Monica Rial / Monica Jean Rial / Rialisms & Ron Toye / Ronald Toye III / rontoye3 - 5th Bulma and Ron "Pick Up the Phone or You'll Find Your Dog Dead When You Get Home" Toye

  • Despite what alcoholic retards are saying, there are no plans to shut down the Kiwi Farms.

Ken Jennings

Won $5,522,700 on Jeopardy, can't afford a mic.
kiwifarms.net
Take a moment to watch this video, let me know your thoughts, as a therapist, on why a man, in his 50's who is "concerned" with his reputation would continue to do things he knows brings public ridicule and then, years later, after hundreds of videos, online accounts, forums, now court documents, 17 affidavits, a massive 0-17 loss with a bill of nearly half a million dollars still thinks he did nothing wrong? :) You can try to sound smart, maybe you convince a few of the people on here, but your analysis of me is weak, you are not a real licensed professional, if so, prove me wrong, post the info here :) Also, you chose your alt account rather uniquely. Would you care to share why? I know I will be forwarding the info to the real person, either way, but I wouldn't mind getting your take on it. My guess, you have been bullied in the past, to the point you don't like who you are, cognitive dissonance has set in and now you are not sure what or who you really want to be. I am not a therapist of have any formal training on the matter but My guess is that you might have had some education but didn't quite follow through with the process, so, you ended up the thing you heard many call you, in the past, and that is sad. But, I will applaud you for sounds marginally intelligent and give you a 3/10 for your analysis. :)


I always knew Nick loved me.


That is gross but makes me wonder why you all are obsessed with cucks, bulls, and all that. No kink shame here but what is with it? All this alpha chad talk coming from a groups who seems well versed in things that do not see very "alpha" or "chad" to me.
First, because I am not an asshole, I have broken this up into a few sections marked off with spoilers so I don't wall of text everybody.

Sorry for my shitty microphone the other day on Nick's stream. I was really looking forward to talking with him and my mic ended up being damaged which didn't help, I have ordered a new mic and it will be here shortly and I am reaching back out to Nick to reschedule a time to speak with him.

Alright @Ron Toye , I hope you have been well. Like I stated I am responding to your reply to my post. Sorry it is a few days late, life happened and it took quite a while to draft this all up, analyze video, and all the other stuff I did in relation to this.

I analyzed the video you linked. From an objective analysis, the content of the script can be interpreted as inappropriate. That is the key thing that drives the entire context of that video. It is why the joke about dads wanting to kill him and the asking of the dad being present. Throughout the video the girl consented to the interaction, although her demeanor was of nervousness. At any moment the girl could have walked away or batted him away. If someone in that room full of a hundred people could have went and stopped it. I'd probably be a bit ambivalent about it if it daughter wanted to do it, but he didn't do anything that I would classify as harmful, dangerous, or severely inappropriate. Reciting a line that was inappropriate doesn't make the interaction itself inappropriate. So as you asked I did analyze the video and I did so with an objective lens.

As it relates to his reputation, doing something like that, where most of the room appeared to be entertained and okay with the intersection, is completely different than someone being accused of sexually assaulting or raping other voice actors and minors, top it off with pedophilia accusations. They are in no way comparable.

In general I'm usually a very open person in general and about sex and sexuality. I've made jokes at my own expense about my sexual interests or previous sexual activities. I've openly talked about my struggles with infertility and dealing with 8 miscarriages. But just because I make sexualized jokes doesn't mean I wouldn't engage in a lawsuit if I was accused of sexual assault and pedophilia. Most rational people would, especially if it took away their job and ability to work. So the rationale that this kind of event activity that was requested by a fan becomes some sort of arrow to the heart of his reputation is a non-starter. It honestly sickens me a bit that you and others have compared Vic doing stuff like this to actual sex offenders and sexual abusers of children. But that is neither here nor there. But your assessment of how this video looks is off base and consistent with my view that you have antisocial personality disorder because you struggle to properly interpret and analyze people's emotions and feelings.

