War Navy commander orders SEALs to shape up - "What is this Mickey Mouse shit?!"

Ahriman

Vivere Militare Est.
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Source.
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NAVY SEAL ENLISTED GENERAL REQUIREMENTS By U.S. Navy SEAL + SWCC Scout Team Posted May 13, 2016

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Navy SEALS have been a focus of Navy leaders since High profile cases of misconduct have been in the limelight, including the highly publicized case of Eddie Gallagher. Although Gallagher was acquitted of murder after lengthy legal proceedings, he was found guilty of taking a photograph with a dead terrorist.

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NAVY SEAL ENLISTED GENERAL REQUIREMENTS By U.S. Navy SEAL + SWCC Scout Team Posted May 13, 2016

More recently SEALs in Iraq were reprimanded or pulled out for drug and alcohol use as Taskandpurpose reported.

A “Call to Action” directive released to senior leaders since Admiral Colin Green took command late July, obtained by Navy Times, returns the SEAL and boat teams to standards expected of service members across the fleet. Leaders are ordered to conduct “routine inspections of your units and strictly enforce all Navy grooming and uniform standards, including adherence to all Navy traditions, customs and ceremonies,” according to the Navy Times.

Earlier this year Admiral Green had ordered investigations into recent scandals. And immediately after he took command on the end of July, he issued a letter as reported and quoted by USNI, to include:

1. In our fast paced operational environment, the behavior of our people and the integrity of our organization are continually being tested. The trust placed in Naval Special Warfare by our military and civilian leaders, the TSOCs, and ultimately the American people must never be taken for granted. The responsibility for ethical and professional behavior must be taken seriously — by everyone, at every level of our organization.

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Admiral Green letter

2. We have a problem. Some of our subordinate formations have failed to maintain good order and discipline and as a result and for good reason, our NSW culture is being questioned. I don’t know yet if we have a culture problem, I do know that we have a good order and discipline problem that must be addressed immediately. Good order and discipline is the foundation for every military organization and it is a leadership responsibility. As Commander, I own it. As Commodores, you also own it. We must now take a proactive approach to prevent the next breach of ethical and professional behavior in our formations, instead of continuing on our current consequence management approach.

3. By 7 August 2019, I am directing you to provide I written commander’s estimate that describes how you and your command team will develop a plan of action that is informed by “Naval Special Warfare’s Force Ethics Assessment” dated 22 March 2019. This document gives a holistic assessment of the community to include a way forward. As professional development, I direct reading the first 2 chapters of “A Tactical Ethic ” by Dick Couch. This book describes how we have had these problems in the past. and thus provides a case study that we can use to recalibrate our culture and regain our credibility.

4. Additionally, I am directing you to engage everyone in your formations (in garrison and deployed) within the next 2 weeks on this issue; I want all hands to understand that “we have a problem” and that this is our main effort and my top priority. I will review and consider your recommended actions to develop my direction and way ahead to the Naval Special Warfare enterprise.

5. Your commander’s estimate will include:
  • a. Develop a problem statement from lite ECH III and below perspective.
  • b. Develop recommendations to ensure the NSW culture is aligned with our ETHOS.
  • c. Develop a plus for “buy in” from the ranks, with a sense of urgency.
  • d. Describe your plan for intrusive leadership at the ECH Ill and below level.
6. I expect good order and discipline to be instilled in and maintained by everyone in NSW. I know our leaders (officers and non-commissioned officers) are fully capable to take this on and I will strive to provide inspired arid inspiring leadership.

[signed]
C.P. GREEN

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Commander, Naval Special Warfare Command, Rear Adm. Collin P. Green delivers remarks during the change of office ceremony during which NAVSEA 06 (PMS-340) Major Program Manager Capt. Robert “Chad” Muse was relieved by Capt. Brian O’Lavin. Lakeway)

Rear Admiral Collin P. Green command tours include SEAL Team 3, where he deployed as commander, Naval Special Warfare Task Group – Iraq in support of Operation Iraqi Freedom; Naval Special Warfare Unit 3; Naval Special Warfare Group 1, and most recently as U.S. Special Operations Command South.
What they're talking about Eddie Gallagher is A SEAL recently acquitted of premeditated stabbing murder of a wounded teenage ISIS POW in Iraq, back in '17. Check out the article, interesting read.

