If you are fat, it's your fault and it's not healthy (also, you look terrible) -

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Internet War Criminal

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One of the most annoying effects of the internet on society has been the rise of furr- tran- fatties who claim that their lifestyle is totally healthy, beautiful and something to look up to. They call it Health At Every Size, or HAES, and they refer to themselves as People of Size, or PoS (no, really). These terrible people are well documented in the community watch thread about them (and please go there for specific fat people mocking, this is not what this thread is about).

It's not a surprise that such a movement would rise, though. Today 69% of Americans are overweight or obese. Three out of four men are overweight or obese. Millenials are the fattest generation to ever live on this earth, will die earlier than others and those on the tail end of Millenials/Generation Z kids might even die before their parents because of it. Since the 70s, the number of obese people in their 20s has almost quadrupled.

Now, I realize that the title might seem inflammatory, but it is the truth. Not only is it the truth, but by far the biggest health crisis the West is facing. To recap:

1. It is your fault.
2. It is unhealthy.
3. No one looks better overweight than they do at a normal weight.


Before getting into the thick of it, at the end of the day there is only, and will ever be only, one argument at most in defense of obesity:

"I live in a free capitalist society, my health decisions impact only me, so you'll take that fifth slice of pizza out of my cold, dead, fat hands".

And it's true, but only to a certain extent. You can choose to be obese, but this is only an ethical choice if you live in a society where everyone's tax dollars are not being leeched off of the rest of society in order to be funneled toward the extra healthcare that will be required to cure your litany of diseases that will afflict you until you inevitably keel over face first in your last KFC bowl. If, however, you are unlucky enough to live in a socialist society, then you are being a drain on the system and the government should accordingly, taking more of your money/create punitive measures to stop you from being an added weight on the collective taxpayers' shoulders.



Your Fault

"It's unfair, I have a condition!" Yes, yes, we've all heard about how the dreaded thyroid/medication/litany of excuse explaining why someone is fat. And they are all bullshit. Having a thyroid problem is not something that condemns you to obesity. It means that your metabolism is going to be slower than average. That's it. So you might need to eat fewer calories in a day or work out a little bit more. 500 calories less a day than the average person means one less mars bars and soda can a day. Or exercising a bit more weekly than a regular person would. And people who suffer from hypothyroid problems tend to be women by a factor of ten, and mostly as they age.

"It's not me, it's my damn meds!" As far as being on medication, while it is true that some of them
can lower your metabolism, or create a higher rate of water retention, it is not a condemnation to obesity either. Only 10-15% of weight problems can be partly attributed to medication. Even as such, what it means in the overwhelming majority of cases is that a simple change in diet and more exercise would take care of the problem. And medication can create a fluctuation of 10-15 pounds, but it's not gonna make you suddenly gain an extra 70 pounds. That's not how it works.

"Well, my fatness is hereditary/my metabolism is really slow" is another common excuse, but it's just that, an excuse. Again, 10% of the population (overlapping with the first two) have certain genetic combination that predispose them to getting fatter. Having a disposition toward something only means that the road to get there is gonna be easier, not that you have to get there. If your parents are fat, and you are fat, it's not because fatness is hereditary in your family, its that your family has bad habits, and you are perpetuating them. If you go ahead and start eating healthy according to your body's needs and not cravings, and exercise moderately 3-5 times a week for half an hour, turns out you can beat your genetics!

"I know all that, but I live in a food desert/do you know how expensive healthy food is?". Food Deserts/the expensiveness of healthy food has been gaining in popularity in the last decade (thanks, Michelle Obama!) and is also completely untrue (if you live in America, and most likely the same holds true for the rest of the Western world). It's simply not the reason why obesity is so prevalent in poorer neighborhoods. So is the idea that you cannot eat healthy on a budget. Fresh, frozen or canned fruits/vegetable doesn't really matter. They are, for all intents and purposes, the same nutritionally wise. For $10 you can pick up 5lbs of frozen chicken breasts at walmart. There are tons of websites that will show anyone where and how to buy the best food they can get for the price

"I'm big boned". Actually, being fat is what made your bones big.

