Culture Alabama governor signs nation's most restrictive anti-abortion bill into law - "Unenforceable" bill designed to directly challenge Roe V. Wade

Dr W

Heaven is void of light
kiwifarms.net
Why shouldn't it?

The restrictions imposed upon individual states by Roe v. Wade wasn't decided by Congress, and signed into law by the President.

It was a donkey case, brought before partisan liberal Supreme Court judges. Much as this one is; the exception this time being the lack of a bench stacked with statists.

And beyond that, and the current shitfight everyone's watching, judicial term limits are definitely part of this war.
Honestly, I just wanted to make a joke about the Confederacy, not get into this shitstorm. I don't give a shit about Alabama's abortion issues, the moment they swing blue (and Hell freezes over), they'll repeal this law.

Just like how every time a Republican comes in he trashes the Democrat's law, and when the Democrat comes in he trashes the Republican's. It's the same stupid shit.
 

ElrondHubbard

Elrond Hubbard
kiwifarms.net
How are people so removed from the reality of their own bodies and the nature of their existence on this planet that they see not being able to medically intervene in a natural biological process as a form of force?
Getting pregnant and carrying a baby to term is as natural as breathing or eating. Intervening in that process with chemicals or surgical tools or even some forms of contraception is a deviation from the natural and normal. I'm not going to argue against abortion on these terms but the way I see this debate being framed is disturbing. It's the whole positive vs negative rights debate turned up to 11.

As far as the abortion debate goes, I think it's pretty fucked up to want to end a viable pregnancy out of sake of convenience to yourself. But also if abortion is on the table, who is to say that the baby might be better off dead than in the care of a mother with that little regard for life that she created. I'm much more comfortable with 2nd/3rd trimester abortions in cases of the child coming out debilitatingly disabled. Not a little downs, but stuff like Treacher-Collins syndrome, Goldehar Syndrome, Tay-Sachs, ect.

How this translates to legal precedent and at what level states should be restricting abortion, I have no fucking clue. I think that restricting abortion probably has more downsides than benefits in most cases but I don't have any idea where or if there should be a line drawn. I'm definitely not in favor of states directly punishing doctors or abortion recipients. There needs to be an honest moral debate, not a legal battle.
I sometimes forget though that I'm a man and I don't get to have an opinion on this. Oops.
 

Pocket Dragoon

For one-tenth a soul, or a sexual favor.
kiwifarms.net
So not being allowed to outlaw something just because you don’t like it, even though you’re not the one doing it and it has no effect on you, is tyranny?

Get over the damn civil war, Jesus Christ.
I never mentioned the Civil War of Northern Aggression Between the States.

Godwin's Law doesn't cover that, but it should.

Anyhow; if ruling from the bench by a panel of life-term judges, on something that wasn't enacted by Congress & signed into law by the President in the first place isn't tyranny......

I just don't see this as an abortion issue, as much as a first step to defanging the politically weaponised federal court system, which has been used to shit on individual States for a very long time, and not just on civil-rights or welfare issues; the EPA & environmental dictates from crusading federal judges are a prime example.
 

ProgKing of the North

^^^^FUCKTARD^^^^
kiwifarms.net
I never mentioned the Civil War of Northern Aggression Between the States.

Godwin's Law doesn't cover that, but it should.

Anyhow; if ruling from the bench by a panel of life-term judges, on something that wasn't enacted by Congress & signed into law by the President in the first place isn't tyranny......

I just don't see this as an abortion issue, as much as a first step to defanging the politically weaponised federal court system, which has been used to shit on individual States for a very long time, and not just on civil-rights or welfare issues; the EPA & environmental dictates from crusading federal judges are a prime example.
So your issue is that the states can’t just do whatever the fuck they want? The state making something illegal is more tyrannical than the fedgov making something illegal imo.

I think states should be allowed to legalize shit that’s illegal federally, but shouldn’t be allowed to make something that’s legal federally illegal, because that’s just tyranny of the majority for each individual state.
 

Man of the Sea

DUDE PLAYING A DUDE
kiwifarms.net
My biggest issue with abortion has always been the slow, creeping cultural aspect of making it more and more morally acceptable. I've always considered abortion to be tragic but necessary, but with a lot of these pro-choice people, you're starting to see a shift of them not only supporting abortion, but supporting abortion to the extent of glorifying the act itself.
 
So your issue is that the states can’t just do whatever the fuck they want? The state making something illegal is more tyrannical than the fedgov making something illegal imo.

I think states should be allowed to legalize shit that’s illegal federally, but shouldn’t be allowed to make something that’s legal federally illegal, because that’s just tyranny of the majority for each individual state.
Have you ever in your life made an argument in anything resembling good faith? Try it sometime.
 

ProgKing of the North

^^^^FUCKTARD^^^^
kiwifarms.net
Have you ever in your life made an argument in anything resembling good faith? Try it sometime.
I’m trying to argue in good faith, my basic argument is that making something illegal that people actually use is greater tyranny than forcing people to accept something as legal just because they don’t personally like it.

