Fallout series -

Damn Near

It's lovely to be here, thank you for having me
True & Honest Fan
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I had a lot more fun playing 1, 2, and Tactics than I did New Vegas. Way to fail to make me care about any character or faction in the game, Bethesda. That said, New Vegas certainly had its moments. Combat was not one of them.
 
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HeyYou

seriousposter
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I had a lot more fun playing 1, 2, and Tactics than I did New Vegas. Way to fail to make me care about any character or faction in the game, Bethesda. That said, New Vegas certainly had its moments. Combat was not one of them.
Bethesda didn't develop New Vegas.
 

Chive Turkey

kiwifarms.net
What the ave did you just fucking say about me, you little degenerate? I’ll have you know I graduated top of my class in the Praetorian Guard, and I’ve been involved in numerous secret raids on Hoover Dam, and I have over 300 confirmed NCR dogtags. I am trained in Legion warfare and I’m the top arena-fighter in the entirety of Caesar's Legion. You are nothing to me but just another target. I will wipe you the fuck out with precision the likes of which has never been seen before on this Earth, mark my fucking words. You think you can get away with saying that shit to me over that pip-boy? Think again, dissolute. As we speak I am contacting my secret network of frumentarius across the Mojave Wasteland and your location is being traced right now so you better prepare for the cross, fool. The cross that wipes out the pathetic little thing you call your life. You’re fucking dead, profligate. I can be anywhere, anytime, and I can kill you in over seven hundred ways, and that’s just with my bare hands. Not only am I extensively trained in unarmed combat, but I have access to the entire arsenal of Caesar's Legion and I will use it to its full extent to wipe your miserable ass off the face of the continent, you little shit. If only you could have known what Mar's retribution your little “cowardly” comment was about to bring down upon you, maybe you would have held your fucking tongue. But you couldn’t, you didn’t, and now you’re paying the price, you goddamn idiot. I will shit fury all over you and you will drown in it. Degenerates like you belong on a Cross. Ave true to Caesar.
9/10, should've said 'I have access to the entire arsenal of the Legion dropbox'.
So friendly reminder every time you play New Vega you play an incomplete game that is still better than any thing Bethesda can make.
This must've been mentioned in this thread before, but there's a great YouTube channel called 'TriangleCity' which digs through the game files and has interviews with some of the devs on cut content of FNV. It's almost depressing how much better this game would've been with a year or two of extra development.
 
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ExceptionallyExceptional

I farted in my hazmat suit.
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Also, I don't even agree with the assertion that New Vegas is that different from games like Mass Effect 2 in terms of investment. I liked the companions in New Vegas. I couldn't ever kill Cass and I've never been able to sell Arcade into slavery. They're that likable. And Lonesome Road made me like a robot who can't speak. Maybe New Vegas feels more detached because you can go off the rails and kill whoever you like, but that's a point to its favor in my eyes. After all, it's an RPG. Mass Effect hand holds you so hard that it sometimes gets annoying, and as the series when on most of the choices you could make boiled down to "nice guy vs complete jackass". Even then, I often never had problems doing renegade interrupts to kill people in hilarious ways, so I couldn't have been too invested. You could reload if you didn't like it, too.
I gotta agree. I actually LIKED the characters. I thought Arcade was a good man and I gave a fuck about him and his perspective. Boone's story wrenched at my heart and made me want to kill the legion all the more. Veronica almost made me love her like a dorky little sister, and her story of how she and her lover were ripped apart made me resent the Brotherhood's conservatism. Cass' story intrigued me, and also pissed me off as I couldn't help her kill McLafferty and the Van Graffs without fucking up the investigation.... which didn't stop me from killing each and every one of them in convenient "accidents" once I'd resolved the quests peacefully. God/Dog was legitimately a great fucking character and the "middle ground" solution was insanely satisfying.

Honestly, the follower characters were so well fleshed out they made the companions in Fallout 3 look fucking one dimensional.


