GPU Prices - Damn those Miners and their imaginary shekels!

Status
Not open for further replies.

Done

True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
Intro:

I am surprised, maybe even amazed that we didn't have this thread sooner, considering that we have a cryptoshekels subforum. Also, this is the kind of salt thread that will ebb and flow according to PC part prices..


So What Caused the Salt?

With the recent surge in valuations, cryptocurrency managed to hit the mainstream awareness, and with it came the usual FOMO, which so far hasn't been deterred by the current drop in the crypto markets, this created a buying frenzy for graphics cards, because everyone wants in right now.

This created an incredible surge in GPU pricing for both NVIDIA and AMD, with some cards hitting almost triple the MSRP! (Prices accurate as of Jan 26th 2017).

Screenshot-2018-2-8 PSA Graphics Card Gamespot.png


It got to the point where people are selling fucking six-packs of GPUs.

This rise in GPU prices, compounding an already existing problem with DDR4 ram prices, caused a massive salt storm that is still raging today.


Let the Salt Flow:

just search for two or more of the keywords "GPU", "miners", "crypto", "price"..etc. And you will get something:

Screenshot-2018-2-8 gpu miners - Twitter Search(1).png


Screenshot-2018-2-8 gpu miners - Twitter Search(2).png


Screenshot-2018-2-8 gpu miners - Twitter Search(3).png


Screenshot-2018-2-8 gpu miners - Twitter Search.png


Screenshot-2018-2-8 gpu price - Twitter Search.png


This thing has also sparked a whole set of clickbait videos:





Screenshot-2018-2-8 (408) 6 GPU Mining Rig.png


I'm pretty sure you can find lots of salt on reddit, try r/PCMasterRace, r/Nvidia, r/AMD, and other PC building subreddits.

To close this OP out, @Null, @neger psykolog, @CrunkLord420, and all other cryptojews.. I blame you all for this.
 

welcometotherock

استعباد القلب أسوأ من استعباد الجسد
True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
Me @ miners tbh



Truthfully, I only really cared when I was actually building my rig and I wasn't able to get an RX570 for below $300 at the time, so I had to settle for a 1050 Ti instead. Now that everything's built, I'm probably just gonna wait it out before I think of upgrading the GPU. The crash in BTC right now should probably discourage new miners and hopefully NVIDIA and AMD will make new cards specifically for crypto mining.
 

proteus4994

kiwifarms.net
That might have just been for bitcoin though.
Some alt-coins were worth a decent amount and easier to mine, but apparently they're all following bitcoin off the cliff right now, so idk if it's worth it anymore.

Personally my favorite part is the dudes who are running their GPUs overclocked at full power for 2 months to mine cryptocurrency, and then selling them "slightly used" on Ebay for like 10% less than retail.
 

CIA Nigger

Not a fed, just a random object on the street.
True & Honest Fan
Retired Staff
kiwifarms.net
I laugh at PC gamers whining at the prices. If it's your first time building, just get something like a 760 from eBay for now, it can run a lot of the popular games at "good enough" settings. RAM's an issue too, but there's no scrapegoat for that.

Don't miners get like nothing even if they left their rig on for months at a time? I heard that it takes about a few weeks worth of mining just to get your money back for the electricity bills.

That might have just been for bitcoin though.
All the miners making shit have been mining altcoins (harder to build asics for) and cashing them for bitcoins or holding them.

Bitcoin mining died when ASICs became a thing. Once ASICs came out, that's when the GPU flood people talk about happened, as it became harder and harder to make money from mining.
 

Medicated

Pedophile
kiwifarms.net
I'm just salty I didn't buy in to it and have a temp controlled crypto mining room set up when I was twelve like some of the stories I was hearing. Oh well.
 

Boyfriend Coefficient

lim n → ∞
kiwifarms.net
Whats a crytpo?