I get that for some people abortion specifically is different because to them it’s murder but I don’t have that hangup and am not gonna pretend I do
 

дядя Боря

kiwifarms.net
As far as the abortion debate goes, I think it's pretty fucked up to want to end a viable pregnancy out of sake of convenience to yourself. But also if abortion is on the table, who is to say that the baby might be better off dead than in the care of a mother with that little regard for life that she created.
One thing that is certain, people change in the course of their lives, people change due to events in their lives. There is nothing worse than a regret that you can't right.

I'm not arguing for or against, just saying. I don't know what's legal anymore. We make laws but states and cities make their own or simply refuse to enforce existing laws because enough people in high offices decide what to do about it. That's not even mob rule/democracy, it's chaos.
 

Pocket Dragoon

For one-tenth a soul, or a sexual favor.
kiwifarms.net
So your issue is that the states can’t just do whatever the fuck they want? The state making something illegal is more tyrannical than the fedgov making something illegal imo.

I think states should be allowed to legalize shit that’s illegal federally, but shouldn’t be allowed to make something that’s legal federally illegal, because that’s just tyranny of the majority for each individual state.
I think you're missing my larger point.

That the end result is a micro/macro example of "the state" imposing it's will upon those who don't agree, is not in question.

How such tyranny is attained is the issue.

The Constitution as written checks such things; but when a partisan Judicial branch with no term limits can effectively bypass the whole system and crush opposition, on the basis of a single case?

When Ivey signed the bill, without compromise, she knew that one way or another, it'd be kicked back to Montgomery by the Supreme Court.

Except for the stürm und drang speds screaming that this is an all-or-nothing fight NOWNOWNOW, the Alabama legislature was well aware they'd need to work out the exemptions later, or are confident that the Supreme Court will quash it wholly. This is evidenced that the bill made it to the governors so quickly, from a statehouse where things work slower than a junky grandma on a molasses diet.
 

Unog

You're a nog.
kiwifarms.net
So your issue is that the states can’t just do whatever the fuck they want? The state making something illegal is more tyrannical than the fedgov making something illegal imo.

I think states should be allowed to legalize shit that’s illegal federally, but shouldn’t be allowed to make something that’s legal federally illegal, because that’s just tyranny of the majority for each individual state.
Dude, that's how the United States, as a government, is supposed to fucking work. It's a federation of states, that are united. How do you not understand this?
 

ButterBar

kiwifarms.net
I’m trying to argue in good faith, my basic argument is that making something illegal that people actually use is greater tyranny than forcing people to accept something as legal just because they don’t personally like it.
I dont personally like allowing people to stone women for being unaccompanied by a man. Is that tyrannical? I dont want my neighbor cooking and selling meth from his home. Is that tyrannical?
 

Stoneheart

kiwifarms.net
My biggest issue with abortion has always been the slow, creeping cultural aspect of making it more and more morally acceptable. I've always considered abortion to be tragic but necessary, but with a lot of these pro-choice people, you're starting to see a shift of them not only supporting abortion, but supporting abortion to the extent of glorifying the act itself.
this is all just white supremacy! white woman shouldnt be allowed to abort! they liked slavery, now thay can have it! also the governemnt should pay for abortion of minoritys, maybe even give them a little bit of money for doing this great act!
 

MeatRokket08

Take Claridryl, and take life in your hands!
kiwifarms.net
I'm not much against abortion (only support in severe cases, otherwise I'm against it), but i am absolutely appalled by the culture politics surrounding the pro-abortion crowd. I've seen a lot of shit in my life, but the glorification of such acts--almost to the point they believe it to be a moral right--disturbs me greatly.
 

ProgKing of the North

^^^^FUCKTARD^^^^
kiwifarms.net
I dont personally like allowing people to stone women for being unaccompanied by a man. Is that tyrannical? I dont want my neighbor cooking and selling meth from his home. Is that tyrannical?
For the former, no, because stoning the women to death is a violation of her rights, and I personally don’t believe abortion is a violation of anyone’s rights. This is gonna be our impasse so might as well agree to disagree.

For the latter, I don’t wanna derail the thread with my opinions on drug laws so I’ll just say that zoning laws (which would govern your neighbor using his home as a business) aren’t inherently tyranny but are sometimes used for tyrannical purposes
 
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ButterBar

kiwifarms.net
Everyone sperged when I said that abortion restrictions could end up hurting children impregnated by pedos but I guess this happened https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/ohio-abortion-heartbeat-bill-pregnant-11-year-old-rape-victim-barred-abortion-after-new-ohio-abortion-bill-2019-05-13/
Sounds like a crazy case, almost Pixyteri like
Its incredibly rare and from the pro-life perspective you don't kill an infant if the dad turns out to be a rapist.
 
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