Law Nancy Pelosi announces impeachment inquiry over President Trump's Ukraine phone call -

Is Trump impeachment immanent?

  • Yes, unless he stonewalls like the CRIMINAL he is

    Votes: 17 9.3%
  • No, and no amount of thriller fiction and blubbering from Vox will change that

    Votes: 151 82.5%
  • I don't know/I'm not sure

    Votes: 15 8.2%

  • Total voters
    183

Pickle Pirate

Pickles are just undead cucumbers.
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At this point, assuming that any politician, Trump, Pelosi or otherwise, is some master of intrigue and subterfuge and is pulling strings to make all the puppets dance in some sort of Machiavellian 4D chess game is probably pretty fucking exceptional.

I highly doubt Pelosi has some master, overarching plan here. She’s likely winging it as she goes, like the rest of them do, except the stakes for the DNC as a course of her fucking it up are much higher.
 

Manwithn0n0men

kiwifarms.net
At this point, assuming that any politician, Trump, Pelosi or otherwise, is some master of intrigue and subterfuge and is pulling strings to make all the puppets dance in some sort of Machiavellian 4D chess game is probably pretty fucking exceptional.

I highly doubt Pelosi has some master, overarching plan here. She’s likely winging it as she goes, like the rest of them do, except the stakes for the DNC as a course of her fucking it up are much higher.
She does

She needs money to win 50%+1 of the seats with people loyal to her

to do that she needs $$$

to get that she has to impeach
 

AlexJonesGotMePregnant

I'll get my humanity and my sanity back.
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Tinfoil hat: What if this was all a pelosi-run gayop to clear out some of the DNC corruption?

It's important to remember that Hillary took control of the DNC's coffers and a lot of the intelligence community corruption was done completely for her benefit. Pelosi has lost a lot of power and can't get anything done in the House despite their majority due to infighting following the neolib power loss. If she gave up hope of getting a Democrat in the white house for 2020, it could be a smart move to clear out some of the Clinton sycophants via Trump; she keeps her hands clean while helping to steer the democrat leadership in congress back to something electable.

Her half-assed blithering about impeachment is something she could easily move on from- as everyone here is pointing out, her hand appears to be forced. Others in the democratic leadership, including Schiff, seem less likely to do so (:optimistic: i know). I could even see her collaborating with the republicans on this "anti-corruption" shit in the background since they both benefit.
 

Loose Cannon

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The parade of whistleblowers in 2019 reminds me of the parade of whores they trotted out in 2016 to stump Trump before the election. If none of them are credible, just make up for it by sheer volume!
And then start yelling, “Where there’s smoke, there’s fire!” while everyone can clearly see them blowing smoke and trying to get some logs - ANY logs - to catch.
 

It's HK-47

Meatbag's Bounty of Bodies
Supervisor
True & Honest Fan
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House Democrats consider masking identity of whistleblower from Trump’s GOP allies in Congress
October 7, 2019 at 4:05 PM EDT

House Democrats eager to protect a whistleblower who raised alarms over President Trump pressuring a foreign leader to investigate a political rival are considering testimony at a remote location and possibly obscuring the individual’s appearance and voice — extraordinary moves to prevent Trump’s congressional allies from revealing the identity, according to three officials familiar with the discussions.

Democratic investigators are concerned that without such rare precautions, Republicans on the House Intelligence Committee could learn and then leak the identity of the whistleblower, who has agreed to answer questions before the intelligence committees in the House and Senate.

Democrats overseeing the logistics of the testimony for the House impeachment inquiry are discussing a location away from the Capitol as well as a staff-only session that would prevent lawmakers from attending and asking questions.

Aides have considered having the whistleblower testify from a separate location via a video hookup in which the camera would obscure the whistleblower’s image and alter his voice, possibly with modification technology. They also are talking about having the whistleblower sit behind a screen or partition. A third option being floated includes audio-only testimony.

“Schiff does not want to burn his identity,” a senior congressional official said.

“There are lots of different protocols and procedures we’re looking into to find out what works and doesn’t work to protect the identity of the whistleblower,” said a different official familiar with the talks. “That is paramount.”
The officials spoke on the condition of anonymity to freely describe private deliberations.

The discussion underscores the toxicity between Republicans and Democrats on the House Intelligence Committee, which was once considered among the most bipartisan, as the panel spearheads the divisive investigation that could lead to Trump’s impeachment. One individual familiar with the discussions said this is the first time the panel has had to take such extraordinary measures to protect a witness.

