Nurse practitioner delusion / "Noctors" / "Midlevel staff" - Nurses get a 1 year degree and start thinking they are better than doctors

[Cryin RN]

New NP malpractice case to examine that resulted in the death of a 52 year old woman.

There are really two people at fault here, the triage nurse and the NP. For some reason, a 52 year old woman with 10/10 sharp upper back pain and low blood pressure, was triaged as level 5. The lowest possible priority. Some hospitals don't even use level 5s. For context, level 5 is used to indicate at worst, someone with a rash, and is usually just someone hanging around asking for their prescription to be re-filled. That is a pretty huge fuck up by the triage nurse.

When the NP eventually gets around to her, they show 0 critical thinking skills and basically just went "Oh well someone listed them as level 5, I guess I don't have to do anything. I mean if the nurse was wrong then its her problem not mine." And then proceeds to do nothing. No tests. Nothing. The NP was there for a total of 6 minutes before saying that it must be muscle spasms, and giving her 60mg(!) of steroids and some Valium, because it can't be a NP prescription without some benzos. The woman returned 4 days later and died of a heart attack.

Boomers with back pain are a free space on urgent care bingo, but basic ass-covering assessments would have saved this lady's life. Nobody in that ER was even curious about an aortic dissection when this distressed lady walked in at a BP of 97/40... and no other vitals taken. She might have been tachycardic, might not, but if your nurses don't check you won't know!

 

[Buttigieg2020]

Apparently it's about to get much worse in Texas because of a new bill that would prevent non-rich people from getting access to a physician and would force them to go to a nurse practitioner. It was posted on r/houston and r/texas but was removed shortly afterward.

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https://www.reddit.com/r/Noctor/comments/lrmogi/a_glimpse_into_the_type_of_people_we_are_dealing/

https://www.reddit.com/r/LateStageCapitalism/comments/lrfvgv/classist_new_texas_bill_introduced_to_effectively/

Here's an r/texas thread on it(finally):

r/texas - TX legislation to allow nurses to replace doctors

336 votes and 376 comments so far on Reddit

www.reddit.com

Well this bill died in committee, so I guess bullet dodged.

 

[Plank]

I have a friend whose mother was a nurse who retired in her mid sixties a few years ago. One of the few times I heard her speak about her work was about the younger crowd of nurses.

She was furious because of the danger they were to patients:

1. They were constantly trying to take over duties that they were not trained for
2. They were constantly egged on by the administration and others with a sort of 'you go girl!' or don't let any sexist tell you aren't as smart as that white male veteran doctor
3. And that when they do fuck up, their mistakes are covered up because of 2

I know there are other aspects such as the drive to find ways to cut costs and not all nurses are female, but I came away from her talks about current year nurses with a desire to have some sort of "I do not authorize NP care" type medical card in my wallet.

Edit:
One more thing I remember is she mentioned that when she would confront these new generation of nurses about their dangerous attempts to be treated like doctors and why they didn't go to the full med school path to become doctors they would respond that they didn't feel the need to. And the new medical workplace narrative was essentially telling them they didn't need to.

Years later it struck me that was one of the key lessons of the 'wage gap' myth. The women who constantly push that lie in reality just want to be paid the same as men who put in more hours than they do, have years more training than they do, have a large amount of more responsibility than they do. They want to take part time jobs, leave when it is convenient for them, not have any serious responsibility, but still make the same amount of money as the men at the company who have spent their entire life with their faces in tech books and working until midnight while the female employees are home in bed watching Lifetime or posting on social media about 'muh wage gap'.

 

[Mariposa Electrique]

New NP malpractice case to examine that resulted in the death of a 52 year old woman.

There are really two people at fault here, the triage nurse and the NP. For some reason, a 52 year old woman with 10/10 sharp upper back pain and low blood pressure, was triaged as level 5. The lowest possible priority. Some hospitals don't even use level 5s. For context, level 5 is used to indicate at worst, someone with a rash, and is usually just someone hanging around asking for their prescription to be re-filled. That is a pretty huge fuck up by the triage nurse.

When the NP eventually gets around to her, they show 0 critical thinking skills and basically just went "Oh well someone listed them as level 5, I guess I don't have to do anything. I mean if the nurse was wrong then its her problem not mine." And then proceeds to do nothing. No tests. Nothing. The NP was there for a total of 6 minutes before saying that it must be muscle spasms, and give her 60mg(!) of steroids and some Valium, because it can't be a NP prescription without some benzos. The woman returned 4 days later and died of a heart attack.

I am NP, and I graduated with my doctorate. I still believe most NPs should work under doctors. Even nurses should be able to spot an MI.

 

[NoReturn]

Hospital administration has ballooned in size over the past decades, particularly in the United States. To combat this increase in cost, hospitals have begun replacing practising MDs with Nurse Practitioners (NPs).

