Community Munchausen's by Internet (Malingerers, Munchies, Spoonies, etc) - Feigning Illnesses for Attention

grumbleBum

kiwifarms.net
I was reading Merek Manuals for Professionals and came across an interesting passage linking Munch (aka Fictitious disorder) to Borderline PD.

Patients may have prominent borderline personality features and are usually intelligent and resourceful. They know how to simulate disease and are sophisticated regarding medical practices. They differ from malingerers because although their deceits and simulations are conscious and volitional, there are no obvious external incentives (eg, economic gain) for their behavior. It is unclear what they gain beyond medical attention for their suffering, and their motivations and quest for attention are largely unconscious and obscure.


Patients may have an early history of emotional and physical abuse. Patients may also have experienced a severe illness during childhood or had a seriously ill relative. Patients appear to have problems with their identity as well as unstable relationships. Feigning illness may be a way to increase or protect self-esteem by blaming failures on their illness, by being associated with prestigious physicians and medical centers, and/or by appearing unique, heroic, or medically knowledgeable and sophisticated.

What do you think?
It’s all quite fascinating, really. Their motivations don’t seem as obscure as Merck would have it, though, these fragile little snowflakes gain a lot more than just medical attention. It’s a free ticket out of tedious adult responsibilities and a bottomless well of asspats for entitled drama whores with a penchant for self-victimisation.
 

sixcarbchiligorl

kiwifarms.net
I was reading Merek Manuals for Professionals and came across an interesting passage linking Munch (aka Fictitious disorder) to Borderline PD.

Patients may have prominent borderline personality features and are usually intelligent and resourceful. They know how to simulate disease and are sophisticated regarding medical practices. They differ from malingerers because although their deceits and simulations are conscious and volitional, there are no obvious external incentives (eg, economic gain) for their behavior. It is unclear what they gain beyond medical attention for their suffering, and their motivations and quest for attention are largely unconscious and obscure.


Patients may have an early history of emotional and physical abuse. Patients may also have experienced a severe illness during childhood or had a seriously ill relative. Patients appear to have problems with their identity as well as unstable relationships. Feigning illness may be a way to increase or protect self-esteem by blaming failures on their illness, by being associated with prestigious physicians and medical centers, and/or by appearing unique, heroic, or medically knowledgeable and sophisticated.

What do you think?
I think that makes perfect sense. I believe most parents are more apt to dote on their children, or at least give them more attention, when they are ill. Parents take off work, stay home with the kid, make them special meals, continously check in on them, put on their favorite movies or spend time with them. If a child experiences this sort of thing with an otherwise too-busy parent, it makes perfect sense to me that it would be something they would either consciously or subconsciously seek out later in life. The trauma of an illness or someone else's illness is "enough" to trigger BPD.

Many people with Cluster B personality disorders also self-sabotage and have simultaneous fear of both failure and success. Being sick, sicker, or sickest absolves them from that. They are given passes for things that other people their age should have accomplished - degrees, relationships, houses, children, etc. Because of their lack of identity or problems with identity, their identity becomes that of someone who is chronically ill or a rare case or whatever else. If they had a true illness and got better, they'd not know who they were anymore, and so it would make sense to look for or create another illness.

I find the first paragraph a little incongruent with the second, though. "It's unclear what they gain beyond medical attention ... and their motivation and quest for attention are largely unconscious and obscure" but the final sentence illuminates most of that. What they gain is a reason (chronic illness) to blame all of their shortcomings on. They gain an identity from being a patient or a fighter, survivor, or mysterious medical case. They gain attention, love, support, pity. People are less likely to abandon someone if they're chronically or critically ill. They can vy for attention any time they need to. They manipulate others whether they mean to or not.

I don't think all people with BPD have malingering issues, obviously. I also don't think all people with MS or MBI have BPD. But they do both certainly fall in the same realm of mental illness.
 