"I don't have time to exercise/it's too expensive to join a gym!" I'm glad to hear you're a doctor in residency, but why are you spending your 15 minutes of free time while on guard duty on the farms? Go to sleep, for fuck's sake! Incidently, 15 minutes a day of high intensity aerobic activity 5 days a week is the average recommended amount of exercise. 20 minutes of moderate HI aerobics (meaning you break a sweat, elevated heart rate and can't talk but can't sing) a day/7 days a week can also do it. Or you can split it however you want. 150 minutes of moderate activity a week/75 of high intensity. No need to join a gym, there are plenty of bodyweight exercises you can do/ways to exercise unless you're fully paralyzed.


So, at the end of the day, if you are fat the odds are overwhelmingly high that it's because you eat too much and exercise too little. Which can be solved by simply eating less, or exercising more.

But why should you?

Unhealthy

"It's unfair to call me unhealthy. I haven't gone to the doctors in years, I'm always up for a game of ultimate Frisbee and I don't get winded up when I go up a flight of stairs. I'm perfectly healthy!".

One of the problems with the current health epidemic is the myth that currently not being sick is the same as being healthy. When you are overweight or obese, you are not healthy. Doesn't mean you are sick, of course. At one point, however, these will catch up with you and you will become unhealthy. People who are obese yet considered 'healthy' all increasingly become unhealthy the more they age, until they all end up unhealthy and plagued with various health problems.

It might take a couple of decades, but it will catch up on you. What will? Well...

* High blood pressure/Hypertension
* Irregular cholesterol/tryglycerides
* Coronary heart disease
* Type 2 diabetes
* Sleep apnea
* Breathing problems
* Joint problems leading to osteoarthritis
* Constant pain
* Infertility
* Gallbladder disease
* Strokes
* Cancer
* Depression, anxiety and a host of other mental illnesses

to name some of them. The fatter you are/the longer you are fat, the higher likelyhood you will start collecting those like some kind of medical pokemons.

Remember what I said about ethical obesity re:not being a burden on society? Well, the healthcare costs related to obesity are between $200-250 billion dollars a year in America. It's equivalent to 25% of all healthcare resources in America being directed toward obesity.

Want to live longer and better? Want more money? Dream of affordable healthcare for everyone? Well, obesity is the single biggest obstacle to all of this.


Fat Is (Not) Beautiful

A point that has been hammered over and over again by HAES advocates is that 'Fat is Beautiful' and you should love your body. Now, that first one can be abbreviated as fib, which is pretty convenient since that's exactly what it is. As far as loving your body, you should, but by treating it in such a unhealthy manner you're basically the equivalent of an abusive spouse. 'I hit you because I love you'. Indulging in every fat and sugary craving while having a completely non-active lifestyle is not liking your body, it's being a slave to your every whims and not acting responsibly. If you love your body, you will treat it properly.

And if you want others to love your body, start by loving yourself first.

Glamour magazine just published an issue celebrating 'Plus Size' women as beautiful, and included in their list Amy Schumer. That backfired, and showed the

I think there's nothing wrong with being plus size. Beautiful healthy women. Plus size is considered size 16 in America. I go between a size 6 and an 8. @glamourmag put me in their plus size only issue without asking or letting me know and it doesn't feel right to me. Young girls seeing my body type thinking that is plus size? What are your thoughts? Mine are not cool glamour not glamourous

'There's nothing wrong with being fat BUT DON'T CALL ME THAT'. It's common for people to have a distorted perception of themselves and think they are not fat. In fact the vast majority of obese people think they are merely overweight. It's common to see people who easily need to shed 60lbs+ think that they only need to lose maybe 20lb. Some of them, like Amy Schumer, will be in complete denial over the fact that they are in fact overweight or obese.

One of the big problems is that we've now reached the point where the majority are obese or overweight, so they look up at the morbidly obese and think those are the ones who have a problem, not them. Their perceptions are so skewed about what healthy is that they see no problem with themselves.

