Meritocratic Stoicism -

An0n

kiwifarms.net
Ok so basically this is how I see it working.
Tenants:
1. Subjectivity is the road to ignorance.
2. Everything can be measured.
3. No two measurements are ever equal.
4. The only way individuals or societies can progress is by accurately measuring the Universe around them, and iteratively changing their actions to improve themselves based off of this data.

In detail:
1. Subjectivity
Subjective (adj)
a. Dependent on or taking place in a person's mind rather than the external world
b. Based on a given person's experience, understanding, and feelings; personal or individual
Subjectivity is a corroding force acting upon a human beings consciousness. It, by it's very nature, closes off the mind from the world around it.
We can see it's corrosive effects in the field of Art. Subjectivity was introduced into the Artistic medium around the end of the 19th century.
Due to this you can see a clear and startlingly rapid degeneration of the technical skill of Artists. Regardless of what your opinions are the fact remains that the technical craftsmanship of Artists has deteriorated.
If we apply this same rule to other functions of society such as politics, academics, the affects are terrible. government policy based on inaccurate measurement. Academics Falsifying data.
Through this lack of accurate data inefficiencies in society begin to form and from those inefficiencies suffering forms, and from suffering you begin to see societal breakdown.

2. Measurement
Everything that exists can be measured, what else can I say?
"Can god be measured?" If he exists, eventually then yes. If he doesn't exist then, no.
Something like God cannot be measured within our current scope of measurement.
"God" could be some hidden force that we can't measure currently, like a parallel dimension of primordial energy that can be affected by the thoughts of sentient beings (Warhammer 40k fans will know what I'm talking about)
The problem is we can't measure that, as of now. And there is no accurate data that, if such things do exist, they have any measurable impact on our dimension.

Any Prophet or Pope or Cult leader who says he can "measure" or "communicate with" God is probably so deep in his own subjectivity that he can't be trusted. Since if he could really communicate with an otherworldly being, there's no reason why everyone else shouldn't be able to.
This is an example of un-replicate-able data. It can't be replicated and rely's on the the word of the would be prophet, and the consensus bias of his or her would be followers. This is not measurement. This is subjectivity made manifest within a social structure.


3. No two measurements are ever the same.
This is an important observation that I think often gets ignored by most modern day philosophies/ideologies, and even gets ignored by mathematics too often.
In fact I think the rejection of this idea is what killed Stoicism originally. You can research and see how (((Neo-Stoicism))) Promoted Idea's of "equality and fraternity among all peoples"
More French Revolution Gobbley Gook, utterly unrepresentative of the reality of our universe and nature.
In the nature of our universe no two things are ever equal to each other. If you take two leaves from a tree and break down the atoms of each they are never equal, in shape nor volume.
If you break down Star to Star, Planet to Planet, the composition of each, they will always be different
If you take mankind's most technologically advanced, most precisely formed pair of atoms specifically made to be perfectly equal, and broke them down, they will always be different, un-equal.
Even mankind cannot break this rule. Though mankind's psyche clamors for the predicability and peace that comes with symmetry, mankind alas, lives in an asymmetric universe.
1+1 is never just 2. It is Always 1.000x + 1.0000x = 2.000x
Equality is a lie.

So why do we tell ourselves it?
Because of our subjectivity.

4. The only way we can progress is by accurately measuring the Universe around us.
This is true for almost everything a person does. If they seek to lose fat the must measure their weight, and measure their eating habits and amount of exercise.
If a general seeks to win a war, he must measure his resources and the amount of ground gained.
Measurements, Measurements, Measurements.
It's the only way for anything sentient to grow and truly understand the universe.

You can see how the modern SJWs refuse to take measurements of the world around them, canceling and censoring. Encasing themselves in a cocoon of subjectivity.
And the majority of this subjectivity comes from their emotions, as the ancient stoics realized.

That's why I propose Meritocratic Stoicism.
Which rejects subjectivity and emotion.
Rejects the existence of equality, and strives to create a system which actively seeks to measure the most productive/most efficient members of society and reward them for their worth and reward them proportionately.
 

Otis Boi

Chunky Cow man extraordinaire
kiwifarms.net
I swear we already had some post this like a year ago word for word. I will tell you what i told the other OP. This is dumb people are inherently emotional and irrational and striving for complete objectivity is just impossible because every thing is viewed as through a diffrent "lens" by everyone since our experience paints our world and not the other way around. Yes there are definitive facts such as math but when it comes down to governance and interpersonal relationships there are no facts just probability and statistics.
 

