations.

Hell.... there's already been a couple test runs in multiple states over the years.

A single marksman with a hunting rifle can do millions of damages if he decides to fuck up some high voltage power transformers. And that is just shoot and scoot. An organized campaign by a foreign enemy can take down the entire network. Losing a platoon of men in exchange for crippling your enemy for weeks? Any planner would say that is worth it.

The electric grid. That what everyone says they'll target.
Look up the metcafe attack. Didn't do shit.

There are other ways to cause damage.

The riot thread demostrated that.

The entire Pacific north west had reports of arsonists setting fires. So a couple of retards were able to cause mass chaos with very little


There are other things if attacked could cause just as much damage as a shot up substation. Yet requires far more to get the job done

Someone mentioned in a thread (I think the gas bombing Xmas thread) they were thankful the bomber didn't attack a major fed ex hub. Rioters over 2020 attacked post office annexes. If those went down people would be just as fucked as a grid attack.

Metcalf was $100million+ in damages, and they were (un)lucky that metcalf was a relatively unimportant station which could have its power rerouted.
And you're right that the electric grid isnt the only thing. Poisoning the water supply, drilling a hole or two in gas and oil pipelines, bombing railways that they're unusable, bombing bridges and tunnels, cheap, hulks of ships filled with ANFO and exploded in port (see beirut last year). Undermining levees, arson of national parks and other national monuments. Hitting internet exchanges, datacentres and seabed cables. A shooting spree on wall street.
There are thousands of creative ways of hurting a state. And many of them are incredibly cheap to do. Repairing and protecting those same systems on which society depends is waaay more difficult. Imagine if the government needs to pay to patrol and guard all those different types of infrastructure.
Yeah, the intelligence agencies and the security services will be able to prevent some of them. Maybe most of them. But for a dedicated enemy, they cannot protect against all possible attacks. And that is just from foreign actors. In the current societal and political climate, how hard would it be to radicalize some domestic terrorists and let them do it?

 

[Ponchik]

honestly i wouldn't be surprised if microsoft was directly involved in starting an apocalyptic Amurrican Civil War 2.0: Electric Boogaloo via sheer incompetence, it'd be poetic

 

[DeadFish]

A single marksman with a hunting rifle can do millions of damages if he decides to fuck up some high voltage power transformers. And that is just shoot and scoot. An organized campaign by a foreign enemy can take down the entire network. Losing a platoon of men in exchange for crippling your enemy for weeks? Any planner would say that is worth it.

Metcalf was $100million+ in damages, and they were (un)lucky that metcalf was a relatively unimportant station which could have its power rerouted.
And you're right that the electric grid isnt the only thing. Poisoning the water supply, drilling a hole or two in gas and oil pipelines, bombing railways that they're unusable, bombing bridges and tunnels, cheap, hulks of ships filled with ANFO and exploded in port (see beirut last year). Undermining levees, arson of national parks and other national monuments. Hitting internet exchanges, datacentres and seabed cables. A shooting spree on wall street.
There are thousands of creative ways of hurting a state. And many of them are incredibly cheap to do. Repairing and protecting those same systems on which society depends is waaay more difficult. Imagine if the government needs to pay to patrol and guard all those different types of infrastructure.
Yeah, the intelligence agencies and the security services will be able to prevent some of them. Maybe most of them. But for a dedicated enemy, they cannot protect against all possible attacks. And that is just from foreign actors. In the current societal and political climate, how hard would it be to radicalize some domestic terrorists and let them do it?

You are not going be able to poison the water supply. Water treatment plants prevent that.

You could cause water pipes to collapse. How that would affect stuff I don't know.

 

[DJ Grelle]

Youre are not going be able to poison the water supply. Water treatment plants prevent that.