Well, to a certain point because when it comes to others, that's when they get critical. One of the biggest point that the HAES movement pushes is that is that they deserve love too, but if you look at their blogs and tumblrs, they don't look for/wish for partners who share their BMI, it's always fit and attractive people they are into.

Some people will point out that certain sculptures of fat women were made, and extrapolate from that that it used to be the beauty standard of the time, ignoring the fact that throughout human history most paintings and sculptures were of normal weight individuals and not morbidly obese out of shape people.

At the end of the day, being overweight or obese is unealthy, a sign that you don't care about yourself or others, and not attractive to the vast majority of people who are not fetishists.


The solution to this pandemic?

It's pretty paradoxical, but it's never been easier to lose weight and lead a healthy lifestyle. I started going to the gym 20 years ago, and you had to write everything down, use complicated mathematical equations from books to figure shit out and keep a food journal with you to write all of it down to find your macros. For advice, you had to rely on common bro facts when bro science was in its infancy and believed ridiculous bro myths like 'eat smaller meals 6 times a day to boost your metabolism, bro!'.

Today? Thanks to the internet you can make calculations about exactly how much you need daily, download apps that will even scan food labels and catalog what you eat for you, there are tons of communities online geared toward helping people start working out with tons of great resources, show their success to motivate others and make them realize that they too can do it, and find ways to avoid paying anything in order to exercise. The Farms even has a weight loss support thread (just disregard everything Katsu says about fitness or diet).

If you're fat, please start taking care of yourself. If you're not fat, take care of your fat friends and direct them the right way. The last thing we need as a society is to keep lying to ourselves as our population gets worse off. The human body is incredible when you take care of it, no matter what age or your situation. So incredible a 78 year old lady can go from struggling getting up from her chair to deadlifting 225lbs in a few months:


So, what's stopping you?
 
X

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And medication can create a fluctuation of 10-15 pounds, but it's not gonna make you suddenly gain an extra 70 pounds. That's not how it works.

Actually that is how some medications work. Put someone on the maximum allowable dose of Abilify and a rapid weight gain of 70+ pounds is one of the more likely symptoms. Anti-psychotics are also notorious for massive weight gain. Medication can fuck up your body which is one of the reasons why it's important for doctors to monitor their patients when prescribing new meds.
 

Internet War Criminal

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Actually that is how some medications work. Put someone on the maximum allowable dose of Abilify and a rapid weight gain of 70+ pounds is one of the more likely symptoms. Anti-psychotics are also notorious for massive weight gain. Medication can fuck up your body which is one of the reasons why it's important for doctors to monitor their patients when prescribing new meds.

They can lead to some weight gain if you don't adjust your lifestyle, but if you balloon up with an extra 70 pounds its because you ate too much crap and didn't exercise enough. Thats what pretty much all studies looking into it have found. This one is behind a paywall, but yeah the cached version should work.
 

Marvin

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There's a big mix of facts and value judgements in your post.

Fat pride people are dipshits, obviously. There's nothing inherently better about being fat, and as you note, there are lots of serious downsides.

My big issue with the knee jerk reaction to the fat pride dipshits is the health aspect. Certainly fat people have health problems, but so does everyone else. Fat people merely have a health issue that's more visible. And certainly, some health issues are worse than others. I'm not excusing obesity. Clearly that's worse than most health issues.

But even slightly overweight people get the stink eye from people, when at the same time they're surrounded by smokers and alcoholics and drug addicts. (Not that there's anything wrong with those things.)

So the health aspect argument, without qualification (say, limit it to severely overweight/obese people), harps on who are on par with plenty of thin Americans, who just happen to have an addiction to tobacco instead of food.
3. No one looks better overweight than they do at a normal weight.
This is very much incorrect.

There's no reason to artificially love your body, if you really don't love it. But plenty of people will genuinely prefer larger partners. Fat distribution is very important. There are lots of people who probably technically cross into being overweight, according to BMI, but their body shape (and looks in general) make it work. Many of them would look worse if they were a normal weight.
 