What are NPs?
They are trained nurses that have a level of autonomy and decision making far beyond what you traditionally may think of when you hear the word "nurse", and in some states are able to practice entirely on their own without direct supervision.

How does one become an NP? What is their training?
After completing a Bachelors degree, one can register for any number of online only Nurse Practitioner diploma mills programmes across the US. They take crucial classes such as lobbying, finance, and leadership and management, for one year. They finish off their degree with a research project that rivals a middle school science fair.
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PD's then shadow a MD for 600 hours. They are now fully able to practice on their own in whatever field they choose. For comparison, apart from the much longer and difficult education, an MD will have a residency of around 20,000 hours.

Why is this an issue? Who cares?
Malpractice is increasing,the USA is producing thousands of entitled idiots that have a high school level of biological understanding, and allowing them to treat patients who have no idea that the person they are talking to isn't a Doctor. NPs are notoriously pissy about being seen as lower than Doctors, and will try to hide the fact that they aren't constantly. They are going as far as to buy their own badges that say "Doctor" on Amazon.
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A case study in NP incompetence is Antoinette Thompson, an NP working independently in an ER that killed a 19 year old girl in 2015 due to clear malpractice. The girl had an elevated heart rate because she had a bloodclot in her lung and her body was compensating for the lack of oxygen by increasing the heartbeats per minute. With Thompson's bullshit education and training, she treated each symptom individually like it was a textbook MCQ, and gave the girl medication to slow down her heart rate. She never considered why it was that her heart rate was increased, only that she should reduce it. A deposition was held

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where Thompson cried and said that she didn't mean to hurt her. This woman is still a practicing NP. Cases like this happen constantly, and yes, they can do more than just prescribe you drugs. Here is a 6 minute video where an actual doctor talks about having to fix multiple fucked up procedures carried out by Nps.

Why can they do all this? NPs have ridiculous lobbying, the AANP constantly demands states to increase the level of power NPs can wield.

Why are they lolcows?

NPs are incredibly defensive about their abilities. They believe they are discriminated against by Doctors, and have the same skill level and ability as them.

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In the same breath they then ask eachother the most retarded questions that really show just how little they know.

How do I look at X-rays?
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How do I ask patients questions?
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What can we actually do?
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In the medical field they are often referred to as "mid-levels", and other communities criticising their actions refer to them as "Noctors"

Where can you find these communities?

There are hundreds of Facebook groups for Nurse Practitioners ranging from harmless study groups to terrifying advice pages where they try to pool together their collective knowledge to see if it can reach the level of an actual doctor ("My patient has had chlamydia 3 times in the past 6 months, and I'm still prescribing him the exact same treatment each time and it isn't working. Weird right?", "Can I give my alcoholic patients xanax prescriptions?")

Additionally there are large communities on Twitter and even TikTok, where they shill to children into thinking they are as qualified as Doctors.

https://www.reddit.com/r/nursepractitioner/

https://www.reddit.com/r/Noctor/

- For critical posts about NPs

The majority of the facebook groups are private, although they will accept anyone if you apply usually

One of the biggest is

https://www.facebook.com/groups/NurseLadaNPBinderGroup/

TLDR
Nurses are getting shitty degrees and are getting the power to treat YOU. They fuck up constantly and scramble to defend themselves while only making it worse by highlighting their lack of knowledge in key areas. Those ethnically ambiguous overweight women twerking in the hospital while patients die beside them are likely NPs. Those literal whos on twitter that post about their glow-up etc with pictures of them graduating, and claiming to be a doctor, are likely Nps They are the medical equivalent of a chihuahua, constantly barking as if they are tough shit and looking for attention. This would be comical, if the medical industry wasn't then assigning these chihuahuas to be guard dogs.

Note: I am not American and as such could have gotten some details wrong when it comes to the requirements for becoming a NP vs a MD. I also admittedly know next to nothing on the NP lobby, apart from the fact that it is a huge pain in the ass. Let me know if there are mistakes or information to add, and I'll make the changes.

Thanks for the OP, OP. I'm catching up through the thread, but so far you guys have already helped explain some things I've been seeing irl over the last year. Including things that have affected me directly.

 

[eternal dog mongler]

I am NP, and I graduated with my doctorate. I still believe most NPs should work under doctors. Even nurses should be able to spot an MI.

The big chain of urgent care clinics here is staffed with midlevels who are "supervised" by an MD that lives in a villa in Aspen. I don't know how they could even feel comfortable working in a situation like that.

Realistically NPs were meant to be a role that could be filled with nurses who have a lot of experience, but now you have a bunch of nurses using it to escape bedside as soon as humanly possible thanks to shitty inpatient working conditions.