As for the book "A Tactical Ethic" the Admiral is referring to, here is the synopsis:
Following the success of his recent book on Navy SEALs in Iraq, The Sheriff of Ramadi, bestselling author and combat veteran Dick Couch now examines the importance of battlefield ethics in effectively combating terrorists without losing the battle for the hearts of the local population. A former SEAL who led one of the only successful POW rescue operations in Vietnam, Couch warns that the mistakes made in Vietnam forty years ago are being repeated in Iraq and Afghanistan, and that the stakes are even higher now. His book takes a critical look at the battlefield conduct of U.S. ground-combat units fighting insurgents in Iraq and Afghanistan. Since the prize of the fight on the modern battlefield is the people, he warns every death has a consequence. Every killing has both strategic and moral significance for U.S. warriors.
From his unique and qualified perspective, Couch examines the sources and issues that can lead to wrong conduct on the battlefield, and explains how it comes about and what can be done to correct it. He considers the roles of command intent and the official rules of engagement, but his primary focus is on ethical conduct at the squad and platoon level. Tactical ethics, according to the author's definition, is the moral and ethical armor that should accompany every American warrior into battle, and these standards apply to the engaged unit as well as to the individual. A harsh critic of immoral combat tactics, Couch offers realistic measures to correct these potentially devastating errors. He argues that as a nation, we must do all we can to protect our soldiers' humanity, for their sake, so they can return from service with honor, and for our sake as a people and for our standing in the world.
Sounds like it should be mandatory reading for many branches of the military.
 
N

NN 401

Guest
kiwifarms.net
Word has it that the SEALs are universally maligned by all other units and branches for being a bunch of glorified door kickers with a coke and murder problem.

Killing Green Berets and then propositioning his widow, accidentally fragging hostages, blocking a PJs Medal of Honor because it made them look bad, publicly fighting with other seals over who shot Bin Laden.
This is what becoming Hollywood’s golden boys has made the Seals.

Though some would hazard that the organization was a founded by a criminal with criminal ethics to begin with.
 
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:chicken:

kiwifarms.net
Word has it that the SEALs are universally maligned by all other units and branches for being a bunch of glorified door kickers with a coke and murder problem.

Killing Green Berets and the propositioning his widow, accidentally fragging hostages, blocking a PJs Medal of Honor because it made them look bad, publicly fighting with other seals over who shot Bin Laden.
This is what becoming Hollywood’s golden boys has made the Seals.

Though some would hazard that the organization was a founded by a criminal with criminal ethics to begin with.
And they are technically sailors, which makes them super gay.
 

Ihavetinyweewee

But massive grotesque balls
kiwifarms.net
Word has it that the SEALs are universally maligned by all other units and branches for being a bunch of glorified door kickers with a coke and murder problem.

Killing Green Berets and the propositioning his widow, accidentally fragging hostages, blocking a PJs Medal of Honor because it made them look bad, publicly fighting with other seals over who shot Bin Laden.
This is what becoming Hollywood’s golden boys has made the Seals.

Though some would hazard that the organization was a founded by a criminal with criminal ethics to begin with.
Eh, Roy Boehm was never a criminal or had ethical issues. You may be confusing this with Dick Marcinko who founded the SEAL counter terrorism unit

Marcinko created a 'cowboy' reputation for the teams which has resurfaced in the past decade or so...

But, at its fundamental roots the SEAL teams have an honorable and respectable history...
 

Ahriman

Vivere Militare Est.
kiwifarms.net
Marcinko created a 'cowboy' reputation for the teams which has resurfaced in the past decade or so...
And he's responsible for one of the most hilarious game ever, Rogue Warrior. It's unironically the best game of all time.
Dick would make Duke Nukem blush :lit:

EDIT: You know who else was a SEAL? Dan Bilzerian.
We should consider starting a thread on him at some point, quite a lot of material on him.
 
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N

NN 401

Guest
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Eh, Roy Boehm was never a criminal or had ethical issues. You may be confusing this with Dick Marcinko who founded the SEAL counter terrorism unit

Marcinko created a 'cowboy' reputation for the teams which has resurfaced in the past decade or so...

But, at its fundamental roots the SEAL teams have an honorable and respectable history...
You’re right, I was thinking of Marcinko.
I’m assuming Boehm was the guy behind the UDT? My unit history is a bit spotty.

I’m of the opinion that the Seals are suffering from over Media exposure and their habit of recruiting spec ops personnel right off the street is biting them in the ass. And mission creep from what Seals were originally tasked to do as a unit during GWOT. Though I get that’s for budget reasons.