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They can lead to some weight gain if you don't adjust your lifestyle, but if you balloon up with an extra 70 pounds its because you ate too much crap and didn't exercise enough. Thats what pretty much all studies looking into it have found. This one is behind a paywall, but yeah the cached version should work.

Both of which are a direct result of the medication increasing your appetite to ridiculous amounts and imposing lethargy at the same time. Just look at the NIMH list of the potential side effects for antipsychotics. None of them are pretty, but note that both drowsiness and weight gain are on there. It's difficult to get to the gym when your medication knocks you out for most of the day.
 

AnOminous

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"I live in a free capitalist society, my health decisions impact only me, so you'll take that fifth slice of pizza out of my cold, dead, fat hands".

And it's true, but only to a certain extent. You can choose to be obese, but this is only an ethical choice if you live in a society where everyone's tax dollars are not being leeched off of the rest of society in order to be funneled toward the extra healthcare that will be required to cure your litany of diseases that will afflict you until you inevitably keel over face first in your last KFC bowl. If, however, you are unlucky enough to live in a socialist society, then you are being a drain on the system and the government should accordingly, taking more of your money/create punitive measures to stop you from being an added weight on the collective taxpayers' shoulders.

This is a reasonable moral argument, but if we start having a nanny state choosing what people are allowed to do based on reasoning like this, outlawing motorcycles, guns, any sport more dangerous than tiddlywinks, smoking, drinking, and pretty much all forms of fun are going to be subject to being outlawed.

After all, almost all industrialized societies, including the U.S., are "socialist" enough that we're going to be sharing pooled risks and the costs for them, and while I think in theory that to some extent, people should pay for their own risks (I don't have an issue with smokers paying more for insurance for instance if you subtract out the crap they're already taxed for), it doesn't really give society the right to tell you what you can and can't do.

(It also doesn't give society the right to say you can't call a fat fuck a fat fuck and point out their behavior is unhealthy, either.)
 

Sperglord Dante

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After all, almost all industrialized societies, including the U.S., are "socialist" enough that we're going to be sharing pooled risks and the costs for them, and while I think in theory that to some extent, people should pay for their own risks (I don't have an issue with smokers paying more for insurance for instance if you subtract out the crap they're already taxed for), it doesn't really give society the right to tell you what you can and can't do.
Filtering people out of of a socialized health care system is the easiest thing in the world. You just have to make autonomous branches to deal with specific issues (eg heart problems, diabetes) under the pretext of offering better care in specialized hospitals and then keep those deliberately underfunded. Bam, problem solved!
 
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Internet War Criminal

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My big issue with the knee jerk reaction to the fat pride dipshits is the health aspect. Certainly fat people have health problems, but so does everyone else. Fat people merely have a health issue that's more visible. And certainly, some health issues are worse than others. I'm not excusing obesity. Clearly that's worse than most health issues.

But even slightly overweight people get the stink eye from people, when at the same time they're surrounded by smokers and alcoholics and drug addicts. (Not that there's anything wrong with those things.)

So the health aspect argument, without qualification (say, limit it to severely overweight/obese people), harps on who are on par with plenty of thin Americans, who just happen to have an addiction to tobacco instead of food.

This is a classic line I see all the time from HAES. 'Yeah, but what about smokers/alcoholics/drug addicts who are thin?'

How does that even make sense? Being overweight or obese is a health issue, so is being a smoker, or an alcoholic or a drug addict. You virtually can't smoke in public settings anymore, smokers are vilified all over the media, when's the last time you saw a character on television or in a movie smoke and it's seen as something positive or good? When's the last time being a drunk or a drug addict glorified? Whenever you see a "good" guy on a tv show or a movie who struggles with alcohol or drugs, it's always to give them a dark side.

Alcoholism is seen as a terrible thing by virtually everyone, same with drug addiction and pretty much the same with cigarettes, even smokers themselves. How many smokers do you know who are not complaining about how they want to stop?

