Holden caulfiels syndrome -
- Thread starter Molo
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Is he intelligent, nihilistic, and with a wicked sense of humor too?
holden shoulda been shot in the motel and the book ends
If he was a real person I would be writing a fuckin thread on him in a heartbeat
If he was a real person I would be writing a fuckin thread on him in a heartbeat
E
ES 148
Guest
kiwifarms.net
To be honest his last name looks kinda like 'cauliflower'
Anyone who acted like Holden Caulfield irl would be a lolcow.
He certainly has an done very lolcowish things
- Lies
- Tries to impress women like Russle
- Autistic rambling
- Fantasies about killing
- Breaking and entering
- Punches people in tard rages
- Pedo?
All Holden was is a symbol of rebellion not necessarily of the disciplined variety either.
Play BULLY, Jimmy is essentially a modern take on Holden Caulfield, except he actually contributed to the betterment of a small one-horse town (as per story telling rules). Even then he's a brat who hasn't changed his ways even at the end.
Play BULLY, Jimmy is essentially a modern take on Holden Caulfield, except he actually contributed to the betterment of a small one-horse town (as per story telling rules). Even then he's a brat who hasn't changed his ways even at the end.
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Christopher Robin
kiwifarms.net
Although The Catcher in The Rye is the quintessential "I'm intellectual and edgy because we read a book in highschool" book, it is still, a good book in my opinion. To be honest I'm surprised more people on here don't relate to Holden Caulfield's way of thinking, which is mainly based on the preservation of innocence in children and having a huge feeling of superiority. The latter we are all guilty of inadvertently or not by being on this site and the former I see all the time on threads about trans movements and such.
I remember when we read the book in a class in school. About 80% of the students hated Holden Caulfield, found him unrealistic and didn't enjoy the book at all while the minority of us enjoyed the book and could empathise with Holden and relate to him in some ways. I found it interesting that there was no middle ground, no one found the book ok, or Holden an alright character, it was very divisive.
I think Salinger was able to create a character that was relatable to a small percentage of teenage boys going through adolescence. He is a relatable character because the book is all his internal monologue and people can go "Hey, I think things like that too sometimes." , anyone who actually acts like him in real life is definitely :autism:
I remember when we read the book in a class in school. About 80% of the students hated Holden Caulfield, found him unrealistic and didn't enjoy the book at all while the minority of us enjoyed the book and could empathise with Holden and relate to him in some ways. I found it interesting that there was no middle ground, no one found the book ok, or Holden an alright character, it was very divisive.
I think Salinger was able to create a character that was relatable to a small percentage of teenage boys going through adolescence. He is a relatable character because the book is all his internal monologue and people can go "Hey, I think things like that too sometimes." , anyone who actually acts like him in real life is definitely :autism:
I liked the book when I read it but I also thought you were supposed to realize Holden is a bit of an asshole.
Christopher Robin
kiwifarms.net
I agree, he has tons of flaws, which is why I think that its ok for people to think "I feel like doing that sometimes" or "I think like that too" while not actually acting on them like he does. You would be a prick if you did, attacking your roommate because he went on a date with your oneitis and didn't keep her pure.
Also at the time Holden Caulfield was conceived in the original publication of Catcher In the Rye I'm sure it was "controversial" to depict children as anything other than god fearing good young men/women.
Which was its revolutionary aspect for its time, same goes for Tom Sawyer.
Which was its revolutionary aspect for its time, same goes for Tom Sawyer.
There was still that cringy edgelord contingent who thought he was some kind of pure hero, though.
Including guys like this.
Mark David Chapman, the assassin of John Lennon, whom he had a mancrush on.
https://kiwifarms.net/threads/most-a-logged-characters-in-fiction.33810
Holden is obviously angsty and self-important but I wouldn't consider him a lolcow simply because he's way too self-aware. All of his monologues are flooded with unsure wording and backtracking. His dismissiveness of everyone as "phonies" (instead of constantly thinking everyone around him is an idiot, for example) is clearly just born out of a sense alienation and fear and not any real feelings of arrogance. Something that he almost outright acknowledges several times throughout the book.