I had a lot more fun playing 1, 2, and Tactics than I did New Vegas. Way to fail to make me care about any character or faction in the game, Bethesda. That said, New Vegas certainly had its moments. Combat was not one of them.
The fact that you didn't care about the characters sounds like a personal problem, not a failing on Obsidian's part.
 
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Forever Sunrise

Avatar? I don't need no stinkin' avatar.
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Also, I don't even agree with the assertion that New Vegas is that different from games like Mass Effect 2 in terms of investment. I liked the companions in New Vegas. I couldn't ever kill Cass and I've never been able to sell Arcade into slavery. They're that likable. And Lonesome Road made me like a robot who can't speak. Maybe New Vegas feels more detached because you can go off the rails and kill whoever you like, but that's a point to its favor in my eyes. After all, it's an RPG. Mass Effect hand holds you so hard that it sometimes gets annoying, and as the series when on most of the choices you could make boiled down to "nice guy vs complete jackass". Even then, I often never had problems doing renegade interrupts to kill people in hilarious ways, so I couldn't have been too invested. You could reload if you didn't like it, too.
There are exceptions to that rule. I'm mostly referring to the 'regular' NPC's. What I really mean to say is that there's absolutely no narrative consequences for killing everyone you come across who isn't directly involved with the main quest, or a major NPC in their own right. You can kill everyone in Novac, and nobody anywhere else will care. In Fallout 1 and 2, killing people was a very big thing that had immediate and serious ramifications. In the towns where you could go an appreciable murder-spree without consequence, the lore always supported those actions.

The Den for example was a wretched hive with zero law enforcement and a population of slavers and junkies that nobody else really cared about, so killing people there logically didn't have many consequences. I prefer the karma system in this one respect, because it could serve adequately in the role of general reputation meter. There was a sense that your actions were always impacting a broader Wasteland, even in very subtle ways.

While New Vegas does have some of that going on, it's not well-integrated or immersive at all. It's always very basic 'if you shoot X in the face, Y will have one additional line of dialogue, and Z will charge you more for fusion batteries' style cause-and-effect scripting that is transparent for what it is. The isometric games did a much better job of making reactions to your deeds organic and not making it obvious when you've triggered a script prompt.

Another thing is that the gameplay has a ton of issues that take me right out of it. The lack of NPC functionality is a major one, and is something I've come to find Obsidian as a whole has a problem with as well. As mentioned, you can murder every NCR trooper in a base and arrange their corpses right in front of their commander, and he won't even acknowledge them. This total lack of even a concession to reality is what takes me out of the immersive experience hard. You're never penalized unless you do very specific things the game is programmed to consider 'naughty', and those actions are disconnected and deeply unrealistic.

I had a similar experience with Pillars of Eternity. Early on there's a quest where you get to choose between supporting two people who both have a legitimate claim to leadership of the starting town you end up in after the introduction. The sitting lord is a bloodthirsty knight Templar who has been systematically murdering large numbers of his subjects out of a misguided sense of justice. The claimant is a sleazy politician guy who is up front about just being in it for the position. I decided very quickly that I hated the pair of them and didn't want either in charge. So after infiltrating the sitting lord's castle and killing him, I went and collected my reward from the claimant, then killed him as well.

The game, despite touting itself as having an extreme dedication towards the narrative, had no answer to this. I went back to town and chatted with everyone, and nobody even acknowledged my choice. I played for a couple more hours after this, but in the end I just quit. I couldn't get over that basic lack of reaction to my choices that Fallout 1 and 2 would've taken and run with all the way to the endgame.
 

Cyril Sneer

The Fuct of Pepsi-Man
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76 is better than new vegas.
Heh, just about...

I would have loved to have been the proverbial fly on the wall for the meeting where Obsidian hashed out the pile of bullshit that would go on to become FNV.

"All right people, we've got to come up with a follow-up to Fallout 3, but without directly copying the haunting "Capital Wasteland" setting of bombed-out, irradiated, Washington D.C. that did so much to establish the post-apocalyptic game world,"

"I know! We can set our game in the Nevada desert; the one place where you'd never be able to tell if a nuclear apocalypse had happened in the first place!"