Popular culture and the general view of society is that all of those things are terrible for you. In fact society comes down a lot harder on smokers, alcoholics and drug addicts as they do overweight and obese people. For HAES or overweight/obese people in general to point at them is just to use them as a shield.

This is very much incorrect.

There's no reason to artificially love your body, if you really don't love it. But plenty of people will genuinely prefer larger partners. Fat distribution is very important. There are lots of people who probably technically cross into being overweight, according to BMI, but their body shape (and looks in general) make it work. Many of them would look worse if they were a normal weight.

'Technically' overweight means what? Possibly 5 pounds more than their healthy weight? That's not the people we are talking about here. BMI is not a perfect science, and that's why I didn't bring it up.

Both of which are a direct result of the medication increasing your appetite to ridiculous amounts and imposing lethargy at the same time. Just look at the NIMH list of the potential side effects for antipsychotics. None of them are pretty, but note that both drowsiness and weight gain are on there. It's difficult to get to the gym when your medication knocks you out for most of the day.

And yet doctors have found that although these side effects suck, there are ways to manage them and not gain weight so, as I said, it's not the medication that makes you gain weight but rather the choices/lifestyle decisions you make.

That medication is making it worse for you, yes, but it's not sentencing you to obesity just makes it a bit harder for you to gain up to 10 or so pounds over a year, on average.

To be fair, some people are born with Glandular problems or whatever you call it so they bloat out to insane weights naturally

Yeah I pointed out in the OP its a myth

This is a reasonable moral argument, but if we start having a nanny state choosing what people are allowed to do based on reasoning like this, outlawing motorcycles, guns, any sport more dangerous than tiddlywinks, smoking, drinking, and pretty much all forms of fun are going to be subject to being outlawed.

After all, almost all industrialized societies, including the U.S., are "socialist" enough that we're going to be sharing pooled risks and the costs for them, and while I think in theory that to some extent, people should pay for their own risks (I don't have an issue with smokers paying more for insurance for instance if you subtract out the crap they're already taxed for), it doesn't really give society the right to tell you what you can and can't do.

(It also doesn't give society the right to say you can't call a fat fuck a fat fuck and point out their behavior is unhealthy, either.)

Yeah I agree that the nanny state shouldn't start outlawing any of these things. People should have a right to engage in behaviors that harm themselves. However if these behaviors end up being a drain on the system, I do think that it's fair to demand that they pay more.

If someone really fat has to pay for two seats when he gets on a plane, why should he be paying the same % of his taxes toward healthcare as the rest of us who go to the gym and never need to go to the hospital should? Same for smokers, etc... If I'm gonna be paying for your cancer later on, you better be chipping in more than I am.
 

Marvin

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This is a classic line I see all the time from HAES. 'Yeah, but what about smokers/alcoholics/drug addicts who are thin?'

How does that even make sense? Being overweight or obese is a health issue, so is being a smoker, or an alcoholic or a drug addict. You virtually can't smoke in public settings anymore, smokers are vilified all over the media, when's the last time you saw a character on television or in a movie smoke and it's seen as something positive or good? When's the last time being a drunk or a drug addict glorified? Whenever you see a "good" guy on a tv show or a movie who struggles with alcohol or drugs, it's always to give them a dark side.

Alcoholism is seen as a terrible thing by virtually everyone, same with drug addiction and pretty much the same with cigarettes, even smokers themselves. How many smokers do you know who are not complaining about how they want to stop?

Popular culture and the general view of society is that all of those things are terrible for you. In fact society comes down a lot harder on smokers, alcoholics and drug addicts as they do overweight and obese people. For HAES or overweight/obese people in general to point at them is just to use them as a shield.
When they put down their vice, they look like everyone else. I'm not complaining about general commentary on obesity. That's a conversation we need to have. I'm talking about interacting with people on a personal level.

Pointing at one specific fat person on the street and thinking "you fat motherfucker, you're so unhealthy" is super shitty. You're surrounded by unhealthy people, that's just the only person who has their vice stamped on their forehead.
'Technically' overweight means what? Possibly 5 pounds more than their healthy weight? That's not the people we are talking about here. BMI is not a perfect science, and that's why I didn't bring it up.
Perhaps 30 pounds (or more) overweight, according to BMI.
 