 

[Shaka Brah]

The big chain of urgent care clinics here is staffed with midlevels who are "supervised" by an MD that lives in a villa in Aspen. I don't know how they could even feel comfortable working in a situation like that.

That's quite a terrifying way to skirt around the regulations.

 

[NoReturn]

From 2014 but I only learned about it recently.

 

[Least Concern]

From 2014 but I only learned about it recently.

Six months in jail and ten years probation? Way, way too light in my opinion. She could have killed somebody. Were there not more serious charges of medical malpractice they could have hit her with?

 

[Aunt Carol]

From 2014 but I only learned about it recently.

Horrible, but this isn't a midlevel; it's a rad tech acting alone to forge MD signatures.

Maybe we need a general malpractice thread. Expanded to medical Instathottery, it could be pretty full.

 

[NoReturn]

#nursesoftiktok

clatchetnurse
CLATCHET NURSE · 2020-8-6
reality vs expectation #nurseedition #nursehumor #nursesoftiktok #nurselife #nursingstudent inspired by : @zejalext
original sound - CLATCHET NURSE

nereyann
Nerey Ann · 2020-9-26
Run Me My Money #fyp #fypツ #nursetiktok #nursetiktoker #healthcarehumor #healthcareworker #healthcareworkersbelike #nurselife #over30 #nursehumor
COVID19 Financial Compensation - Logan

natturday1
Natturday1 · 5-30
Big mood #covidnurse #nurseblake #nursetiktok #nurse2021 #iwannathankmeforbelievinginme #nursing #fypシ #foryoupage #foryou #funny #nurse
original sound - 𝕻𝖗𝖊𝖙𝖙𝖞 𝖇♡︎𝖙𝖈𝖍

missyatwell1
Melissa Atwell · 1-12
#nurse2021
I Won't Let Go - Rascal Flatts

 

[behindyourightnow]

Statistically there is no difference in patient mortality or quality of life outcomes between midlevels and MDs, which is one of the reasons doctors are so butthurt about them. Of course this says more about doctors being massively incompetent as well than it does about midlevels being good.

 

[S.C.U.D.]

#nursesoftiktok
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Is the problem that they're nurses, or that they're women?

 

[eternal dog mongler]

Statistically there is no difference in patient mortality or quality of life outcomes between midlevels and MDs, which is one of the reasons doctors are so butthurt about them. Of course this says more about doctors being massively incompetent as well than it does about midlevels being good.

Most of the sperging about midlevels comes from Asian or Pajeet med students and residents.

Pajeet Patel, MD got beaten repeatedly by his parents who forced him to study hard to get into med school and now becoming an FNP makes more financial sense (it does.) Who wouldn't hold a grudge

 

[XYZpdq]

there was a doc I worked with for a while who loved talking shit about nurses being a pile of dumb histrionic bitches

 

[Scary Dairy]

I had to go to a clinic once because I woke up one morning with my eye swollen shut and it hurt to even try to open. At the time I worked with metal shavings and stuff so I was very concerned I had somehow gotten one in my eye. I was eventually seen by someone who I assumed was the doctor until somehow it came up that the doctor was on lunch and this was a nurse. She kept insisting I have pink eye even though this was nothing like pink eye and I had explained my concerns due to my job. She just gave me a script for eyedrops for pink eye and tossed me out. I immediately decided to go half way across the city to an actual eye doctor for a second opinion. A doctor examined me and said I had a scratched cornea cuz I apparently did have something in my eye but it must have come out at some point. I was fine after a few days but I got billed like $250 to not be seen by a doctor and told I have pink eye and then like another $300 for the actual doctor. And I missed work that day from all the time spent at both places which is what I was trying to avoid by going to the first one near my house. So that was all great. If they had told me there was no doctor on site I would have just went somewhere else in the first place.

 

[Buer]

#nursesoftiktok
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Tiktok was a mistake for mankind.

 

[Aunt Carol]

If we're just telling nurse stories, I knew a nurse who thought the singular of "TED hose" was "TED ho."

She was pretty hot.

 

[Chan the Wizard]

I’ve only had 1 bad NP experience and he was a fucking moron. He had patient folders stacked up all around the floor of his office. I looked him up after he had terrible online reviews. Looked him up again and he’s since been fired and his new office is just a PO Box.

 

[behindyourightnow]

Most of the sperging about midlevels comes from Asian or Pajeet med students and residents.

Pajeet Patel, MD got beaten repeatedly by his parents who forced him to study hard to get into med school and now becoming an FNP makes more financial sense (it does.) Who wouldn't hold a grudge

It sucks for them that the people making the hiring decisions figured out that they could hire people for cheaper to perform the same essential tasks that doctors do, such as misdiagnosing simple medical conditions and accusing people of wanting pain meds.