Disaster Brexit: "Technical terms" agreed - Chequers minus, as feared, or Brexit in name only.

KeyserBroze

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Sounds about right, i was watching Gerard Batten today and apparently someone forgot to tell him not to mention the war(s).

 

Ponderous Pillock

Perfectly Presidential
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What's great is the attempted spinning now going on to try and revive the plumetting morale of the association tory parties who are now suffering desertions as volunteers are quitting the party, supposedly en masse.

For example: definitely no rebellion against the establishment parties even though the seat has been held, but said traditional parties lost 12% and 8% respectively, while UKIP rose by 6% from basically nowhere to hold some 8% of the vote.

This is just shy of UKIP at their height of about 12-15%. Meaning, despite the Tommy Robbinson infestation and Batten desperately trying to keep his gut inside his shirt appeal to "da yoof" and all the cringe that entails is now on the verge of a revival.

In a traditional Labour seat, with turnout at just 37%. Meaning 63% of people told everyone to go fuck themselves.

Stunning ability by May and Corbyn to revive populism in the UK as a potential thorn in the side of the political elite.

But it's still "nothing has changed."

You can see that with the smug remainiac commenters in the article above too.
 

AnOminous

do you see what happens
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In a traditional Labour seat, with turnout at just 37%. Meaning 63% of people told everyone to go fuck themselves.
The problem with not turning out is you really aren't telling the politicians to go fuck themselves. You're telling them they can fuck you with impunity because you'll do literally nothing that endangers them.
 

Ponderous Pillock

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The problem with not turning out is you really aren't telling the politicians to go fuck themselves. You're telling them they can fuck you with impunity because you'll do literally nothing that endangers them.
Traditionally nobody bothers with bi-elections like this. So this is about expected for vote-share. When you get more national competitions to hand, the turnout tends to rise up. Usually into the 70% margin.
 
The problem with not turning out is you really aren't telling the politicians to go fuck themselves. You're telling them they can fuck you with impunity because you'll do literally nothing that endangers them.
Yeah, I really don't get people with that attitude. Like... you know they still get elected even if only a couple people show up to vote, right? And even if you don't vote, the government has the same amount of power over you...

It's like they think they're somehow de-legitimizing the vote by not participating.
 

turboNIG-3k

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https://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/brexit-cost-how-much-uk-economy-money-spent-a8854726.html

I especially love the little jab at the end:
All three figures contrast with the Leave campaign's claim prior to the referendum that Brexit would result in a £350m-per-week saving for the UK.
Look, I'll admit that the brexit referendum did cause level of uncertainty, which would result in more cautious behavior - notice that businesses are basically a side note, and the main focus is on household spending; mind you, half the population voted against brexit, and I'll bet significant amount of those believes in apocalypse-like scenario just around the corner.

Also, there is no link to the study in the article, so as far as I know they might be doing some creative reporting. 🤔
 

Coccxys

kiwifarms.net
Also, there is no link to the study in the article, so as far as I know they might be doing some creative reporting.
It's the independent so probably creative reporting. They used to be somewhat respectable but then decided to become the print version of clickbait appealing to the faux intellectuals and champagne socialists brigade. They even launched a variant paper targeted at the University student brigade. Then embraced clickbait wholeheartedly and moved to online only.

Also interesting owners there

Screenshot_20190406-000639.png


Politically they tended to shill for the libdems (including outright telling people to vote for them in 2010), one of the parties shouting the loudest about ignoring the referendum and just remaining.
 
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The big problem I (and plenty of others) will have come a GE is do I vote for my very leave supporting incumbent Tory MP or vote to try and create a leave party/UKIP government/coalition of some kind. My current MP is in favor of going no deal and has strongly voted that way so I'm all for the guy continuing but then I don't want another shower of shit Tory mess and voting to try and get a significant UKIP/leave party in the next parliament could well be splitting the vote 3 ways and ending up with the commies shitting up the place.
That's where strategy comes into play. It is really important for leavers to vote for their best candidate regardless of party politics. So if it's a good leave conservative, vote them in, if it's a remainer get them out. Same with labour, the parties will get the message. If neither options are present, just vote in UKIP, and force a coalition.

You'd still be fine because technically the leave Torys and the Leave party would both vote together against the commies. Or more likely form some sort of coalition government to keep the commies out in the first place.
Exactly, even if there was a full split of the two parties, then they just become a coalition party and boom.

Today was the first time I've ever watched a debate in the House of Lords. I had no idea how fucking gay our democracy is.