Here is some salt
upload_2018-2-8_10-29-15.png

Sounds like profit to me

upload_2018-2-8_10-30-14.png

Is the PC master race communist? I mean one guy doesn't wanna sell his gpu to make money the other condemns greed
upload_2018-2-8_11-1-52.png


upload_2018-2-8_10-37-0.png

Ever hear of Vegas?
upload_2018-2-8_10-43-10.png

Might not need a top of the line one for that
upload_2018-2-8_10-50-31.png

At least craigslist is here to warn people
upload_2018-2-8_11-2-59.png
 

neger psykolog

moon goons for communism detection
True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
How can I "end up with nothing" or "lose everything" when I already used my cryptocurrency to buy pretty much everything I own?
:thinking:

Anyway, I hope these morons realize that the sustained purchasing of graphics cards is what leads to companies investing in making better products, thereby giving them cheaper/better parts to play their preorder games.
 

Done

True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
Anyway, I hope these morons realize that the sustained purchasing of graphics cards is what leads to companies investing in making better products, thereby giving them cheaper/better parts to play their preorder games.
Actually, manufacturers are very wary about this bubble, because they know that miners will ultimately dump their used cards on eBay/Craigslist, which will fuck up the market.

This is partly why they aren't going to increase shipments to retailers, because if the bubble bursts, they will be stick with a ton of product gathering dust on shelves.

The 2nd reason is that NVIDIA is winding down their Pascal shipments, because Volta is rumored to launch on March 2018, they already launched a Titan V card for $3,000, so Volta can't be too far away.

ETA: Gamers Nexus has a couple of good videos surveying manufacturers about it, watch the 2nd video if you want today's perspective:


 
Last edited:

NotoriousD

Russian Birthday Bot
kiwifarms.net
I'm not an expert on bitcoin but aren't GPUs used for mining heavily taxed with wear and tear and hardly worth anything? I usually buy slightly older parts anyway if I'm building a rig, though granted I still have to save up money for it or buy the parts one or two at a time. Don't need a supped up turbo rig, just something that plays games decently.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: Jack Haywood

AnOminous

But I'm not mad at anyone.
True & Honest Fan
Retired Staff
kiwifarms.net
Actually, manufacturers are very wary about this bubble, because they know that miners will ultimately dump their used cards on eBay/Craigslist, which will fuck up the market.
This will happen as soon as these brainless cunts realize the cost of electricity itself outweighs the benefits of mining. Because GPU mining is absolutely not a good idea at this point, even with currencies like Monero.

This also applies to people who are stealing electricity to mine, which a lot of these dipshits do. However, their parents will get pissed as fuck when their electric bill shoots through the roof and they find out their tendie devouring shitbag of a son is risking setting their house on fire while consuming 10 times the normal amount of electricity.
 

neger psykolog

moon goons for communism detection
True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
Actually, manufacturers are very wary about this bubble, because they know that miners will ultimately dump their used cards on eBay/Craigslist, which will fuck up the market.

This is partly why they aren't going to increase shipments to retailers, because if the bubble bursts, they will be stick with a ton of product gathering dust on shelves.
I understand what they're getting at but I disagree.

Inevitably without mining and industrial/commercial applications (such as machine learning and AI projects) they're going to run into the same problems the PC industry has as a whole. That problem is the same problem smartphone manufacturers are having and its the same problem car manufacturers have had for years.

Besides massive population increases and more humans getting access to disposable income and internet access once you release a good product there is less of a reason to upgrade. Once 2 and 4 core processors became standard, your average PC user (not gamers) had very little reason to seek an upgrade because their computer could do practically everything they wanted.

Same with smartphones, once you have the iPhone 634 and the iPhone 635 comes out, what reason do you have to upgrade (that's why Apple hates external storage, because it'd give people a great reason to never upgrade).