Trump has said he wants to meet his “accuser” and warned of “Big Consequences.” The whistleblower’s complaint centered on Trump’s July 25 call in which the president pressed his Ukrainian counterpart, Volodymyr Zelensky, to investigate former vice president Joe Biden, a 2020 Democratic presidential candidate.

“In addition, I want to meet not only my accuser, who presented SECOND & THIRD HAND INFORMATION, but also the person who illegally gave this information, which was largely incorrect, to the ‘Whistleblower,’ ” Trump tweeted. “Was this person SPYING on the U.S. President? Big Consequences!”

Andrew P. Bakaj, a lawyer representing the whistleblower, sent a letter to acting director of national intelligence Joseph Maguire expressing fears for his client’s safety. Bakaj also noted that “certain individuals” have issued a $50,000 “bounty” for “any information” relating to his client’s identity.

House Democratic chairmen, meanwhile, immediately cried foul and accused Trump of “witness intimidation” — even as some of Trump’s staunchest Capitol Hill allies also began pushing for the disclosure of the whistleblower’s identity. On Sunday, Senate Judiciary Committee Chairman Lindsey O. Graham (R-S.C.) said that if the House impeaches Trump, “I will make sure” the whistleblower faces public questioning.

“If the whistleblower’s allegations are turned into an impeachment article, it’s imperative that the whistleblower be interviewed in public, under oath, and cross-examined,” Graham said on Fox News’s “Sunday Morning Futures.”

Details for the whistleblower’s testimony are still being worked out, the officials cautioned. Little can be finalized until security clearances for the whistleblower’s lawyers are resolved so they can begin more substantive discussions about logistics, they said.

Mark Zaid, one of three lawyers for the whistleblower, said that as of Monday, two have their clearances; the third needs only to sign the paperwork.

“It’s just a logistics issue,” Zaid said. “It will happen over the next couple of days.”

The whistleblower’s legal team is also in discussions with the Senate Intelligence Committee about testifying, according to one individual familiar with the talks. The Senate panel, headed by Sens. Richard Burr (R-N.C.) and Mark R. Warner (D-Va.), is known for a more bipartisan approach; its staffers are not considering the extraordinary measures being discussed by the House.

The House and Senate committees are expected to meet separately with the whistleblower — both likely away from the Capitol.
The off-campus meetings probably will be in a secure room provided by the executive branch, according to one of these individuals. The meetings could take place “within the next couple of weeks,” but no date has been set, one official said.

Should the whistleblower testify from another location, the House panel could ask Intelligence Community Inspector General Michael Atkinson to confirm the identity of the whistleblower. Atkinson, who adjudicated the whistleblower’s complaint in August, determined that the whistleblower’s allegations were credible and constituted an “urgent” concern to national security.

Congressional aides have been discussing the possibility of a transcript from the testimony, but whether the whistleblower’s legal team agrees to that depends on whether the individual’s identity can be protected. The lawyers would not want information shared that could identify the whistleblower.

The legal team has been hired by a second witness, one who had firsthand knowledge of the events in the complaint. So far, there has been no discussion with Capitol Hill about that person speaking with Congress, the official said. That would require permission from the director of national intelligence, but that’s “pro forma” at this point, the official said.
Full Article | Archive

Whoever this "whistleblower" is, it has the Democrats so paranoid about preserving their identity that they're trying to find a way to have him testify remotely, with his face and voice obscured. This would also mean that the House Democrats are attempting to completely lock out the House Republicans from participating in the process, which is... Not how this works.

You cannot selectively have information passing through the House like that divided down a political line. There's no, "Okay, Bob and Frank can see this but fuck off, Steve." Either everyone is allowed to access the information or no one is allowed to. That's one of the reasons why the DOJ and OIG have been steadfastly refusing to talk to the House or the Senate about their ongoing investigations. If the Republicans get to see it, then the Democrats get to see it. Someone would leak.

I really want to know who this whistleblower is, now.
 

Iwasamwillbe

The Black Man, The Crawling Chaos
kiwifarms.net
View attachment 963676

Full Article | Archive

Whoever this "whistleblower" is, it has the Democrats so paranoid about preserving their identity that they're trying to find a way to have him testify remotely, with his face and voice obscured. This would also mean that the House Democrats are attempting to completely lock out the House Republicans from participating in the process, which is... Not how this works.

You cannot selectively have information passing through the House like that divided down a political line. There's no, "Okay, Bob and Frank can see this but fuck off, Steve." Either everyone is allowed to access the information or no one is allowed to. That's one of the reasons why the DOJ and OIG have been steadfastly refusing to talk to the House or the Senate about their ongoing investigations. If the Republicans get to see it, then the Democrats get to see it. Someone would leak.

