GPUs & CPUs & Enthusiast hardware: Questions, Discussion and fanboy slap-fights - Nvidia & AMD & Intel - Separe but Equal. Intel rides in the back of the bus.

[Just Some Other Guy]

I don't blame you but it's a pretty amazing technical achievement in chip making. The memory management and graphics prowess given the power requirements are impressive. It's the first Apple PC worth buying in a long ass time. I loathe almost everything Apple myself.

Sure they're great. As long as you do Apple stuff.

 

[The Mass Shooter Ron Soye]

Sure they're great. As long as you do Apple stuff.

What, no Asahi Linux?

 

[Judge Dredd]

And dealing with AV1/VP9 sources is just a pain in the ass, re-encode everything into something like ProRes or even TARGA for better performance(at the expense of storage space).

I don't know how long that will last. AV1 decoding is being added to certain graphics cards, and only time will tell if video editors start getting optimised for it. Even if it's never good for editing, for archiving it promises to be amazing, assuming it delivers on it's promises.

 

[serious n00b]

am probably going to pay for a 1980s beast keyboard soon instead, they had their own set of problems - short cords, an obvious lack of hotkeys or volume controls since no one conceived of them that early - but I am tired of having to replace modern mechanicals.

Here's how I have my media keys on a keyboard like that

same sped from /g/

 

[Smaug's Smokey Hole]

Here's how I have my media keys on a keyboard like that
View attachment 3330814

Same/similar except I use 4/7 for previous/next tab in browsers.

 

[Brain Problems]

I'm anticipating doing a build imminently either this summer or fall depending on prices. Is it worth getting an AM5 mobo or is that getting too cute with trying to futureproof a system?

 

[Cubanodun]

I'm anticipating doing a build imminently either this summer or fall depending on prices. Is it worth getting an AM5 mobo or is that getting too cute with trying to futureproof a system?

I say you wait because the mobos that are confirmed are the super expensive elite versions,also the new ryzens don't support DDR4 so you also have to get new sticks

Wait until they throw the cheap mobos and do the swap there

 

[Smaug's Smokey Hole]

I'm anticipating doing a build imminently either this summer or fall depending on prices. Is it worth getting an AM5 mobo or is that getting too cute with trying to futureproof a system?

What are you going from(CPU/motherboard/ram/gpu)?

My personal opinion is that DDR5 seems to be a bit in the dumpster right now, not in price but the performance you get for that price. Going with AM4 is a dead end but it isn't like Ryzen 5000 will be insufficient in the years to come from a simple daily use/gaming perspective, unless targeting 500fps in Rainbow Six Siege with the new Asus ROG monitor and RTX 4090.

I expect(hope) that AM5 will last as long as AM4, so that's good, but being a first gen customer is often bad and who knows how the first gen motherboards/chipsets will be like when faster RAM and who knows what stuff arrives. That's not a price concern, just laziness, swapping motherboards means reinstalling the OS and setting everything up again.

Waiting for extensive reviews and testing is what I would do.

 

[AmpleApricots]

Computers really have come to a point where they're a long term buy, not something you need to switch out every few years. I'm pretty sure my current Ryzen will still be a perfectly usable albeit old machine in 2030. That sounds far away I know, but trust me, it really isn't. It will not be the fastest there is of course. I think it'll show it's age mostly in power consumption compared to whatever is on the market in '32. I honestly don't imagine dramatic jumps in processing requirements where you literally can't do things on a machine that's ~10 years old, barring some kind of dramatic shift in how stuff works. I mean it's already not like this now. I could write this post here on a PC from 2008 no problem, and that's 12 years ago.

 

[Allakazam223]

Cue that Level1Techs guy showing off M.2 to U.2 adaptors (in effect, $30 'SS Drive cables') today.

I hate that I know someone somewhere will do this.

I'm anticipating doing a build imminently either this summer or fall depending on prices. Is it worth getting an AM5 mobo or is that getting too cute with trying to futureproof a system?