And it would only be appropriate that I respond to your reply to me, considering the way you did so, I felt it important to highlight some of the telling things you did in that reply.

take a moment to watch this video, let me know your thoughts, as a therapist, on why a man, in his 50's who is "concerned" with his reputation would continue to do things he knows brings public ridicule and then, years later, after hundreds of videos, online accounts, forums, now court documents, 17 affidavits, a massive 0-17 loss with a bill of nearly half a million dollars still thinks he did nothing wrong? :) You can try to sound smart, maybe you convince a few of the people on here, but your analysis of me is weak, you are not a real licensed professional, if so, prove me wrong, post the info here :)
My goal here isn't too "sound smart" or even convince anyone about my analysis of you. It's simply my understanding of you and your behavior based on your actions over the last year. Also interesting that you'll ask me to dox myself to prove my experience and background. I'm considering getting verified but the risk of having someone like you or other people call my place of employment or licensing board because you take issue with my opinions is something I have to consider. Regardless. I am not thee only person who has pointed out the same pattern of behaviors or contradictions in your actions. You don’t have to believe me nor does anyone on this forum have to.
Seriously Ron, I’m not here to ruin your reputation or to make you out to be some kind of monster. Sure I may poke fun at certain things, but that doesn’t change the fact that overall I want you to get the help you need. You can believe me or not, that is your perogative.

Also, you chose your alt account rather uniquely. Would you care to share why? I know I will be forwarding the info to the real person, either way, but I wouldn't mind getting your take on it. My guess, you have been bullied in the past, to the point you don't like who you are, cognitive dissonance has set in and now you are not sure what or who you really want to be.
I chose Ken Jennings at random one day many years ago as a throwaway for some random forum because I had heard or seen his name on TV or on the internet related to his time on Jeopardy. Plus its a simple name and easy to remember for making emails/accounts, so that works too. You can forward the info to the real person; if they care that is up to them. I don’t see why you would find that necessary, but you do you.

As far as my history, I will make a deal with you. I will share some of my history, if you in return share some of yours in response to my reply. I believe that is fair. It will also help me get a better insight into you and it also gives you the ability to correct anything wrong I have said. As I tell all my clients and families, I make mistakes and I can be wrong. I always use those mistakes and help improve upon them. So feel free to correct and substantiate anything incorrect I have said.

But as far as my background goes, yes I was bullied for a period of time in junior high and high school. I stayed to myself but had a small group of close friends I would hang out with. I was considered a geek/nerd at the time. I often had people tell me I wasn’t able to accomplish different things in my life and I always proved them wrong. I served in the military and was discharged honorably. I was a firefighter/EMT for a period before I joined the military. I ended up in this field because I like helping people. Do I like myself 100%? No, because I have room to improve on my own things. But I am constantly working on them. I know what I want to do with my life, it is why I ended up in the career field I am in. I don’t care for fame or fortune. I don’t care to make tons of money. The most important thing I get from what I do is having a client, their parents, or the family, thank me for being able to help them. I love waking up every day and being able to make positive impacts in peoples lives. People struggling with depression, suicide, anxiety, autism, anger disorders, sexual problems, family problems, you name it. So no Ron, I know exactly what I want to be. I’m doing it now. Your inference of an avatar & name onto who I am or how I view myself is almost 180 degrees from the truth.

That is another reason I have concerns you may have antisocial personality disorder, or sociopathy, because of the way you infer or analyze other people’s behaviors does not fit the schema for most people. It is like you are projecting other people’s views or you are trying to make as rational an inference as you can but aren’t doing that well with it. Again, this is not to bully or pick on you, it does truly raise concern with me.

I am not a therapist of have any formal training on the matter but My guess is that you might have had some education but didn't quite follow through with the process, so, you ended up the thing you heard many call you, in the past, and that is sad. But, I will applaud you for sounds marginally intelligent and give you a 3/10 for your analysis. :)
Well Ron, as you stated you are not a therapist nor have any formal training. So your assumption here is shaky at best. I have completed both a bachelor's and a master 's degree, both with a 3.5 GPA or higher. My master's GPA would have been higher but I had a couple of lower grades due to a family member dying during one of the critical semesters so I had to play catchup after returning from burying that family member.

Throughout this entire response you have been nothing but dismissive, whereas if you actually read my posts to you, I am doing as much as I can to be supportive of you. Also, your dismissiveness here about my entire post is contradictory of your own stances on the issues. You state that you are supportive of sexual assault victims, yet you are calling my post some sort of act to make up for failures in my life. I guarantee you would never say that to a woman who is stating they were sexually abused. So while you tried to dunk on me, you went against your own principles. Just like everything else, you can choose to believe me or not regarding my childhood sexual abuse. But how you hold yourself on this really speaks to your character and personality. You supposedly support survivors of assault and abuse, you want people to believe them, except when it interferes with your belief system or has a negative impact on you, or it is someone who may not agree with you 100%.