"I like the way you think, Johnson!"

"Ooh, and we can make every other NPC gay for no reason whatsoever!"

"BRILLIANT!"

Veronica almost made me love her like a dorky little sister, and her story of how she and her lover were ripped apart made me resent the Brotherhood's conservatism.
I was merely left wondering why none of the Brotherhood had yet bothered to put a bullet in her head and leave her scrawny ass for the radroaches.
 

Dave.

Don't call it a massacre, call it revenge.
kiwifarms.net
Heh, just about...

I would have loved to have been the proverbial fly on the wall for the meeting where Obsidian hashed out the pile of bullshit that would go on to become FNV.

"All right people, we've got to come up with a follow-up to Fallout 3, but without directly copying the haunting "Capital Wasteland" setting of bombed-out, irradiated, Washington D.C. that did so much to establish the post-apocalyptic game world,"

"I know! We can set our game in the Nevada desert; the one place where you'd never be able to tell if a nuclear apocalypse had happened in the first place!"

"I like the way you think, Johnson!"

"Ooh, and we can make every other NPC gay for no reason whatsoever!"

"BRILLIANT!"

I was merely left wondering why none of the Brotherhood had yet bothered to put a bullet in her head and leave her scrawny ass for the radroaches.
WHOOSH
 
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HeyYou

seriousposter
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saw this image in a Fallout meme account twitter thread, curious what people here think

View attachment 1048758
The wasteland is cool, though, and the series at its best lets you draw your own conclusions. Really, the biggest theme you take from it is what it says upfront: war never changes (but men do). There's nothing wrong with enjoying the thematic elements, or the worldbuilding elements, or the gameplay elements, or the post-apocalyptic elements. People enjoy different parts of media, and that's normal.

I don't know what they're referring to in terms of "racism is bad", outside of humans hating ghouls and the Enclave hating irradiated humans. Fallout is mostly post-racial (and seemingly was before the war too), unless I'm not remembering something from the games I haven't played in awhile.
 

samuraicrack

General Coughing Cyborg Man
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The wasteland is cool, though, and the series at its best lets you draw your own conclusions. Really, the biggest theme you take from it is what it says upfront: war never changes (but men do). There's nothing wrong with enjoying the thematic elements, or the worldbuilding elements, or the gameplay elements, or the post-apocalyptic elements. People enjoy different parts of media, and that's normal.

I don't know what they're referring to in terms of "racism is bad", outside of humans hating ghouls and the Enclave hating irradiated humans. Fallout is mostly post-racial (and seemingly was before the war too), unless I'm not remembering something from the games I haven't played in awhile.
I'm not even sure where the fuck they're getting the shit about consumerism and American "exceptionalism" being bad from. Same thing with Classism.
 
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HeyYou

seriousposter
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I'm not even sure where the fuck they're getting the shit about consumerism and American "exceptionalism" being bad from. Same thing with Classism.
Nah, I actually see those. The world ran out of resources before the Great War because of over-consumption and from what I remember America was basically near-fascist before the war started, like forcefully integrating Canada and executing dissidents. Classism comes in when you look at Freeside vs the Strip and the Brahmin barons in the NCR. However, the series is far more nuanced about these issues than that image would suggest. For instance, Freeside genuinely is a shithole that's filled with complete assholes, and from what I remember the Followers get overwhelmed if you introduce anarchy to Freeside. The game does also make the point that patriotism can be a positive, and Lonesome Road is all about finding a symbol to put your faith in. For all its corruption, the NCR is comparatively much better than pre-war America. It's more like how America is now.
 

Slap47

Hehe xd
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saw this image in a Fallout meme account twitter thread, curious what people here think

View attachment 1048758
What is your issue with the image? These ideas permeate every aspect of the games. From the world, to the story and to the characters.

In Fallout 2 you're literally fighting against a parody of the Bush government and Heinlein's Starship Troopers.
 

samuraicrack

General Coughing Cyborg Man
kiwifarms.net
What is your issue with the image? These ideas permeate every aspect of the games. From the world, to the story and to the characters.