Whoa, source? never heard of this before. That's pretty fucking low...
Link below. Logan Melgar got dusted because the asshole Seals he was housed with in Mali were bringing back hookers to their pad and embezzling funds for anti-terrorism activities and Melgar objected to this fuckery.

Then it came out that they were trying to sexually assault him during the attack, too and film it...


https://www.reddit.com/r/Military/comments/9xd2mg/2_navy_seals_2_marines_charged_with_murder_of/
https://www.reddit.com/r/Military/comments/9xd2mg/2_navy_seals_2_marines_charged_with_murder_of/
 

Ihavetinyweewee

But massive grotesque balls
kiwifarms.net
And he's responsible for one of the most hilarious game ever, Rogue Warrior. It's unironically the best game of all time.
Dick would make Duke Nukem blush :lit:
He is a dipshit and always has been. He fabricated a ton of shit in his books. He made himself out to be a rediculious super hero.

He also lied in his books about why he was incaraerated. He said it was an 'accounting error on hand grenades'. Complete bullshit, he was using tax payers money for extravagent parties and vacations. All sort of embezzlement issues, the man was a clown.

Even his Vietnam stories are apparently completely over-blown...

Also, he wasn't the sole creator of SEAL team Six(as he likes to say). He was just the first CO, who almost managed to get it utterly dissolved..
 

Trig.Point

I wouldn't start from here.
True & Honest Fan
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It used to be that in order to join the Special Forces of most Western Militaries that you had to serve time in the regular army or navy first.

That changed, at least with the SEALs you can join directly, so while you do your basic and trade training and then head straight into special forces selection. This I think was meant to attract high quality candidates who essentially felt that serving time as a regular sailor was beneath them.

There's a joke someone in the UK military told me once, that part of Special Forces selection consisted of a Mock book deal negotiation, and creative writing courses.

At the end of the day, whoever is right, the fact that these arguments are being conducted in public says everything.
 
N

NN 401

Guest
kiwifarms.net
It used to be that in order to join the Special Forces of most Western Militaries that you had to serve time in the regular army or navy first.

That changed, at least with the SEALs you can join directly, so while you do your basic and trade training and then head straight into special forces selection. This I think was meant to attract high quality candidates who essentially felt that serving time as a regular sailor was beneath them.

There's a joke someone in the UK military told me once, that part of Special Forces selection consisted of a Mock book deal negotiation, and creative writing courses.

At the end of the day, whoever is right, the fact that these arguments are being conducted in public says everything.

It’s only the Seals who’ve shortened their pipeline in this fashion. Everyone has had to make adjustments here or there but most SF guys in the Army are starting their careers in those units in their late 20s for exactly the reasons you laid out.

Too many fucking people know what they do or think they know what they do and too many people, men included, stop drop and felate whenever they see Budweiser/trident.
When was the last time anyone wrote romance novels about a Green Beret or some poor CCT bastard or even a ranger?
 

Ihavetinyweewee

But massive grotesque balls
kiwifarms.net
You’re right, I was thinking of Marcinko.
I’m assuming Boehm was the guy behind the UDT? My unit history is a bit spotty.

I’m of the opinion that the Seals are suffering from over Media exposure and their habit of recruiting spec ops personnel right off the street is biting them in the ass. And mission creep from what Seals were originally tasked to do as a unit during GWOT. Though I get that’s for budget reasons.



Link below. Logan Melgar got dusted because the asshole Seals he was housed with in Mali were bringing back hookers to their pad and embezzling funds for anti-terrorism activities and Melgar objected to this fuckery.

Then it came out that they were trying to sexually assault him during the attack, too and film it...


https://www.reddit.com/r/Military/comments/9xd2mg/2_navy_seals_2_marines_charged_with_murder_of/
https://www.reddit.com/r/Military/comments/9xd2mg/2_navy_seals_2_marines_charged_with_murder_of/
Roy Bohem came from UDT, he was specifically tasked, by Kennedy, to make the SEAL teams. At the start, they were supposed to be the naval version of Green Berets. Primarly augmenting Special Forces with a naval component.

So the Green Berets could train/ lead guerrilla armies on land. Navy SEAls would train/lead marines/frogmen for coastal/littoral operations..

But, during the Vietnam war they kinda morphed into a riverine intelligence/counter guerrilla unit...