Another interesting fact pointed out by some of the other members here on the farms is the use of emojis or smileys in your reply. You did it in the section where you point to Vic’s behavior and talk about your “evidence”, you did it when you wanted me to dox myself so I can prove my credentials to you, and you did it at the end of your paragraph where you make me out like someone trying to make up for things in my life and trying to sound smart, while demeaning me in the process. You yourself have posted your use of these is indicative of stress or a stress indicator. It shows because you will go back to the use of these when certain topics come up and you appear to be bothered by them. Just like I will discuss below in your body language, it may be a subconscious process at work when you craft your responses, or you are doing it because it feels like a nice punctuation to what you think is a good point. I can’t say for certain. But either way, it is an insight into how you responded to my post here and to each of the items you responded to.

Now since you asked me to analyze a video of Vic, I thought it was only fair that I analyze a video of you. As I did Vic's video analysis objectively I took the same approach in analyzing yours. I watched the video about twice, since I scrubbed back and forth through it to take notes and mark down timestamps.

Overall Impression:

Your behaviors and statements in the video are contradictory to your statements and actions as of recently and how you are behaving here. Now you may be putting on a show for the Kiwis and because it is easier to respond when you have time to craft a reply, but there’s a difference between taking time to generate a better response versus a response that runs counter to your own statements in the interview you did. I don’t want to say you were being purposefully deceptive on the podcast, but I would say its likely because the things you were hearing on the podcast were not as anger-inducing as the statements you are hearing on here.

On Crumb’s Advice:

Crumb gave you some very good advice. I don’t know their background or history, but they appeared to be someone who has gone through enough and have made mistakes and taken the actions to correct them. If you don’t want to listen or believe me in any capacity, at least listen to what Crumb is saying.

On Aggression and Aggressiveness:

Tension buildup, “where’s the release”, related to fighting in-person vs online interactions. This is indicative of a learned history of the use of physical aggression or aggression in general as a means of stress relief, which you admitted to effectively in your interview here because you made the statement that aggressiveness is one of your greatest strengths, but also your greatest weakness. Again, I don’t know much about your childhood or anything like that outside the brief mention you made on the podcast. I am open to listening to more about what you said, but outside of that I don’t have much to go on.

A common theme here is you continue to state you have changed and are not the same person you were 8 years ago. But when you have for the past 16 months or so been interacting as you have been over this, that is not indicative of change. I’ve had to deal with sexual abuse and have worked with people who have been sexually abused. Not once have I ever wished harm on nor would I approach my abusers with any type of aggressive demeanor, because nothing is solved through that, especially on a topic so difficult and emotionally charged. You point to in the video your sister suffering sexual abuse, which is not okay and I am sorry she had to go through that, but that you “handled that guy quickly”, which gives the connotation of some sort of physical altercation or use of aggression. You even stated that it is part of your nature of being aggressive (related to your sister’s abuse and the alleged assault against Monica). You stated you were stressed when you finally found out about the allegations of Vic assaulting Monica.

Did you redirect this anger and need to control the situation into the actions you took against Vic’s conventions and the tweets you made online? Was it the only way you had to outlet your aggression at the time? You stated back then you wanted to fight him, which again is you relying on your history of using aggression as a means of resolution to your problems. It was used in your previous relationships (although in more of an emotional/mental means) of control against your ex-spouses than anything physical. You continue to use this same method of conflict resolution when you say 8 years after that remote control incident you are a changed man. I want to believe you but you continue to show me and others you have not done that.

This will go back to you needing a means to deescalate when you get elevated. You need to find a better way to monitor your own behaviors and you desperately need to find a way to redirect that aggressiveness into something more productive. Again, this is why I keep repeating you needing to get with a GOOD therapist to help with this.

On Conventions and Reputations:

You stated at several points in the video you don’t want people completely destroyed, don’t want conventions canceled or boycotted, and that you wanted everyone to stop using hashtags like KickVic. You state this but even your actions within the last few months are contradictory to that. If you didn’t want Vic’s reputation destroyed, why would you keep pushing this “17 affidavits” against him when it has been factually disproven some of those are twisted or even pure fiction, as the person making the affidavit was not even present during the alleged convention where the assault or inappropriate activity took place? If you cared about Vic’s reputation, you would ask your lawyer to have the affidavits stricken from the record at the very least, because even you cannot admit with a straight face that at least one of those affidavits does not contain incorrect information.