Remember in the past when you had to buy a soundcard because motherboard soundcards were universally shit? Turns out that the rise of USB sound as well as decent motherboard sound means that companies like Creative (who tried very hard to control the entire soundcard industry and succeeded for many years: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creative_Technology ended up being hit hard once soundcards weren't of that much use anymore)

Top end graphics cards cater to a market that is small. Most games aren't even able to utilize more than 4 cores. SLI? barely any games even support it. 4K gaming? Barely any games can even effectively use the most powerful graphics cards let alone two of them (source: I have 2 x 1080 TIs and there are almost no games that can even fully use one, let alone both, as in the game will cap out at a certain point because of its own limitations rather than scale any further. The amount of money/investment required to make games work for massive GPUs is probably worthless because almost no one has them and the majority of "hardcore gamers" generally don't even have much disposable income to buy stupid shit with in the first place)

Game developers know this and nowadays spend increasingly less time on catering to the "top end" of the PC market, because its fucking tiny and alongside sales of PCs has been on a downward trend for years. Developers and publishers care so little about "hardcore gamers" that even spending a few development dollars to put an FOV slider in the game isn't worth the effort when you can just shovel out shit and most people won't complain. I'll concede that in the near future it may be that games take a drastic turn when it comes to scaling with hardware but so far it doesn't look like that's going to happen anytime soon.

So the crying people are doing about cryptocurrency mining and its affect on graphics card sales? its actually crying about something that has already happened and has already made nvidia huge sums of money:

upload_2018-2-8_22-50-1.png


upload_2018-2-8_22-43-21.png

https://www.anandtech.com/show/10864/discrete-desktop-gpu-market-trends-q3-2016/4

With the affect mining and other applications have on the GPU market, nVidia can probably stop caring about the gaming market being a primary interest for quite some time. Gamers will get their cards eventually.

It's also important to realize the distinction between fabricators like nVidia and manufacturers (like MSI etc). I'm not exactly sure of how the money changes hands in that relationship, but I assume nVidia makes money whether cards are sold or not (if they didn't manufacture them). So I'm guessing nVidia cares even less.

It's a weird situation where GPUs only really got developed as much as they did because of gaming (that's debatable) and now the actual use and demand for them comes from other sources.

nVidia doesn't just make gaming GPUs though which is probably why they're going to take full advantage of cryptocurrency morons taking out 20 credit cards to buy graphics cards. I'd guess that their long terms bets are probably more in providing general purpose computing power for phones/consoles and AI/machine learning applications. Sales of the latest and greatest GPUs for actual gaming purposes are tiny.

EDIT:
Also now that Samsung has entered into the cryptoshekel industry (unclear if they'll also expand to GPUs) you can expect the current fire to only increase in size:
https://www.gamersnexus.net/industry/3225-samsung-confirms-asic-miner-production
 
Last edited:

CIA Nigger

Not a fed, just a random object on the street.
True & Honest Fan
Retired Staff
kiwifarms.net
Actually, manufacturers are very wary about this bubble, because they know that miners will ultimately dump their used cards on eBay/Craigslist, which will fuck up the market.

This is partly why they aren't going to increase shipments to retailers, because if the bubble bursts, they will be stick with a ton of product gathering dust on shelves.

The 2nd reason is that NVIDIA is winding down their Pascal shipments, because Volta is rumored to launch on March 2018, they already launched a Titan V card for $3,000, so Volta can't be too far away.

ETA: Gamers Nexus has a couple of good videos surveying manufacturers about it, watch the 2nd video if you want today's perspective:
There's another, more logical reason too IMO: GPU makers have to have some for all the computer manufacturers out there. Those buy up GPUs in bulk and slap them in gaming computers you can find at Micro Center. At this point it's cheaper to buy one of those than it is to build your own because of the GPU markup from places like Newegg (which have a "1 per person limit" on top of high prices to try to slow the influx of miners).