Internet War Criminal

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Perhaps 30 pounds (or more) overweight, according to BMI.

If someone is 30 pounds or more over their healthy weight, unless they happen to be either 1) in great shape 2) over 6'0" then they are either borderline obese or straight up obese at this point. No 'distribution of mass' is gonna change anything like that.

See the link I posted above about people's perception being skewed versus reality. Same thing with our loved ones, you have parents who see their severely obese children as having 'puppy fat', or people who don't realize their boyfriend/girlfriend need to lose 60 pounds, not 10, to reach a healthy weight.

When they put down their vice, they look like everyone else. I'm not complaining about general commentary on obesity. That's a conversation we need to have. I'm talking about interacting with people on a personal level.

They have chosen a vice that lets them look normal (for a certain time) while people who eat too much and exercise too little have chosen a vice that literally deforms their body. Their bodies were never meant to be that fat, it's something external and really easy to see. At some point it's really evident when people have been smokers/alcoholics/drug addicts for a few decades but it takes longer because they are fucking their bodies up from the inside, not ever expending in mass.

Pointing at one specific fat person on the street and thinking "you fat motherfucker, you're so unhealthy" is super shitty. You're surrounded by unhealthy people, that's just the only person who has their vice stamped on their forehead.

No it's not shitty. Its a statement of fact. Well I mean maybe the motherfucker part, no need to be so invective about it I suppose.

Again, that behavior is right in people's faces. If someone is shooting smack, piss drunk out of their minds or smoking like a chimney in front of most people, they are gonna think 'That's so unhealthy'. Why should it be shittier to think the same about fat people because what they've decided to do to themselves happened to be permanently broadcasted for the rest of the world to see? Can't have your cake and eat it too. (Something they are acutely aware of, I imagine)
 

Marvin

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If someone is 30 pounds or more over their healthy weight, unless they happen to be either 1) in great shape 2) over 6'0" then they are either borderline obese or straight up obese at this point. No 'distribution of mass' is gonna change anything like that.
I don't think that most of the people I'm describing are in great shape or over 6'0". Some of them are, but probably not most.
See the link I posted above about people's perception being skewed versus reality. Same thing with our loved ones, you have parents who see their severely obese children as having 'puppy fat', or people who don't realize their boyfriend/girlfriend need to lose 60 pounds, not 10, to reach a healthy weight.
I'm not talking about loved ones. I'm talking about strangers.
They have chosen a vice that lets them look normal (for a certain time) while people who eat too much and exercise too little have chosen a vice that literally deforms their body. Their bodies were never meant to be that fat, it's something external and really easy to see. At some point it's really evident when people have been smokers/alcoholics/drug addicts for a few decades but it takes longer because they are fucking their bodies up from the inside, not ever expending in mass.
Well, there are casual smokers. You don't need to be a pack-a-day chain smoker to get lung cancer eventually.

You can do things to your body that leaves very little external marks but still still ultimately kill you.
No it's not shitty. Its a statement of fact. Well I mean maybe the motherfucker part, no need to be so invective about it I suppose.

Again, that behavior is right in people's faces. If someone is shooting smack, piss drunk out of their minds or smoking like a chimney in front of most people, they are gonna think 'That's so unhealthy'. Why should it be shittier to think the same about fat people because what they've decided to do to themselves happened to be permanently broadcasted for the rest of the world to see? Can't have your cake and eat it too. (Something they are acutely aware of, I imagine)
I think you're missing my point. I don't care about the factual aspect. It's not like we're talking about Spock making a logical analysis and deciding that someone's unhealthy.

I take issue with the moral superiority people feel. I don't believe most people who judge fat people for being fat are healthy enough to where their smugness is justified. I think they're stuck up people who put their priorities in life on a pedestal. Not everyone cares about leaving behind a perfect corpse.