On Control:

When you stated you “had to respond” to people on here and online in general, in response to the hosts stating that you need to stop letting people control you. They are 100% right. You don’t have to respond to me or anyone else. You need to make that a conscious decision in ALL your actions, especially ones that trigger you to have an aggressive response (and I am not using “trigger” as an insult or to poke fun).
You also stated the only way you would settle is if Vic apologized for the actions of other people. This also goes back to your need for control over the entire situation. Going back to the Kameahcon text messages and calls, you wanted control over Vic’s ability to earn income. Yet you are stating that you don’t want that in this interview. Which one is it Ron?

On Positive Conversations:

You stated near the end of the interview you are “Always open to having a good positive conversation”. If this is the case, why are your responses on Youtube and here turn into anything but that? When I offer an insight into your behaviors and actions, instead of offering a positive response and correcting the things I got wrong in a positive or even neutral manner, you right out of the gate use demeaning language and try to take control over the conversation. I even said in my VERY FIRST POST ABOUT YOU that I truly want you to get some help. You have sat here and dismissed years of sexual abuse I went through, try to use bullying I may have gone through (which I did go through) as a way to say I am lying about who I am and what I do, and stating I am needing to make up for my failures by doing this and using a Jeopardy celebrity’s name/photo? How is that positive at all? You are effectively shaming every possible negative event I may have experienced and are using it to put yourself up on a pedestal. I didn't include the years of depression I dealt with during that time of my life or the other shit that was going on because it was not necessary. But either way, you say you want to be positive yet you will make fun of someone's possibly traumatic experiences during childhood as a way to one-up someone on the internet? Really?

This is the antithesis of positivity. You also state you would be willing to sit down and meet with Vic to talk about this, then why haven’t you offered the olive branch? I am sure Vic would be willing to resolve this and doesn’t want this to stretch out like this. Its a fuck load of stress for everyone involved. ONLY YOU AND MONICA have the power to end this, yet you have not done so. Why not? People aren't going to look at you as weak by ending this disaster. Even so, is that not a perfect example of toxic masculinity you state you are fighting against? Then why continue your actions and behaviors that are nothing but the emboldening of this instead of ending this in a peaceful manner?

Conclusion:

Your behaviors from the last 16 months or so are contradictory to your statements on the podcast. You continue to show aggression as a means of conflict resolution even 8 years after the remote incident and you stating you are a changed man. You continue to thrive for control over interactions and are wanting people to take accountability for things they literally have no control over. Your inability to relinquish control over a situation and this constant desire to regain it, which is also characterized in your need to respond to these statements that people make against you. Yet you call out Vic and anyone who stands for his cause when they take up his fight. Would he not be able to try and do the same as you?

In the end, the interview gave one hell of an insight into your mind Ron. Combine that with the way you have treated myself and others on here and other platforms, it is not surprising you have drawn such a following. I’ll reiterate this for what is likely the 100th time now, I truly want you to get the help you need. But you need to be open to doing so and your actions are not that of one who is currently open to doing so. I believe you can do so, but it will be a difficult journey. I am still leaning on my initial opinion of you having APD but I am reconsidering it after the interview, although I have not narrowed down any other conditions I would replace it with at the moment, although I do have a few in mind.

I do wish the best for you Ron. You are succumbed by your absolute burning hatred for Vic. By a slipping grip on the narrative and message you spent hundreds of tweets crafting and months working on. This will come to a resolution one way or the other. Vic is likely to come out on top even if he loses the appeals process. But your reputation will remain tarnished without some sort of endeavor for actual change. You preach against toxic masculinity yet have and currently are emboldened by it and act it out daily.

Be the change you want others to be. Make the changes you say you have already done. Because I can hand off this information to anyone of my colleagues and they would be likely to agree with much of my assessment here. Do take care Ron.

Sincerely,

Ken Jennings (not the real KJ just in case anyone is still unsure about that one, just clarifying that for Ron)
 

OneHandClapping

Equal Right Hooks
kiwifarms.net
Maybe it was the lemon fuhrer who went back and flagged Ron's twitter just to shut him up.
Actually, now that I think about it, I remember last year Casey Erick gave his impotent "...I asked him to stop," when Chupp asked if Ron was still tweeting. Maybe Casey put in those reports all that time ago in hopes Twitter management would shut Ron up.