BingBong

Living ghost, leaves no trace.
True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
While this is optimistic, it's impossible. Humans aren't machines. There will always be very emotional people in the world and based on what you've said here, you are probably one of them. It seems that because you are afraid of emotions and want to hide from them, you want to force objectivity on others. Grow up.
 

TFT-A9

Oops
kiwifarms.net
Subjective experiences should be weighed against objective facts and where they don't line up it should simply be noted that exceptions do not generally disprove rules. Absolute objectivity, however, leads to collectivist behavior and the drowning of the individual mind, thus stifling innovation and creativity. What we think may be absolutely objective may not be so much as we thought, as we are imperfect beings with imperfect understandings of both the universe and our own environments at times. Neither subjectivity nor objectivity should be discarded or ignored, but in the realm of the individual mind objectivity is a framework, not the whole picture. If subjectivity is the color we give a painting, objectivity is the canvas on which it is painted.

There's my dissertation, where's my A+ teacher?
 

Rand /pol/

True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
"Meritocracy" (or atleast total meritocracy) doesn't really exist. Most people's current positions in life are due to the circumstances of their birth more than their actual self worth or how hard they work or whatever.
 

Marco Fucko

I fantasized about this back in Chicago
True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
So you want a Jewish-Asian Aristocracy, a white middle class and a brown underclass?

We already have that.
 

TFT-A9

Oops
kiwifarms.net
I dislike subjectivity because it is clearly destroying society. Trying to assume my reasoning is disingenuous.
Idiots are destroying society, not subjectivity. You blame the hammer for what the wielder does with it?
 

An0n

kiwifarms.net
Absolute objectivity, however, leads to collectivist behavior and the drowning of the individual mind, thus stifling innovation and creativity.
Objectivity is simply the measurement of the universe around us, it does not stifle anything. If anything it's Subjectivity that leads to collectivist behavior because it leads to consensus bias.
Stifling innovation and creativity! Innovation comes from experimentation, experimentation only comes from accurate measurements, Objectivity is taking measurements.
Subjectivists like the Catholic Church for example, would go to innovators like Galileo and tell him to shut up.
Neither subjectivity nor objectivity should be discarded or ignored
Nah, Subjectivity can go in the trash can.
 

TFT-A9

Oops
kiwifarms.net
Objectivity is simply the measurement of the universe around us, it does not stifle anything. If anything it's Subjectivity that leads to collectivist behavior because it leads to consensus bias.
Stifling innovation and creativity! Innovation comes from experimentation, experimentation only comes from accurate measurements, Objectivity is taking measurements.
Subjectivists like the Catholic Church for example, would go to innovators like Galileo and tell him to shut up.

Nah, Subjectivity can go in the trash can.
The Catholic Church is responsible for sponsoring a great many dedicated scientific pursuits in the past, to stand up Galileo as the ur-example is fallacious.
 

An0n

kiwifarms.net
Idiots are destroying society, not subjectivity. You blame the hammer for what the wielder does with it?
You have it wrong.
Humanity = The Hammer
Subjectivity = The Wielder.

Except not really because humanity can change their behavior and are sentient. So they can choose to not be taken for a ruse through subjectivity if they want to but once they are in it's clasp it's very hard to break free.
Kind of like how Yuri Bezmenov described the people the KGB was trying to "program".
 

TFT-A9

Oops
kiwifarms.net
You have it wrong.
Humanity = The Hammer
Subjectivity = The Wielder.

Except not really because humanity can change their behavior and are sentient. So they can choose to not be taken for a ruse through subjectivity if they want to.
Humanity is supreme over things it itself invents. If you let yourself be ruled by your own invention, that's on you. Do you blame spoons for making you fat, too?
 

An0n

kiwifarms.net
The Catholic Church is responsible for sponsoring a great many dedicated scientific pursuits in the past, to stand up Galileo as the ur-example is fallacious.
But they did censor galileo for his observations and measurements anyways.
Would you rather me use 8chan's ban as the example? Or are you going to pout about how big tech actually helps "advance science" and "educate the world"
 

BingBong

Living ghost, leaves no trace.
True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
But they did censor galileo for his observations and measurements anyways.
Would you rather me use 8chan's ban as the example? Or are you going to pout about how big tech actually helps "advance science" and "educate the world"
Imagine comparing a renowned scientist and inventor to a site made up of autists and pedos.
 
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