I would just stick with x570. Try and find someone who bought into the new chipset, and is selling their 'old' setup.

Also depends on your current hardware. One of my buddies just set up a 3xSLI 980ti setup for less than 150 a card, on an ancient FX 9590 8 core. Yeah, it's a housewarmer, but it does pretty damn well for what's inside.

 

[thejackal]

Computers really have come to a point where they're a long term buy, not something you need to switch out every few years. I'm pretty sure my current Ryzen will still be a perfectly usable albeit old machine in 2030. That sounds far away I know, but trust me, it really isn't. It will not be the fastest there is of course. I think it'll show it's age mostly in power consumption compared to whatever is on the market in '32. I honestly don't imagine dramatic jumps in processing requirements where you literally can't do things on a machine that's ~10 years old, barring some kind of dramatic shift in how stuff works. I mean it's already not like this now. I could write this post here on a PC from 2008 no problem, and that's 12 years ago.

Hardware has been "ahead" of software for at least 5 years now, probably closer to 8. Ever since they managed to slap more than one core on a piece of silicon and got ram prices down to where everybody could afford 8 and even 16GB and then the SSD revolution -- yea, it's perfectly fine to be running a i7 2700k in 2022 with an SSD and enough old DDR3 to where you really won't notice much difference for everyday usage and even some light gaming and video and audio production. Hell, I was still using a 2700k in 2016 just fine even for FPS gaming. Wasn't the best but it worked well enough.

These Ryzen chips will age even better. There's no reason a 2700x won't power through any sort of web applications out there there the next 5-8 years.

Personally I think the next thing that will produce a hardware race is something like holographic projection or similar. Games just aren't fueling it anymore, not enough anyways, and regular old office and Internet hell no.

 

[Judge Dredd]

I could write this post here on a PC from 2008 no problem, and that's 12 years ago.

14

Is it worth getting an AM5 mobo or is that getting too cute with trying to futureproof a system?

I'd say no unless you have something really specific in mind. At least in the UK, the prices of DDR5 alone make it unreasonable. £250 for ddr5 vs £50 for ddr4. You could buy a new mothertboard for that.

If you're willing to use the IGPU, then maybe go AM5, then get a GPU next year.

Has AMD committed to keeping AM5 around as long as AM4?

 

[DNA_JACKED]

So a power outage delivered a knockout blow to my 5 year old AIO cooler and it took me about 4 days to notice when my machine wouldn't boot from restart. I noticed that there is no hot air coming out of the top of the case even though the fans are still spinning. The CPU would throttle under medium load at 100c and never break above that to prevent burnout. I'm worried that I've damaged it but it's gotten 6ish years of use so it might be time for an upgrade anyways. How fucked am I? Intel 6850k.

If it boots after a cold shutdown then you just need a new cooler. unplug it, hold the power button for 30 seconds, then plug it back in. If it boots then you're golden.

I'm not sure if this heat ramp up is just the laws of physics coming into play as you try to move data faster, or if some node shrinks and better designs can take care of it.

Here you can see 28nm memory controllers in mainstream PCIe 4.0 drives and 12nm only at the high end:

https://www.anandtech.com/show/16183/silicon-motion-launches-pcie-40-nvme-ssd-controllers

https://www.anandtech.com/show/16703/marvell-announces-first-pcie-50-nvme-ssd-controllers

Don't be an early adopter of PCIe 5.0 SSDs and other new technologies.

The issue isnt data speed per se, its the thermal density of new nodes. The actual power draw of that controller is only a handful of watts at full load, but the chip is so damn tiny there is no effective way to remove the heat, hence you see these retarded fan setups.

ive a b350 board but it was never updated to support 5th gen. besides if i were to go 5th gen i'd pick the 5500 because its actually within my budget

5500 is garbage, the half cache kneecaps it compared to the 5600. At the price you are getting worse perf/$. Stick with your older ryzen and save up if the 5500 is your other option, go 5600 or higher if you ever get the bios update for it.