It makes an odd amount of sense.
 

In Heaven

In Heaven, everything is fine...
kiwifarms.net
Actually, now that I think about it, I remember last year Casey Erick gave his impotent "...I asked him to stop," when Chupp asked if Ron was still tweeting. Maybe Casey put in those reports all that time ago in hopes Twitter management would shut Ron up.

It makes an odd amount of sense.
Makes more sense than Lemon doing it, TBH.
 

Mister Y

kiwifarms.net
I'm fairly convinced that Casey Erick was doing is job properly, but that his clients weren't willing to listen to him.

I wouldn't be surprised if he told them to TCPA right away, and they are the ones who insisted to try to get Vic's deposition before doing so. I wouldn't be surprised either if we later find out that they were tampering with his fillings, ordering him what to put in them.

I think that Casey Erick was sent to them by FUNi, but the Moronicas are the kind of people who think they know better than their own lawyer, that they sought someone who was more on board with their stupid schemes and found J Sean Lemoine.

So I wouldn't bet on Casey telling them what to do anymore, I would rather bet on him not giving a fuck and just doing the paperwork.
 
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TheShedCollector

kiwifarms.net
I'm fairly convinced that Casey Erick was doing is job properly, but that his clients weren't willing to listen to him.

I wouldn't be surprised if he told them to TCPA right away, and they are the ones who insisted to try to get Vic's deposition before doing so. I wouldn't be surprised either if we later find out that they were tampering with his filling, ordering him what to put in.
It's hard to argue they should have done anything different with the result they got though. Sure it cost them a fortune but they made that decision right at the start that they were prepared to fight.
 
  • Disagree
Reactions: Mister Y

Allanon

kiwifarms.net
I'm fairly convinced that Casey Erick was doing is job properly, but that his clients weren't willing to listen to him.

I wouldn't be surprised if he told them to TCPA right away, and they are the ones who insisted to try to get Vic's deposition before doing so. I wouldn't be surprised either if we later find out that they were tampering with his filling, ordering him what to put in.

I think that Casey Erick was sent to them bu FUNi, but Moronica are the kind of people who think they know better than their own lawyer, and that they sought someone who was more on board with their stupid schemes and found J Sean Lemoine.

So I wouldn't bet on Casey telling them what to do anymore, I would rather bet on him not giving a fuck and just doing the paperwork.
According to Lemoine, they hired him early on and he stayed in hiding, plotting in the darkness for....some reason. It frankly makes sense, because the idiotic decisions during the early stages of the lawsuit and their inability to ever meet deadlines matches those same idiotic decisions made by Lemoine later, while every time we saw Casey in a hearing or deposition he just....didn't really want to be there. The sassiest he got was trying to raise incorrect objections and mouthing off at Carrey once. If Lemoine was crafting their strategy from the beginning, it would fit their stupid filings. The only issue is why he stayed hidden and why they didn't just immediately drop Casey when he clearly didn't give them the answers they wanted. I guess Lemoine thought that was oh-so-clever and sneaky for him to know his opposition while they didn't know he was there until his dramatic reveal at the deposition? It sounds like the kind of scheme his diseased brain would come up with.

It's hard to argue they should have done anything different with the result they got though. Sure it cost them a fortune but they made that decision right at the start that they were prepared to fight.
I'd disagree. Yes, they hit the jackpot with the lazy judge awarding them the 17-0, but even if the appeals holds up that exact number, they got massively screwed on their award amount. Sam Johnson did things the right way and got his client off all causes at the cost of $50k. Lemoine and Volney did the exact same feat but at $150k and 250k. They didn't win their causes because of the deposition or any of their tomfoolery other than MAYBE trying to trick Chupp with the rule 11/12 violation argument, and so they literally just threw all that money into a black hole. And then it cost them exponentially more because Chupp gave them such a lazy ruling that appealing was a no brainer, while providing them adjusted fees that don't compensate for the cost of those appeals.

Yes, so far they've won, and yes, it's always possible they may win completely, but there can be no argument they didn't do it badly and blast through hundreds of thousands of dollars they didn't need to in a sad attempt to inflate the bill they thought they could pin Vic with.
 