In Fallout 2 you're literally fighting against a parody of the Bush government and Heinlein's Starship Troopers.
The insinuation that saying racism/war is bad is something you can only notice if you ignore the roleplaying aspects of the game is a bit dumb.
 

samuraicrack

General Coughing Cyborg Man
kiwifarms.net
Nah, I actually see those. The world ran out of resources before the Great War because of over-consumption and from what I remember America was basically near-fascist before the war started, like forcefully integrating Canada and executing dissidents. Classism comes in when you look at Freeside vs the Strip and the Brahmin barons in the NCR. However, the series is far more nuanced about these issues than that image would suggest. For instance, Freeside genuinely is a shithole that's filled with complete assholes, and from what I remember the Followers get overwhelmed if you introduce anarchy to Freeside. The game does also make the point that patriotism can be a positive, and Lonesome Road is all about finding a symbol to put your faith in. For all its corruption, the NCR is comparatively much better than pre-war America. It's more like how America is now.
That isn't really technically consumerism, though. Consumerism implies that they care more about using the resources found worldwide to sell to people like in Pepsi ads or something. What happens in the Fallout universe is more about nationalistic greed. If it is about consumerism, it's a criticism of a very extreme type of it.
 
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HeyYou

seriousposter
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What is your issue with the image? These ideas permeate every aspect of the games. From the world, to the story and to the characters.

In Fallout 2 you're literally fighting against a parody of the Bush government and Heinlein's Starship Troopers.
I found it extremely difficult to take the Enclave seriously, and I don't know if that was intentional or not. Also, they made them far too likable.
 
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Slap47

Hehe xd
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The insinuation that saying racism/war is bad is something you can only notice if you ignore the roleplaying aspects of the game is a bit dumb.
The image was created as a response to Fallout 76, where dropping nukes as though it were nothing was marketed as a gimmick and where it was all about the flashy skins.
 
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c-no

Duck
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saw this image in a Fallout meme account twitter thread, curious what people here think

View attachment 1048758
I can get the game has themes and narratives but I just find it funny it tries to be deeper with war when it was pretty much just a backstory that got some DLC and explanation as to why you had the Wasteland. Also, everyone used all the oil, even those dirty commies. Pretty much led to the EU breaking down and all the Europeans invading the Middle East for oil. Also the wasteland itself is a cool setting to play through in seeing how one could have their character last before dying to something in the middle of nowhere.

Nah, I actually see those. The world ran out of resources before the Great War because of over-consumption and from what I remember America was basically near-fascist before the war started, like forcefully integrating Canada and executing dissidents. Classism comes in when you look at Freeside vs the Strip and the Brahmin barons in the NCR. However, the series is far more nuanced about these issues than that image would suggest. For instance, Freeside genuinely is a shithole that's filled with complete assholes, and from what I remember the Followers get overwhelmed if you introduce anarchy to Freeside. The game does also make the point that patriotism can be a positive, and Lonesome Road is all about finding a symbol to put your faith in. For all its corruption, the NCR is comparatively much better than pre-war America. It's more like how America is now.
Not even getting into America being near-fascist, the rest of the world went to hell, what with Europe invading the Middle East while China and the US fought for whatever oil was left, with the Chinese giving America the excuse to annex Canada.

The image was created as a response to Fallout 76, where dropping nukes as though it were nothing was marketed as a gimmick and where it was all about the flashy skins.
With the image being a response to Fallout 76, one can only imagine people taking it seriously in using it as a statement to Fallout 76 when most gamers that had interest in the game just wanted to have fun until they realized the game truly was shit and Todd's lies couldn't save it.
 

Begemot

What becomes of the broken-hearted?
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Will we ever have a fallout game based on Australia? Imagine radoactive emus, Tasmanian devils and cassowaries. Imagine scouting through the 19th century terraces in Fitzroy and then going bush. I know I need to go back to that decent mad Max game but I wonder if the Fallout series can leave the United states behind
 
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