I'm anticipating doing a build imminently either this summer or fall depending on prices. Is it worth getting an AM5 mobo or is that getting too cute with trying to futureproof a system?

See above. Futureproofing is autistically pointless. If you buy into first gen AM5 expect to be left behind by future CPU updates. Especially when it comes to CPUs, they age like wine, CPUs from 12 years ago are perfectly usable today. Buy what fits your needs now, and use it for 5-10 years before thinking of upgrading.

 

[WULULULULU]

See above. Futureproofing is autistically pointless. If you buy into first gen AM5 expect to be left behind by future CPU updates. Especially when it comes to CPUs, they age like wine, CPUs from 12 years ago are perfectly usable today. Buy what fits your needs now, and use it for 5-10 years before thinking of upgrading.

This one genuinely depresses me. Everything I see I always think whether or not it can last 10 years, or even more, but now most stuff are so perishable that it is designed to make you buy stuff to make you poor. Technology moreso. I envy those who kept old CPUs, now some of us will be stuck with the "new" shiny stuff that will disappear and have less durability than past chips.

 

[DNA_JACKED]

This one genuinely depresses me. Everything I see I always think whether or not it can last 10 years, or even more, but now most stuff are so perishable that it is designed to make you buy stuff to make you poor. Technology moreso. I envy those who kept old CPUs, now some of us will be stuck with the "new" shiny stuff that will disappear and have less durability than past chips.

I'm sorry.....what on earth are you on about? New shiny stuff that will dissapear? Is your ryzen gonna go up in smoke?

My whole post was talking about how long CPUs last today and why buying a system to upgrade it in two years is a total waste of resources today. Somehow you got "modern CPUs dont last" out of that.

I'm guessing you took " If you buy into first gen AM5 expect to be left behind by future CPU updates" and somehow figured thsi was in reference to CPU performance and not that first gen motherboards will nto get the full range of AM5 CPU support, much like the 300 series AM4 boards.

 

[AmpleApricots]

14

That really hurts.

less durability

Were you around in the 80s and 90s? Shit would break all the goddamn time. A harddrive had an average survivability of ~2-3 years, then it was toast. (with normal usage) Many mainboards were incredibly poorly designed and had all kinds of problems, from buggy chipsets to expansion ports that wouldn't work at standard speeds because of poor layout or other bus problems. Same with expansion cards. Same with every part about a computer really. A lot of that stuff was awful. It just didn't matter as much as if you did anything seriously with computers, you had to buy a new one every 6-12 months anyways starting with the 90s. Also the instability that caused that gets blamed to this day on the OSes of old, no actually the hardware was often to blame.

Computers really never have been this good. Shit just works. There's no such thing as a graphics card that works only with 4 out of 5 games, a specific CPU that reliabily crashes with some specific applications, or a mainboard chipset that crashes in specific system configurations, or a mainboard where you can only use 3 of the 5 available slots and only if you put the cards into a specific order, solder a grounding wire to the back of the mainboard and say a short prayer while pressing the power button. If you didn't have to bring it back to the store because there were manufacturing mistakes and it just plain didn't work. (big thing in the 80s, I used to have an old 8088 XT board here where for some reason the machine only put bypass capacitors on one half of the board. It did work that way for the record but that might've caused quite a bit of instability)

In comparison, modern computers are downright boring. Shit just works. It doesn't even really matter what you buy from which manufacturer, you get pretty much the same base functionality, quality and reliability. People straight up wouldn't put up with the reliability problems this stuff had back then. There'd be lawsuits. Then consider the price difference, my first computer adjusting for inflation from 1987 to now (if google doesn't lie to me) costed about $3000-$3500 in modern day dollars. (I'm no finance whiz but that honestly feels like too little, in reality you can probably put 1k on top and are closer to the value of the money) It was utterly obsolete about three years later and had the value of a doorstopper in it's original 3k configuration. I'd get many ryzens for that nowadays.

 

[WULULULULU]

That really hurts.