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Kosher Salt

(((NaCl)))
kiwifarms.net
I analyzed the video you linked. From an objective analysis, the content of the script can be interpreted as inappropriate. That is the key thing that drives the entire context of that video. It is why the joke about dads wanting to kill him and the asking of the dad being present. Throughout the video the girl consented to the interaction, although her demeanor was of nervousness. At any moment the girl could have walked away or batted him away. If someone in that room full of a hundred people could have went and stopped it. I'd probably be a bit ambivalent about it if it daughter wanted to do it, but he didn't do anything that I would classify as harmful, dangerous, or severely inappropriate. Reciting a line that was inappropriate doesn't make the interaction itself inappropriate. So as you asked I did analyze the video and I did so with an objective lens.
You really have to watch the original clip from that anime; it provides the context for Vic's line about fathers.

 

Ken Jennings

Won $5,522,700 on Jeopardy, can't afford a mic.
kiwifarms.net
Clearly, because the real Ken Jennings would have used his gorillion Jeopardy dollars to buy a mic that didn't sounds like it was beaten into oblivion by a remote control.
Fuck you sir. I chuckled, enjoy your updoot.

Someone want to get a list of archives put up before Ron tries to say "I didn't say those things!"

Ken Jennings did an excellent job of analyzing but I think it will need the extra push.
I have timestamps for almost all the things I referenced in my analysis. I thought about putting them in but decided not to because I was already a couple days behind on putting this out.

While I doubt Ron replies to this or anyone else again (I've been busy the last few days so I haven't been on here much so if he's been back I am not aware of that), I truly hope he reads this and at least takes the time to absorb the material.

@Ron Toye As I said I'm not trying to dunk on you or hurt your reputation. I want you to get better. I took more time doing this analysis than I would doing a biopsychosocial for my clients, which is normally an hour long session followed by writing up a report in 30-60 minutes. I'm not getting paid for this, so there's no real incentive to spend the time I did on it. At it's core if you really meant the things you said in that podcast interview, you wouldn't be acting this way. Right now nobody is winning this. Every side is permanently scarred from this. If you step up and make amends with Vic and the community you will earn more respect than if you continue on the path you are on.

Ron, I'm willing to speak with you on a live neutral platform if you want to speak with me. Either to call me an asshole or to talk about these things honestly. I come with no hostility and won't respond with that, even if you decide to be hostile. But do know I will be holding you accountable so it may be tough to do. I also doubt this but I'm putting this on the table.

You can also dm me if you want some recommendations for good therapists in your area.

Edit: added reply
 
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HighwayStar

kiwifarms.net
According to Lemoine, they hired him early on and he stayed in hiding, plotting in the darkness for....some reason. It frankly makes sense, because the idiotic decisions during the early stages of the lawsuit and their inability to ever meet deadlines matches those same idiotic decisions made by Lemoine later, while every time we saw Casey in a hearing or deposition he just....didn't really want to be there. The sassiest he got was trying to raise incorrect objections and mouthing off at Carrey once. If Lemoine was crafting their strategy from the beginning, it would fit their stupid filings. The only issue is why he stayed hidden and why they didn't just immediately drop Casey when he clearly didn't give them the answers they wanted. I guess Lemoine thought that was oh-so-clever and sneaky for him to know his opposition while they didn't know he was there until his dramatic reveal at the deposition? It sounds like the kind of scheme his diseased brain would come up with.



I'd disagree. Yes, they hit the jackpot with the lazy judge awarding them the 17-0, but even if the appeals holds up that exact number, they got massively screwed on their award amount. Sam Johnson did things the right way and got his client off all causes at the cost of $50k. Lemoine and Volney did the exact same feat but at $150k and 250k. They didn't win their causes because of the deposition or any of their tomfoolery other than MAYBE trying to trick Chupp with the rule 11/12 violation argument, and so they literally just threw all that money into a black hole. And then it cost them exponentially more because Chupp gave them such a lazy ruling that appealing was a no brainer, while providing them adjusted fees that don't compensate for the cost of those appeals.

Yes, so far they've won, and yes, it's always possible they may win completely, but there can be no argument they didn't do it badly and blast through hundreds of thousands of dollars they didn't need to in a sad attempt to inflate the bill they thought they could pin Vic with.
And didn’t Chupp himself mention that Vic was going to appeal anyway and that Lemoine seemed a little worried that they might lose? Because I don’t know how you can claim victories when even the judge that dismissed those claims can sense your fear.