Libertarians will gain ideological wins from the Corona Virus shutdown. - In terms of analysis after the event.

Shutdowns effects on ideological discussion.

  • Lolbergs make gains

    Votes: 15 15.5%
  • Statists make gains

    Votes: 31 32.0%
  • Nobody cares about lolbergs, so it doesn’t matter.

    Votes: 37 38.1%
  • The world will be in shutdown until 2025. Get back in your pod citizen.

    Votes: 31 32.0%
  • If nothing changed from 2008 then nothing will change from this.

    Votes: 43 44.3%

  • Total voters
    97

Syaoran Li

White Trash Weeaboo
True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
I've often mentioned that the demise of the Religious Right played a major role in the rise of the SJW Left, but I also think it helped kill the Libertarian movement in America and led to a party of lolbertarians, ancaps, and other assorted lolcows.

Since the early 80's, the Republican Party was almost exclusively the purview of neocons, fundies/traditionalists, Zionists, and corporatists (the last of which are also in the Democrat ranks) and the Libertarian Party was the biggest of the third party groups since it was the default option of classical liberals and anyone else who was socially liberal or moderate but otherwise fiscally conservative. In the late 2000's, things began to change.

Enter Ron Paul.

Ron Paul was a meme candidate and was one of the OG meme candidates alongside Dennis Kucinich and Ross Perot, but he did get a major following online in the late 2000's and the early 2010's. This was all just before the "Current Year" round of the culture war began.

Ron Paul lost badly twice, but he had enough of a following and he didn't cuck out to the establishment Republicans quite to the degree Bernie did to the DNC.

Ron Paul's following also had an unusual amount of younger people who had spent most of their childhoods viewing the Republicans as the party of church ladies, neocons wanting endless wars, and ornery rednecks.

This scared the shit out of the Left since the neocons and fundies were an easy boogeyman that every sane person hated for the most part, and I'd wager that the Left's fear over losing their old enemy played a role in how the SJW culture wars eventually took shape.

It took a while for the GOP to catch on, but I'd say it really began with the rise of Trump in 2015-2016. He was a populist who took a page or two out of the Ron Paul playbook, and he got a following.

Meanwhile, the neocons and fundies like Jeb and Cruz all crashed and burned so the GOP decided to run Trump as a Hail Mary play since they figured Hillary Clinton was going to win anyway.

Against all odds, Trump won in 2016.

After Trump won and the polarization between right and left began to escalate rapidly, a lot of people who would have been libertarians in the 90's and 2000's went to the Republicans instead.

Really, this just left the lolbergs and ancaps in the Libertarian Party.

Hell, I'm a 90's/early 2000's liberal in my views and I'm voting for Trump.

As for whether or not the wider concept of libertarian politics can catch on in the long run? I'm honestly not sure.

If anything, this could very well further strengthen the economic left in the same way that the Great Recession did.

I do think that this pandemic may also slowly decouple the IdPol woke leftism from economic leftism in the long run since the SJW's, obnoxious champagne socialists, and pretentious punk commies like Destiny and Vaush are extremely toxic for the Democrats and fiscal liberals the same way that the fundies were for the Republican Party and fiscal conservatives.

However, at the same time, if we don't go too much further into authoritarian leftism because of this pandemic, then it could be a case of "what doesn't kill us will make us stronger" for the libertarians and classical liberals.

Either way, we're due for yet another party realignment, and in many ways, it was already starting to happen even before the pandemic.
 
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The Crow

Forever Changed
kiwifarms.net
Yeah, the folks pulling the strings here will never allow a Libertarian to become president.
 

Wallace

Cram it in me, baby!
kiwifarms.net
The SJW left isn't libertarian at all. I'd say they're strongly anti-libertarian, in that they have a disregard for economic freedom. They are against property rights and the freedom to trade, contract, and invest, and in favor of a controlled system where the state owns everything. (It's communist in the sense that they've deluded themselves into thinking that they are the proletariat, and naturally they would be the state in their dream scenario.)
 