You could cut off the water supply. Using same method you maybe could cause sink holes, make roads inaccessible during winter and cause pipes collapse. I'm just shocked blm antifa hasn't used it yet

Water treatment plants aren't secured very well and dumping just a vial of ricin or something else into the water can really fuck up a city. It's not the effective casualties, its the fear and the uncertainty, the emergency water supplies that need to be shipped in, the frantic searching and cleaning of the water treatment plant that is the real damage. Plants all over the country will be checked and secured as well, to prevent any other incidents. All that costs tons of money and is incredibly disruptive to normal life.
You're not looking to cause mass casualties. You're looking to terrorize and to disrupt.

 

[DeadFish]

Water treatment plants aren't secured very well and dumping just a vial of ricin or something else into the water can really fuck up a city. It's not the effective casualties, its the fear and the uncertainty, the emergency water supplies that need to be shipped in, the frantic searching and cleaning of the water treatment plant that is the real damage. Plants all over the country will be checked and secured as well, to prevent any other incidents. All that costs tons of money and is incredibly disruptive to normal life.
You're not looking to cause mass casualties. You're looking to terrorize and to disrupt.

911 changed that. Water plants are now protected by security and walls. That stuff went up fast once the towers went down.

No. Too much effort. It would be easier to bribe a politician to gank the money out of the water treatment repair fund. Neglect and corruption is worse then actual sabotage

If you only knew who they put in charge of these things and how duct tape and prayer keep stuff going.

No body cares any more or they're too short sighted

That's all you need to do. Bribe a politician for the right price, then get jobs for your folks. Bam! You're in. Don't even have to be malicious. Just useless morons and fuck ups. Give it to a diversity hire and no one can say shit.

Do it this way and the infrastructure will crumble faster then you can say "campaigns donation". Fuck the politicals will help and defend you destroy stuff if you bribe them generously and often enough

Do it any other way and you'll go to jail.

 

[Carlos Weston Chantor]

Another civil war will not happen in america. War is something that is conducted by men. There are no more men left in america, only faggots, fatties, troons, femboys, porn addicts and nerds. Whatever happens, all of them will continue posting on the internet and buying video games on "steam", untill they go extinct.

Then in a few decades niggers who inherit the land will have nice tribal wars, which will be like the cool african bush wars, and not lame like the american civil war

 

[Super-Chevy454]

Anyways, here's a way simpler US destruction plan for Xi Jinping:
1. Stop giving loans to the US
2.

3.
View attachment 2001612
4.

That's if India don't mess with Xi Jinping's plans.

 

[MelloYello]

Water plants are now protected by security and walls.

Protecting the water supply entirely is an impossible task.
Fire hydrants connect directly to water mains. A 10 bar pump would probably suffice to overcome the hydrostatic pressure.

Any state targetting the population would likely resort to biological agents, though, rather than chemicals. Those require far smaller dosage.
A tank truck full of anthrax could cause immense damage to a city. It's not a very realistic option for any state actor, though, the response would probably be nuclear.

 

[scathefire]

I think people who say that America is entering a downward trajectory are correct, but at this point in time it's hard to determine what the specifics of it will be in future years. That's why I find any and all "Boog" shit to be extremely interesting, because even if people's expectations are completely unrealistic, it's fun to throw around ideas of what might happen. The US has been a major, seemingly invincible (to anything besides the USSR) power for so damn long that we have a pretty poor understanding in our own lifetimes of what an America truly, existentially in trouble looks like.

 

[DeadFish]

Protecting the water supply entirely is an impossible task.
Fire hydrants connect directly to water mains. A 10 bar pump would probably suffice to overcome the hydrostatic pressure.

Any state targetting the population would likely resort to biological agents, though, rather than chemicals. Those require far smaller dosage.
A tank truck full of anthrax could cause immense damage to a city. It's not a very realistic option for any state actor, though, the response would probably be nuclear.

Pretty creative but realize this is the farms. Alot of people might try bait you saying such in hopes of you getting vanned. For a laugh.

As said mismanagement, greed and corruption are eating at the infrastructure. Ever seen venture brothers? Where the monarch breaks into rusty lab? Then goes into a spiel about how he can't do rusty in any worse then life has? Same applies here