Candidae

kiwifarms.net
So is there a treatment other than just not eating whatever sets you off? While obviously being allergic to lots of things sucks, it's not on the same sympathy-garnering level as a chronic pain disorder, which is why it seems like an odd munchie choice--although I guess it is good to add to a long laundry list of conditions.
It's more of a silent illness so it's easy to fake but it is a lot more than just allergies (which honestly on their own are horrible). The "spoon" analogy really works here. You're always low-energy, likely have a stuffed nose 24/7, headaches, asthma likely, dehydrated, plus you live in fear that at any moment your body will reject and go into a serious allergic shock from something that didn't hurt you yesterday (unlike allergies it's not always consistent). You really have to plan out your day.
Treatments depends on how severe your case is and there is no cure or honestly, proper treatment. You will have an EpiPen on you, maybe take master grade antihistamines with all their wonderful side effects, various immune suppressants (you can see how that might go), asprin daily (again, horrible for you), or have to experience all your symptoms with no help because the side effects outweigh the effects and hope for the best and keep your EpiPen available for any unfortunate emergencies.
It's a really awful thing to have, even if you don't have a severe case. It's especially awful when these munchies take over silent syndromes like this because they take something that really does diminish your overall quality of life and through badly acting what it's like to live with actually debilitating issues make them all seem like jokes. They don't know true disability and can't imagine life with one so it's either comically over the top or not nearly bad enough. Since they're the ones all over social media they're the ones who colour the illness or disability in the public eye
 
Does anyone follow ts.fight (? I think that's how it's stylized but it might be an _) on Instagram? She has the same laundry list of illnesses as everyone else and posts a lot of weird, contradictory, attention seeking shit, but I can't tell if she's faking in the strictest sense of the word or just an attention-seeking weirdo. she has a lot of really vitriolic haters on Instagram for some reason (I mean, probably because she's annoying and attention seeking, but it's way more than any of the other munchies get or at least post publicly about) and I was just wondering what other people thought of her/her whole schtick.
 
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eternal dog mongler

kiwifarms.net
I find the first paragraph a little incongruent with the second, though. "It's unclear what they gain beyond medical attention ... and their motivation and quest for attention are largely unconscious and obscure" but the final sentence illuminates most of that. What they gain is a reason (chronic illness) to blame all of their shortcomings on. They gain an identity from being a patient or a fighter, survivor, or mysterious medical case. They gain attention, love, support, pity. People are less likely to abandon someone if they're chronically or critically ill. They can vy for attention any time they need to. They manipulate others whether they mean to or not.
Honestly, it seems that Munchausen's by Internet is really a pathology that can only exist in the presence of social media. You really need this revolving door of people who don't look too closely into things in order to get your constant stream of asspats. Many of these internet munchies seem like their families have already caught on to their shit, so they're not getting anything from them anymore.

In my experience, the non-internet munchies we'd see were older and socially isolated. They faked illnesses in order to receive attention from medical staff. With MBI you have people like Jaq changing her own dressings while in the hospital and posting about it on social media instead of bothering a nurse, so I think that the need for attention from social media has supplanted the need for attention from medical professionals. At this point I'd expect internet munchies to start setting up fake "hospital rooms" inside their houses so they can just post their selfies from there instead of actually going to the hospital.

This can fit in easily with BPD because people with BPD often have problems with social media use in general. It gives them a very easy way to construct whatever identity they desire and internet randoms will simply accept it.
 

Frogasm

kiwifarms.net
More interestingly, a TBI will also change who you are as a person. I'm sure we've all heard of that railroad worker in like the 1800s who survived a spike going through his head, but became an angry drunk and lost all his friends and family? That's what a TBI does.
adding to this, this man's name was phineas gage if anyone wants to look him up. His case is very well documented for the era and is very interesting https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phineas_Gage
 

jokemonkey

kiwifarms.net
Mast Cell Activation Syndrome has very strict diagnostic criteria. Your blood work will show huge abnormalities that are very hard to fake. The problem is that doctors who aren't experts will "diagnose" and treat because they don't really understand it or how to test for it. It is more than just reporting anaphylaxis or allergic symptoms. I think many of these women just tell their main doctor someone else diagnosed it and the PCP just rolls with it and writes it in. I have never seen them post proof of their excessive blood mediators.
 
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snuffleupagus

kiwifarms.net
adding to this, this man's name was phineas gage if anyone wants to look him up. His case is very well documented for the era and is very interesting https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phineas_Gage
I knew someone who suffered a TBI during a military exercise (not combat related). Before it happened he was this really laid back guy that would give you the shirt off his back and someone is consider a trusted friend. He was in the hospital for over six months going through various treatments and therapies until he was released.

Then he became a completely different person, just up and divorced his wife, went AWOL from the military (he was an officer and about to take his first company command before the injury), and became this horrible person no one wanted to be around. They never figured out what hit him on the head but his helmet had a dent about the size of a golf ball so it was something significant. He thought it was an e-tool because he’d seen one on the floor of the plane before jumping but he’d also become a compulsive liar at that point so we didn’t know if it was fact or fiction. Sucks, he was a great guy and ended up a total shitbag because he got hit on the head.
 