People who identify with Holden (especially teenagers) are entirely understandable but only if they picked up on the fact that Holden doesn't truly believe half the shit he's saying. The ones who don't are just kind of dumb. People who deem Catcher In The Rye or even Holden himself "pretentious" overestimate the transparency of the author's voice in writing and because of that just missed the entire point. Tbh that kind of thing is super autistic to me.
Not every troubled kid is a lolcow. It's like making a thread about a random bully at your local high school.
Holden is obviously angsty and self-important but I wouldn't consider him a lolcow simply because he's way too self-aware. All of his monologues are flooded with unsure wording and backtracking. His dismissiveness of everyone as "phonies" (instead of constantly thinking everyone around him is an idiot, for example) is clearly just born out of a sense alienation and fear and not any real feelings of arrogance. Something that he almost outright acknowledges several times throughout the book.
People who identify with Holden (especially teenagers) are entirely understandable but only if they picked up on the fact that Holden doesn't truly believe half the shit he's saying. The ones who don't are just kind of dumb. People who deem Catcher In The Rye or even Holden himself "pretentious" overestimate the transparency of the author's voice in writing and because of that just missed the entire point. Tbh that kind of thing is super autistic to me.
Not every troubled kid is a lolcow. It's like making a thread about a random bully at your local high school.
Darndirty
kiwifarms.net
Its funny, when i was in high school i didnt relate to holden at all and didnt particularly like the book either..now at 30 years old I can see that holden was right, the world is phony and good people get chewed up and spit out. We lie to children, about how the world is. Its a trap kids, stay running through those rye fields.
I identify with Bukowski a hell of a lot more tbh
That was the best part of the book imo. Not the things he went though or what he did, but his internal monologues and the harsh judgement of everyone he meets. Like when he meets the guy in the navy who he shakes hands with and describes him as "someone who has to break 40 of your fingers to prove how much of a man he is while shaking your hand" or his roommate who used to talk to people while he was using the bathroom like a creep. That was actually kinda funny for a high school, required reading book.
Don't you mean Stephen King?
http://lennonmurdertruth.com/
Holden Caulfield is just an example of the much older concept of the Byronic Hero -- someone who believes himself (yes they're almost always male) to be intelligent or in possession of deep insights, stands apart from society and holds society in deep contempt, and believes he is the victim of... just insert any abstract concept that come to your mind -- yet deep inside he is (supposed to be) sensitive and caring; he just needs the right person to unlock him.
It is not without reason that the world became tired of Byronic Heroes as the modern age approached.
This is something that always ires me: on what grounds can you say children are "innocent"? And are we protecting children by letting them preserve their "innocence" (whatever you mean by that)? My opinion is that the best way to protect children is to let them know about the world as it really is, the rules they need to follow in order to function as members of society, as soon as humanely possible.
It is not without reason that the world became tired of Byronic Heroes as the modern age approached.
This is something that always ires me: on what grounds can you say children are "innocent"? And are we protecting children by letting them preserve their "innocence" (whatever you mean by that)? My opinion is that the best way to protect children is to let them know about the world as it really is, the rules they need to follow in order to function as members of society, as soon as humanely possible.
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Puppet Pal Clem
kiwifarms.net
Guess I'm :autistic: because I empathized a lot with the character.
Still recognized he was a bit of a loser of course, but never understood the outright hatred and distaste for the character and book.
I was a loser too afterall. I felt those things.
I thought that was the kind of shit that everybody has some kind of phase, and like all people we grow out of but never entirely give up because it's necessary.
I think that's just a natural part of the ego, the inherent belief in ones own extraordinary uniqueness, which is protected in children and checked in adolescence.
Are there people that really never felt that sort of thing?
Still recognized he was a bit of a loser of course, but never understood the outright hatred and distaste for the character and book.
I was a loser too afterall. I felt those things.
I thought that was the kind of shit that everybody has some kind of phase, and like all people we grow out of but never entirely give up because it's necessary.
I think that's just a natural part of the ego, the inherent belief in ones own extraordinary uniqueness, which is protected in children and checked in adolescence.
Are there people that really never felt that sort of thing?
No, they're literally just a-logging a fictional kid because they're ashamed of their own teenage tism'.
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