I'm not an expert on bitcoin but aren't GPUs used for mining heavily taxed with wear and tear and hardly worth anything? I usually buy slightly older parts anyway if I'm building a rig, though granted I still have to save up money for it or buy the parts one or two at a time. Don't need a supped up turbo rig, just something that plays games decently.
Depends on if you downclock it and cool it properly. If you're overclocking it, you're going to burn it out much quicker, regardless of if you're mining or playing intense Call of Duty matches. Downclocking has been a thing savvy miners have been doing as of late mainly to lower power bills.

I understand what they're getting at but I disagree.

Inevitably without mining and industrial/commercial applications (such as machine learning and AI projects) they're going to run into the same problems the PC industry has as a whole. That problem is the same problem smartphone manufacturers are having and its the same problem car manufacturers have had for years.

Besides massive population increases and more humans getting access to disposable income and internet access once you release a good product there is less of a reason to upgrade. Once 2 and 4 core processors became standard, your average PC user (not gamers) had very little reason to seek an upgrade because their computer could do practically everything they wanted.

Same with smartphones, once you have the iPhone 634 and the iPhone 635 comes out, what reason do you have to upgrade (that's why Apple hates external storage, because it'd give people a great reason to never upgrade).

Remember in the past when you had to buy a soundcard because motherboard soundcards were universally shit? Turns out that the rise of USB sound as well as decent motherboard sound means that companies like Creative (who tried very hard to control the entire soundcard industry and succeeded for many years: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creative_Technology ended up being hit hard once soundcards weren't of that much use anymore)

Top end graphics cards cater to a market that is small. Most games aren't even able to utilize more than 4 cores. SLI? barely any games even support it. 4K gaming? Barely any games can even effectively use the most powerful graphics cards let alone two of them (source: I have 2 x 1080 TIs and there are almost no games that can even fully use one, let alone both, as in the game will cap out at a certain point because of its own limitations rather than scale any further. The amount of money/investment required to make games work for massive GPUs is probably worthless because almost no one has them and the majority of "hardcore gamers" generally don't even have much disposable income to buy stupid shit with in the first place)

Game developers know this and nowadays spend increasingly less time on catering to the "top end" of the PC market, because its fucking tiny and alongside sales of PCs has been on a downward trend for years. Developers and publishers care so little about "hardcore gamers" that even spending a few development dollars to put an FOV slider in the game isn't worth the effort when you can just shovel out shit and most people won't complain. I'll concede that in the near future it may be that games take a drastic turn when it comes to scaling with hardware but so far it doesn't look like that's going to happen anytime soon.
There's something else that happened too, consoles became a thing. Game developers found out that more people will buy a game on a platform with no piracy and that's far more accessible than a PC (You'd be shocked how many PC gamers lose it if you have to edit an INI file or download a mod).

The Xbox got PC developers onto consoles, and they learned that more people buy games on consoles.

Also used GPUs worthless for mining (for example the GeForce 7xx series) can be found for low prices on eBay still, I got a friend one of those and all the games he plays work fine on it.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: neger psykolog

neger psykolog

moon goons for communism detection
True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
There's something else that happened too, consoles became a thing. Game developers found out that more people will buy a game on a platform with no piracy and that's far more accessible than a PC (You'd be shocked how many PC gamers lose it if you have to edit an INI file or download a mod).

The Xbox got PC developers onto consoles, and they learned that more people buy games on consoles.

Also used GPUs worthless for mining (for example the GeForce 7xx series) can be found for low prices on eBay still, I got a friend one of those and all the games he plays work fine on it.
Also only relatively recent consoles make use of GPUs (or at least what we call a GPU today).

I think the first major console with a brand-name GPU (i.e. a gpu from a company that specifically makes GPUs and doesn't just shovel out the odd one as an experiment) was the original Xbox in 2001. The first Playstation to make use of one was in 2006 (PS3).

All of the consoles starting to use nVidia/ATI hardware or at least hardware that is very similar has seemed to make a bit more of an even playing field.

It also seems like nVidia is starting to try and sell products to the mobile phone market too which will be interesting if it ever takes off at larger scale.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Tags
None