Were you around in the 80s and 90s? Shit would break all the goddamn time. A harddrive had an average survivability of ~2-3 years, then it was toast. (with normal usage) Many mainboards were incredibly poorly designed and had all kinds of problems, from buggy chipsets to expansion ports that wouldn't work at standard speeds because of poor layout or other bus problems. Same with expansion cards. Same with every part about a computer really. A lot of that stuff was awful. It just didn't matter as much as if you did anything seriously with computers, you had to buy a new one every 6-12 months anyways starting with the 90s. Also the instability that caused that gets blamed to this day on the OSes of old, no actually the hardware was often to blame.

Computers really never have been this good. Shit just works. There's no such thing as a graphics card that works only with 4 out of 5 games, a specific CPU that reliabily crashes with some specific applications, or a mainboard chipset that crashes in specific system configurations, or a mainboard where you can only use 3 of the 5 available slots and only if you put the cards into a specific order, solder a grounding wire to the back of the mainboard and say a short prayer while pressing the power button. If you didn't have to bring it back to the store because there were manufacturing mistakes and it just plain didn't work. (big thing in the 80s, I used to have an old 8088 XT board here where for some reason the machine only put bypass capacitors on one half of the board. It did work that way for the record but that might've caused quite a bit of instability)

In comparison, modern computers are downright boring. Shit just works. It doesn't even really matter what you buy from which manufacturer, you get pretty much the same base functionality, quality and reliability. People straight up wouldn't put up with the reliability problems this stuff had back then. There'd be lawsuits. Then consider the price difference, my first computer adjusting for inflation from 1987 to now (if google doesn't lie to me) costed about $3000-$3500 in modern day dollars. (I'm no finance whiz but that honestly feels like too little, in reality you can probably put 1k on top and are closer to the value of the money) It was utterly obsolete about three years later and had the value of a doorstopper in it's original 3k configuration. I'd get many ryzens for that nowadays.

I'm sorry.....what on earth are you on about? New shiny stuff that will dissapear? Is your ryzen gonna go up in smoke?

My whole post was talking about how long CPUs last today and why buying a system to upgrade it in two years is a total waste of resources today. Somehow you got "modern CPUs dont last" out of that.

I'm guessing you took " If you buy into first gen AM5 expect to be left behind by future CPU updates" and somehow figured thsi was in reference to CPU performance and not that first gen motherboards will nto get the full range of AM5 CPU support, much like the 300 series AM4 boards.

I admit, I sperged out when I wrote that. I apologize.

That being said, I do still want to do my best when it comes to futureproofing whatever I buy. Make it last 10 years at best. Afterall, when it comes to PC parts, functionality, durability and mobility are my go-to criteria on what makes a component worth getting.

 

[The Mass Shooter Ron Soye]

I admit, I sperged out when I wrote that. I apologize.

That being said, I do still want to do my best when it comes to futureproofing whatever I buy. Make it last 10 years at best. Afterall, when it comes to PC parts, functionality, durability and mobility are my go-to criteria on what makes a component worth getting.

The performance of first-gen AM5 CPUs should be more than what most people need for a long time, although performance will improve faster over the life of the socket than it did when Intel was releasing tweaked quad-cores for the better part of a decade.

Other longevity problems could come from early adopters getting buggy products using the new socket and the heavy push for power-hungry and hot PCIe 5.0 on most boards except A620.

 

[serious n00b]

This one genuinely depresses me. Everything I see I always think whether or not it can last 10 years, or even more, but now most stuff are so perishable that it is designed to make you buy stuff to make you poor. Technology moreso. I envy those who kept old CPUs, now some of us will be stuck with the "new" shiny stuff that will disappear and have less durability than past chips.

Have fun with your "new" shiny stuff that will explode in a year or whatever. t.owner of 4690

 

[bigoogabaloogas]

before I make a mistake, can anyone tell me if I'm stupid for going for a 5600g instead of a 5600x? Reason why is because I want something that can post in case my GPU fails and I don't have to wait days before using my computer again