I really want to know who this whistleblower is, now.
Every day this entire Whistle-blower Saga of Trump's Immanent Impeachment sounds more and more like a flaccid attempt at a soft coup.

Imagine the yowling and screeching that would ensue if Republicans did this to the Democrats.

Imagine the tactics the Democrats are gearing up to use in 2020 if this is what they're already doing in late 2019.

The Republicans should smack the Democrats down for this bullshit, full stop.
 

XYZpdq

fbi most wanted sskealeaton
True & Honest Fan
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Just so I'm clear isn't it still like a week until the house is back in session?
 

HumanHive

Human behavior is exceptional behavior.
kiwifarms.net
View attachment 963676

Full Article | Archive

Whoever this "whistleblower" is, it has the Democrats so paranoid about preserving their identity that they're trying to find a way to have him testify remotely, with his face and voice obscured. This would also mean that the House Democrats are attempting to completely lock out the House Republicans from participating in the process, which is... Not how this works.

You cannot selectively have information passing through the House like that divided down a political line. There's no, "Okay, Bob and Frank can see this but fuck off, Steve." Either everyone is allowed to access the information or no one is allowed to. That's one of the reasons why the DOJ and OIG have been steadfastly refusing to talk to the House or the Senate about their ongoing investigations. If the Republicans get to see it, then the Democrats get to see it. Someone would leak.

I really want to know who this whistleblower is, now.
Whistleblower is CIA, end of story. The whole masking thing is just a way of preventing any sort of defense against the charges by claiming the discovery process would threaten ongoing CIA operations.
 

BrandedEagle

kiwifarms.net


If there's one politician who loves to throw gasoline, it's Donald Trump.
ffs trump I was kidding you mad lad!
Seriously though... is it possible to impeach members of congress? If so... this just got deliciously scandalous.
Whistleblower is CIA, end of story. The whole masking thing is just a way of preventing any sort of defense against the charges by claiming the discovery process would threaten ongoing CIA operations.
True, but trump won't care and will literally smash into the CIA office with seal team 6 and steal the records and own the libs!
 

TowinKarz

Is it Morning Yet?
kiwifarms.net
You cannot selectively have information passing through the House like that divided down a political line. There's no, "Okay, Bob and Frank can see this but fuck off, Steve." Either everyone is allowed to access the information or no one is allowed to. That's one of the reasons why the DOJ and OIG have been steadfastly refusing to talk to the House or the Senate about their ongoing investigations. If the Republicans get to see it, then the Democrats get to see it. Someone would leak.

I really want to know who this whistleblower is, now.
If impeachment gets to the point of a Senate trial, you'll have to disclose who it is anyway. The 5th Amendment does not allow you to be testified against by anonymous witnesses who cannot be cross-examined, that's Spanish-Inquisition and Stalin-Purge level unallowable hearsay. It's the shit we outlawed to PREVENT naked political grabs just LIKE THIS.

Nothing they gain from any of these "hide the leaker" games could be used against him once it got that far. Right to confront your accuser, the "whistleblower" will have to be named, sworn in and sit down and testify, you cannot do it over CCTV from a dark hotel room, CERTAINLY not at this level, of capital "I" impeachment. Not even glow-in-the-dark CIA spooks are exempt from this. You can use shady "annonymous sources" to get a warrant if you get it in front of a sympathetic Judge, but, if that doesn't turn up any physical evidence, and all you have is that flesh-and-blood person, whoever they are, they MUST COME FORWARD, you can't read their testimony into the record by-proxy to "protect" shit, the rights of the accused always COME FIRST. Nobody is forcing you to testify, ergo, you can't come forward with testimony conditional on your annonymity or the scope of defense questioning. You put your name on it, your REAL name, or it never sees the inside of a court.

God, this is so nakedly Unconstitutional it's funny, because I don't think the Dems are doing it to foment a coup, I think they are just that STUPID and IGNORANT about how their own goddamn GOVERNMENT WORKS.

They're just hoping to create a big dark storm cloud over Don's head for 2020, they might know none of this will stick, certainly the higher-ups know it won't stick, they're just letting Schiff, Nadler and the others with those 3 year-long impeachment boners finally blow their load with these hi-jinks and subcommittee theatrics of exactly WHAT will be "allowable" far, far away from them and hope some of it sticks to Trump.
 