Candidae

kiwifarms.net
They seem to be more about mental illness faking than physical illness faking over there.
You'd actually be surprised, most of the donation queens on tumblr fake some form of physical disability as opposed to mental because they need a valid reason not to work (and mental illnesses that prevent you from working aren't romantic like a tragic and fragile body) and then they find some reason to be discriminated against on top of that which they can easily pretend they are. "Being" non-binary doesn't really have any qualifications and since andro people are considered hot on tumblr it's just a nice bonus
Most mental illness fakers that do exist just claim things like depression or ptsd which they can just list in their description and never mention again. It's really only the outwardly shitty people where they'll claim a personality disorder (edgelords apply too) and that's only those who accept that they're terrible people.
Don't get me wrong, there are tons of fakers and self-diagnosers on tumblr but as far as proper munchies go it's usually physical still, even on tumblr. I think more on twitter and Instagram should migrate to tumblr actually, they'd get tons of donations because the kids on tumblr seem very gullible for any oppressed poor person with a sad rent story
 

mooserangerofthenorth

kiwifarms.net
So Morgan is still on the autoimmune encephalitis boat even pulling the #brainonfire out. If Morgan truly had it I have large doubts shed be able to go on Facebook and #rep being #soopersick.
Laurie is posting about a trio to NYC where do they get the money afford to go all over the place for Morgan's imagined conditions and take getaways?
Side note; Morgan has gone back to her picture of showing off toobs ( I believe that she doesnt even have some them anymore) flipping the bird but guys you must #respect me because I'm #disabled.
 

Attachments

Kate Farms Shill

Sunbeam 4 Jesus
kiwifarms.net
So Morgan is still on the autoimmune encephalitis boat even pulling the #brainonfire out. If Morgan truly had it I have large doubts shed be able to go on Facebook and #rep being #soopersick.
Laurie is posting about a trio to NYC where do they get the money afford to go all over the place for Morgan's imagined conditions and take getaways?
Side note; Morgan has gone back to her picture of showing off toobs ( I believe that she doesnt even have some them anymore) flipping the bird but guys you must #respect me because I'm #disabled.
I don't understand why she would go for a Dx that's been in popular culture very recently. Every munchie worth her salt knows you don't go for a rare disorder that's just had a movie/book/documentary made about it because all the baby munchies will come out of the woodwork looking to get diagnosed with it and the doctors are aware of that.
 

The 8 of Spades

This Is Our Church, These Are Your Sins.
kiwifarms.net
tl;dr: they had mass media telling them to be skinny and sickly, we didn't now how to medicine, everyone was dying, death was sexy, rich people loved getting water forced up their butts, and pretending to be at death's door was one of the few alternatives to rigid gender expectations.
That's really interesting. My focus is on modern media so I'm not really knowledge on Victorian times, but I'm hyped to check out that media your mentioned.
 

Kate Farms Shill

Sunbeam 4 Jesus
kiwifarms.net
That's really interesting. My focus is on modern media so I'm not really knowledge on Victorian times, but I'm hyped to check out that media your mentioned.
I did not know you could quote across threads, holy hell.

The same damned-if-you-do existed then too. If they were thin and fashionably dressed, they were seen as vapid and vain, but fat was definitely not okay and neither was "dressing down". Even the makeup trends back then were in emulation of sickness: they'd make their faces as pale as possible, even painting along their veins in light blue to make them more visible, then use stains to flush their cheeks and lips. Because that is what happens to the faces of people who are dying of tuberculosis. The munchausens-by-history rabbit hole goes deep.
 

jokemonkey

kiwifarms.net
Woah I was confused too about the forum switch! But if you have any more munchausen-related readings, they are fascinating to me so please recommend them. I have been reading medical case studies for years. This makes me sound like a weirdo, but it is what it is.

ETA, I did find the book list. Very interesting @katefarmsshil !
 
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Candidae

kiwifarms.net
I don't know how accurate this is but I was taught that some high class women would drain blood in order to appear more pale and faint/fragile before high class events. It doesn't sound too far off considering some of the descriptions of the ideal women in certain literature at the time and the romanticism of a beautiful sickly woman, so pale and fragile
 
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