Terrorist

Osama bin Ladkin
kiwifarms.net
Lolbergs may have some decent negative criticisms of the shutdown, but they don't have positive solutions to the virus or the Chyna problem. Punishing Chyna (by sanctioning them, restricting outsourcing, etc.) and doing preventative action against pandemics requires state action.

Deregulating the market would mean more outsourcing to communist China, not less. Under libertarianism, the American government has no right to tell corporations who they can or can't deal with, and big biz is very cool with the Chicoms. There isn't some law of the free market where you can only do business with people who also believe in the free market or else you disintegrate. Boycotts don't work for that either because consumers can often only choose from shit that's Made in China (or some other godless shithole).

The SJW left isn't libertarian at all. I'd say they're strongly anti-libertarian, in that they have a disregard for economic freedom. They are against property rights and the freedom to trade, contract, and invest, and in favor of a controlled system where the state owns everything. (It's communist in the sense that they've deluded themselves into thinking that they are the proletariat, and naturally they would be the state in their dream scenario.)

The SJW left is very socially libertarian. They believe the freedom to be trans and smoke weed everyday is of utmost importance, hate collectivism along identitarian lines by whites/males/both, and see nothing wrong with hedonism or the cult of self. Much like libertarians do. Where they differ is whether or not govt should get involved.
 
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Boris Blank's glass eye

And just for you I have a spoon
kiwifarms.net
I know, but technically, they claim to be it.
I have never heard of SJWs or Antifa claiming to be libertarian. The people that do that clearly don't understand their own ideology enough to even know where on the political spectrum they are.
AnComs, which many of these confused lefty authoritarians claim to be, are technically libertarians. Their flavour of "state-enforced social libertarianism", however, is obviously not very libertarian.
 

Slap47

Hehe xd
True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
This pandemic will be a disaster for libertarianism. It isn't true but the media is straight up praising China for its authoritarian disease policy. People will believe that. This is not helped by retarded people in the US "protesting the disease". Some of their concerns are valid but these protests are really really retarded.
 

polyester

kiwifarms.net
What? That doesn't make any sense. SJWs and Antifa are nowhere near libertarian. SJWs are enforced equality and Antifa are just straight up fascists, you literally can't get any farther away from libertarianism than that.

Left-libertarianism does exist as a movement, but it's mostly a bunch of think tanks (Niskanen Center etc.) and academic blogs.
From what I can tell, they're leftist SJWs who believe that free markets would be good for society, but in all other regards follow the standard leftist SJW script.

(And yes, they absolutely hate 'normal' libertarians.)
 

Wallace

Cram it in me, baby!
kiwifarms.net
The SJW left is very socially libertarian. They believe the freedom to be trans and smoke weed everyday is of utmost importance, hate collectivism along identitarian lines by whites/males/both, and see nothing wrong with hedonism or the cult of self. Much like libertarians do. Where they differ is whether or not govt should get involved.

What you're describing in terms of freedom to be trans and smoke weed is more of a classically liberal society, not libertarian. The SJW left wants their view points enforced by the state, and their lifestyles subsidized by the state, which is not at all libertarian.
 

Terrorist

Osama bin Ladkin
kiwifarms.net
What you're describing in terms of freedom to be trans and smoke weed is more of a classically liberal society, not libertarian. The SJW left wants their view points enforced by the state, and their lifestyles subsidized by the state, which is not at all libertarian.

That was my point. They both support the right to degeneracy, it’s just that the SJW left wants it state-sponsored. I agree 100%.
 

Watermelanin

Proud self-hating degenerate
kiwifarms.net
Well given that the governments that had the quickest/strongest government response are recovering the fastest and those who tried to hold out for as long as possible without government intervention have seen the worst effects of it, lolbergs BTFO as far as I'm concerned. But if we (the US) open shit up now, the virus will go back to its wild spread and all the lockdowns and stimulus packages will be rendered absolutely pointless. This could make for a new talking point for libertarians as it could be portrayed to show the ineffectivity of government intervention. But it's very easy to debunk.

If anything: this will only result in greater polarization as lolbergs bunker up in their hugboxes decrying the pointlessness of the government response and the left sits in their hugboxes decrying the reopening of the country.
 

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