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Slappy McGherkin

You Halloween idjiots gonna pay for this!!
True & Honest Fan
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God, this is so nakedly Unconstitutional it's funny, because I don't think the Dems are doing it to foment a coup, I think they are just that STUPID and IGNORANT about how their own goddamn GOVERNMENT WORKS.
Much to be said of this, but you hit the nail on the head. They are trying to rewrite the Constitution and have already tried rewriting the electoral process to their benefit. They are issuing subpoenas faster than a crackwhore going down on a $100 john. Trump told his Ambassador to the EU NOT to appear for one of their "closed door" sessions. The whole fucking thing is as you said, trying to get something, anything to stick to Trump and when they can't, because of their over-demanding and subpoenas for every document in the Library of Congress and every person in the Administration, they are going to scream OBSTRUCTION! from the top of their lungs in a desperate last attempt to play the "See, he must be hiding something!" card.

Witch hunt of the highest order. It's absolutely ridiculous and disgusting.
 

moocow

Moo.
True & Honest Fan
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They are issuing subpoenas faster than a crackwhore going down on a $100 john.
Have they actually issued real subpoenas yet? I was under the impression they've just been sending "strongly worded letters" with no real weight or legal force behind them so far (they haven't even made this an "official impeachment hearing" yet, have they?).
 

AlexJonesGotMePregnant

I'll get my humanity and my sanity back.
kiwifarms.net
Have they actually issued real subpoenas yet? I was under the impression they've just been sending "strongly worded letters" with no real weight or legal force behind them so far (they haven't even made this an "official impeachment hearing" yet, have they?).
I think they're too busy trying to get ahead of any republican issued subpoenas with this identity obfuscation shit. If they actually do issue any, I bet they'll have some stupid and unconstitutional recent rule change that protects their side but not trump.
 

Slappy McGherkin

You Halloween idjiots gonna pay for this!!
True & Honest Fan
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Have they actually issued real subpoenas yet? I was under the impression they've just been sending "strongly worded letters" with no real weight or legal force behind them so far (they haven't even made this an "official impeachment hearing" yet, have they?).
Only know what I read, so if somebody is giving a "deposition," I would assume it's in response to a subpoena, not a harshly written letter.

"The Trump administration ordered the U.S. ambassador to the European Union not to appear at a scheduled Tuesday deposition on the Ukraine controversy, triggering a fiery new clash with House Democrats amid their impeachment inquiry.
President Trump dismissed the deposition as a "kangaroo court" as he defended the decision to block Gordon Sondland from appearing at the closed-door session on Capitol Hill.

But the move, first reported by the New York Times, prompted new warnings from Democrats that such acts will be seen as an obstruction of their investigation into the controversy surrounding Trump’s July 25 phone call with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky.
“The failure to produce this witness, the failure to produce these documents, we consider yet additional strong evidence of obstruction of the constitutional functions of Congress,” House Intelligence Committee Chairman Adam Schiff, D-Calif., told reporters Tuesday morning."

Source: https://www.foxnews.com/politics/trump-administration-us-ambassador-to-eu-from-appearing-at-house-impeachment-deposition

Follow that with this:

The chairmen of three powerful House committees on Monday issued subpoenas to the Pentagon and the White House Office of Management and Budget for documents relating to President Trump’s July phone call with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky, in the latest escalation of Democrats' impeachment inquiry.

Source: https://www.foxnews.com/politics/house-subpoena-pentagon-and-omb-in-impeachment-inquiry


So, yeah subpoenas are indeed flying all over DC right now around this.
 

TowinKarz

Is it Morning Yet?
kiwifarms.net
Trump sunk them when he released the dox in the first 48 hours, they had no plan for that rapid of a turnaround, that's why they are floundering and throwing subpeonas into the dark, they were expecting obstruction. Not compliance. Now, just like with Russiagate, they're scrambling to find something, anything, no matter how trivial, to hold up and say "See, this is what we were talking about all along!" to ex-post-facto justify the fact they, once again, put the cart before the horse.

They wanted to hold the phantom whistleblower above his head for 2020 just like they did Mueller for all of the last 3 years, releasing a slow trickle of leaks, asking "what is he HIDING? Why won't he RELEASE the transcripts?" and "Sources close to the WH say THIS is what's really in them, and boy is it BAD FOR DRUMPF!" to paint another "the walls are closing in" picture as Election Night got closer and closer to erode his support.

But Trump ruined it all

To use a nice WW2 metaphor, he opened fire when the Dems tried to sail past his fort at 5am, sure he wouldn't fire on them if they didn't fire first...

Trump just shouted "So what if they haven't shot yet, they're in my territory without permission, they aren't here for tea, load the guns and if I"m wrong, they can court martial me!" and cut loose with everything he had, and just sunk the DNC Blucher in the fjord before they even got a shot off.
 
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