That said, it's made me feel genuinely glad that we have the Lords. They (like the US Senate) are supposed to act as a brake on the Commons, which is exactly what is needed at the moment. There were a few Lords who were quite pissed off with the Commons (that other place) assuming their bill could be rushed through the Lords. The Lords won't be rushed on this one.
I'm hoping that their filibustering continues. The biggest issue with our house of Lord's is that the political party in power is able to appoint peerage, which means that the majority that are made life peers are usually not above party politics, but ever so occasionally you get some that are, and it's great to watch them tell commons to fuck themselves.
 
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CWCissey

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Isn't this migration deal thing one of the reason why France has been burning for teh past 20 weeks? Like did Theresa May look at France and think "hmm i want some that rioting"
It would distract Parliament from the shitshow she's running...
 
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Ponderous Pillock

Perfectly Presidential
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Meanwhile, the Torygraph show how the party's rotting from the head:

The Conservative Party is desperately ill. Its lurid symptoms ought to concern patient and loved ones alike.
It struggles to put up full slates of council candidates, even in areas where it has long been utterly dominant; some activists are reluctant to stand and casual supporters refuse to sign nomination papers. Parliamentary seats which ought to be hotly-contested attract a mere handful of applications, rather than the scores they would normally expect. Social media is full of pictures of cut-up membership cards, and many who have not resigned are either rationing their campaigning, or have gone on strike entirely.
As the people on whom the party relies become demoralised, so the organisation as a whole teeters. The prospect of EU elections, or even a General Election, does not bode well.
The cause of this malaise is somewhat more complex than it at first appears, and merits careful diagnosis.
The acute illness is obvious. The Conservative leader was found severely wanting in a General Election, has lost control of her Government, and is in wild breach of her pledges to the nation. Theresa May not only lags behind "Don't Know" in the polls, but she has now invited the only person with ratings even worse than hers into Downing Street to work on Brexit.
Grassroots Tories are unhappy about May cuddling up to Jeremy Corbyn - a man she rightly argued cannot be trusted with the country's economy, defences or interests. She has managed to unearth a way to make herself even less popular, just when it was generally assumed that seam was mined out.
However, the Prime Minister is not her Party's only affliction. If she resigned tomorrow, and took her failed dilution of Brexit and newfound friendship with Corbyn with her, it would not instantly return to rude health. With a new leader who does radical things like keep their promises and enthuse voters, the Conservatives might shake off the immediate bug, but the Party itself would remain severely out of shape.
Aside from poor leadership or bad policies, the behaviour of the centre towards the members is a chronic and harmful condition. The unwillingness to trust the grassroots with important decisions has always been unjust. When David Cameron argued they should sacrifice some of their beliefs in order to win, they chose him over David Davis. Among some, however, a fetish for disdaining Tory members has caught hold, a shorthand with which to display one's modernity. Tory MPs point to Momentum as a cautionary tale, as though enthusiastic Conservatives are somehow as extreme and misguided as Marxists.
Members are not simply insulted, they are ignored: no say on policy; no vote on the leadership since 2005; not even a free and meaningful voice at their own conference. Candidate selections are now subject to "advice" from Party HQ - advice recently described to me by a senior activist as "blatant bullying, matched by patronising contempt", delivered with the subtlety of "five double-glazing salesmen putting their feet inside my door".
Tory MPs lament the lack of a mass-movement to rival Labour's. They are right, but they should not be surprised that an organisation which treats its most committed supporters so poorly struggles to recruit more.
We should apply Conservative principles to the Conservative Party. Excessive top-down control does not work for the economy or the state, and nor does it work for a political party. Accruing too much power centrally alienates the base and neglects the benefits of local knowledge, while micromanagement distracts HQ from fulfilling its proper responsibilities.
Before 2015, the Tories pioneered a model of training and empowering particularly keen activists, which delivered a majority and shocked the opposition. That advantage was squandered. The Conservative operation has withered, while Labour have replicated and extended its example. Corbyn allows his activists to innovate and develop, using Tory ideas, while the Conservatives too often manage their own operations like a big-state command economy.
Party membership should be more than the process of paying for the opportunity to buy over-priced tea-towels. The right of members to exercise a proper choice of Parliamentary candidate should be re-established. The next leadership election must be a contest, not a coronation, and the Party should implement Johnny Mercer's proposal that MPs should present members with a final shortlist of four candidates, not two.
The annual conference has become a press conference with a paying audience, but ought to be a venue for genuine debate. In recent years the audience has flocked away from the main hall and into the more interesting, free-wheeling fringe events where they are allowed a say. The lesson is quite clear.
The Conservative Party's problems have been flattered by the dedication of long-suffering activists, the popularity of conservative principles, and the emergence of the most unappealing Labour leadership of all time. Those factors are merely a window of opportunity, a stay of execution in which to try to set things right, not a permanent pass to continue mistreating the membership.
Mark Wallace is the executive editor of Conservative Home
 
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