Since no-one knew what to do with them(wasn't much of a demand for south vietnamese marines/frogmen). SEALs got dropped in 4 corps, mostly along the Mekong Delta, which was the only real naval command presence in Vietnam. They just did what they wanted and were pretty effective. But, in the overall scheme of Vietnam, it was a 'piss in the bucket'. Not as mythical as some would want you to think...

I think there is a lot of different reasons for the problems with SEAL teams today. I think a big reason is that their out of their element.

They're being used primarily in an long form insurgent/infantry war. They've been trying to stay relevant by working in on something their not really trained for: unconventionsl warfare/foreign internal defense. Thats led to a bunch of the issues.

The reality is that outside of their counter terrorism unit(which is interchangeable with Delta Force), there isn't much of a role for them. Army Rangers are a far more effective light infantry/commando style unit on land than SEALs when it comes to general purpose Direct Action.

SEALs are really designed for small naval/ coastal raids or intellgence gathering where they can infiltrate with small teams from the water. They had to morph into a land warfare unit during these wars. They did well(although having some serious growing pains), but there are better options at this point...
 
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Iceland Heavy

kiwifarms.net
And he's responsible for one of the most hilarious game ever, Rogue Warrior. It's unironically the best game of all time.
Dick would make Duke Nukem blush :lit:

EDIT: You know who else was a SEAL? Dan Bilzerian.
We should consider starting a thread on him at some point, quite a lot of material on him.
To be fair to the SEALs in that instance only Bilzerian never actually passed BUD/S, he got dropped for 'safety violations' which should tell you how much of a peacocking jackass he is. He actually paid to basically play a SEAL in Lone Survivor only to have most of his lines and scenes cut :story:
 

Sīn the Moon Daddy

🌙 Time and Tide
kiwifarms.net
Word has it that the SEALs are universally maligned by all other units and branches for being a bunch of glorified door kickers with a coke and murder problem.

Killing Green Berets and the propositioning his widow, accidentally fragging hostages, blocking a PJs Medal of Honor because it made them look bad, publicly fighting with other seals over who shot Bin Laden.
This is what becoming Hollywood’s golden boys has made the Seals.

Though some would hazard that the organization was a founded by a criminal with criminal ethics to begin with.
Sounds like the military in general. Just a bunch of liquored up faggots that would be in prison if they weren't in the military.
 

lolwut

So I heard ya like antioxidents?
True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
It’s only the Seals who’ve shortened their pipeline in this fashion. Everyone has had to make adjustments here or there but most SF guys in the Army are starting their careers in those units in their late 20s for exactly the reasons you laid out.
The Army actually has an MOS called 18X, which represents Infantry/Special Forces Candidate. You can take it when you enlist if you don't eat the crayon during the ASVAB.

Basically all it means is that you go to infantry school, jump school, then immediately on to the Special Operations Preparation Course and Selection. Any 18X that gets dropped along the way gets dumped into the 82nd Airborne as an 11B Infantry.

As I understand it, it's a way to hoodwink dudes into being a grunt that would've otherwise known better and maybe scrape a few Green Beans off the top.
 
N

NN 401

Guest
kiwifarms.net
The Army actually has an MOS called 18X, which represents Infantry/Special Forces Candidate. You can take it when you enlist if you don't eat the crayon during the ASVAB.

Basically all it means is that you go to infantry school, jump school, then immediately on to the Special Operations Preparation Course and Selection. Any 18X that gets dropped along the way gets dumped into the 82nd Airborne as an 11B Infantry.

As I understand it, it's a way to hoodwink dudes into being a grunt that would've otherwise known better and maybe scrape a few Green Beans off the top.
I forgot about 18x. Almost all of the SF I’ve been acquainted with were 11bs or some other such thing that worked their way in the pipeline.

I just read anyone who washes out of the program doesn’t get dumped into infantry because it’s over strength. Now it’s needs of the Army. If that isn’t a disincentive I don’t know what is.
 

lolwut

So I heard ya like antioxidents?
True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
I just read anyone who washes out of the program doesn’t get dumped into infantry because it’s over strength. Now it’s needs of the Army. If that isn’t a disincentive I don’t know what is.
So instead of just dropping the 18X mos they're going to spend the money to make every washout redo AIT and do what? Fill the ranks with airborne trained water truck drivers bitching about how they would've been a snake eater if the instructor wasn't such an asshole? Seems about right. :story:
 
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