I could live to be 110 if I lived like a monk. I'll pass.
 

Internet War Criminal

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I don't think that most of the people I'm describing are in great shape or over 6'0". Some of them are, but probably not most.

So they are either overweight or obese. It's not healthy and not how the human body is supposed to be.

Well, there are casual smokers. You don't need to be a pack-a-day chain smoker to get lung cancer eventually.

You can do things to your body that leaves very little external marks but still still ultimately kill you.

You don't need to be a pack-a-day chain smoker to get lung cancer, but it's tons more likely than if you are a casual smoker. You might end up dying of a stroke even if you're in good shape, but it's still a lot less likely than if you're 100 pounds overweight.

I take issue with the moral superiority people feel. I don't believe most people who judge fat people for being fat are healthy enough to where their smugness is justified. I think they're stuck up people who put their priorities in life on a pedestal. Not everyone cares about leaving behind a perfect corpse.

I could live to be 110 if I lived like a monk. I'll pass.

They are feeling moral superiority because their are morally superior. Indulging to excess, causing yourself to become unhealthy and a burden for others and society is morally lesser than taking care of your body, not indulging excessively and have better priorities than those who feel that it's more important to feel temporary pleasure in the now even if it's gonna cause them to die way earlier while their quality of life goes down immensely.

Take Scott Glenn, aka that blind guy from Daredevil. He's 75. He describe what he does in his free time as training in a variety of martial arts, being a gym rat, downhill ski, hiking, climbing and motorcycle tour and do track days on motorcycles, and open water spear fishing and free diving.

He doesn't live like a monk. Still enjoys good food, still enjoys wine and having a fun time or whatever. But with a little disciple, exercise and taking care of his body, he's doing more at 75 than I guess most people reading here will do in their lifetime. You don't need to live like a monk to make it to 110 years old, but by making right decisions for your body you can live a long active and healthy life that's gonna be great instead of living miserable tired years starting at 40 and dying in your mid-60s not having enjoyed much in that time aside from tv and more food.
 

Trickie

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Again, that behavior is right in people's faces. If someone is shooting smack, piss drunk out of their minds or smoking like a chimney in front of most people, they are gonna think 'That's so unhealthy'. Why should it be shittier to think the same about fat people because what they've decided to do to themselves happened to be permanently broadcasted for the rest of the world to see? Can't have your cake and eat it too. (Something they are acutely aware of, I imagine)

So, what, just because you can hide most other unhealthy habits from public view means fat people deserve the extra scrutiny just because being fat is something you can't really hide? Seems pretty shitty if you ask me.
 

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Just saying, if you genuinely care about people's health as much as you say you do, you shouldn't use such inflammatory language or try to guilt trip overweight people. Why? Because a lot of us already feel shitty enough as it is.

I'm overweight because I use eating as a coping mechanism for the mental illnesses I have (not going to :powerlevel: too hard here so I'll keep it general). I suffer from severe anxiety and, on occasion, depression and have been on medication for years. My neurosis, combined with the medication I take, have caused me to have a very strange relationship with food; I’ll avoid eating for a long time before binging out on junk food or food that isn’t very nutritious. And whenever my mental illnesses flare up, I have an obsessive compulsion to literally eat my feelings away so I don’t have to confront them; I don’t think I can articulate how hard it is to resist this compulsion. And the worst part is that compulsive eating is still way better than the self-destructive way I used to control my feelings. All of this has resulted in a very vicious circle, where I keep feeling worse and worse about myself, leading to more binging, leading to even lower self-esteem .

As much as dislike the HAES movement for glamorizing my predicament, I also dislike the anti-HAES side for making me feel worse about myself while ostensibly doing so for the sake of my health. And I really don't appreciate you making judgements about my moral character just because of the way I look, saying that I'm ugly, selfish, and indulgent for being overweight. This is exactly what I mean, anti-fat people are doing so much more harm than good by being so judgemental and condescending instead of actually trying to understand why people overeat and how they can deal with the underlying problems that drive them to do so.
 
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