Resident Evil - Discuss Why Mr. X Is Gonna Give It To Ya

N

NN 401

Guest
kiwifarms.net
Incoming rant in 3... 2... 1...


I and a handful of other people must be the only ones who were disappointed with the RE2 remake.


This is a game that does a number of things with competency but nothing particularly great and it removed key things from the original that made it unique in the first place.

The graphics might be light but imo this is a mediocre game with limited reasons to replay it.

I’m convinced that the only reason this game has received anything higher than a 7 or 8 out of 10 is due to the fact that it plays the nostalgia angle and in this creatively bankrupt era, this has been one of the few true big budget “survival horror” single player games to come out.
Alien isolation came out 4 years ago. We haven’t had anything since.

I remember when these kinds of games were a dime a dozen in the wake of the Biohazard and Silent Hill franchises.

Had this remake come out during a time of plenty I can’t imagine anyone not noticing it’s numerous flaws.

Or pointing out that a remake is supposed to ADD things and preserve and improve the things we like not remove them completely!

How do you make an RE2 game without proper A/b scenarios period?

The worst part is that myself and everyone else just gave capcom 60 bucks for this shit!

knowing how this company operates any remake after this one will just be downhill from here on out.


Gameplay and design:

No, the gameplay isn’t broken or bad but there are a number of things that quickly went from tension inducing to frustrating.

zombies have always been bullet sponges because after all this a videogame but it seems like almost all the weapons had been nerfed in this game.

there is no conceivable reason why a magnum isn’t an goddamn insta kill with headshots.
Or why the shotgun can’t even stagger a zombie or knock them down from medium distance.

And why does it only hold FOUR GODDAMN SHELLS?

I get that it could be open to abuse with people knifing downed zombies but the OG game had a solution for that... by making the knife do so little damage everyone who wasn’t insane ditched it.

Instead they gave us the knife mechanic from RE4 then realized that everyone would spam the shit out of it so they made it have the consistency of a butter knife in terms of durability.
Then for added measure nerfed the shotgun so no one could effectively knock a shambling zombie to the ground and knife it to death.

What an inelegant solution.

The adaptive difficulty is implemented like a brick.
Apparently, not being a spaz and taking your time to aim for your target means instead of 10 bullets in the next room you get 3 and two lickers in a hallway slicing your ass into four.

This is especially egregious with Leon’s scenario. It felt like a sick joke ransacking a room only to find 3, and it was always 3, bullets.

RE4 had adaptive difficulty as well and it was so subtle I never noticed it until someone pointed it out.
It made the game challenging and fun to play.

In the remake this crossed into tedium reaaal quick and felt more like being punished for doing the right things.

And speaking of tedium...

I’m going to get a lot of hate for this but Mr. X also crossed that line from fun to tedious real quick.
Sitting in a save room waiting for his big ass to wander off lost it’s appeal with Claire’s scenario and then we had to do it again with Leon...

I would have preferred more randomized encounters leading to chase sequences than a fairly predictable patrol.

I will say it was fun opening a door or rounding a corner only to get surprised with a punch to the face because you managed to sneak up on him inadvertently. Topped off with everyone in the room yelling “JESUS CHRIST” along with Leon.



Level design:

I have no real problem with the level design except for certain aesthetic choices.

Cutting out the streets section from the OG really does a disservice as to why anyone would stay in the police station after all the horrible shit they find in it.

Yes, many of us died and got beat up on the way in the OG but I think that was the point. The police station is still SAFER than trying your luck out on the streets.

The pristine main entrance is supposed to underscore that. Instead, the developers cluttered it up that shitty reception desk and a whole load of scattered junk because “muh realism.”

The mansion feels a bit smaller around the MC but that might be just because of the OTS camera angles.


The labs are... short. And the switch from a red to a futuristic blue light invokes a completely different mood.
The lighting from the OG made it seem like you were descending into a kind of hell. Not here so much.


The orphanage can go die in a grease fire. It’s not that it was difficult it was just a really shitty and unnecessary short level that seemed like a waste of the dev’s time and resources.


Enemies:

Main issues with the enemies are almost all related to the adaptive difficulty and nerfed weapons.

Lickers were terrifying and they should have had a grand entrance FMV like in the original.

And I don’t know why Claire doesn’t get the window jump scare but Leon does

Sound and music:

This is a big enough issue that even the fanboys have to address it.

capcom stuck the OG music behind a paywall and but then also recorded new music for the remake that is barely used at all.

Wtf? Why?! That just seems like a waste of money.

Ambient sounds are supposed to invoke mood and be a gameplay feature.

We’re traversing the mansion in relative silence for what reason?

What am I listening for?

The zombies shriek and scream when they see you and Mr.X has his own soundtrack that follows him around whenever he gets near

There are the lickers but 90% of the time they’re hanging out in plain view.

It’s not like I’m listening for shuffling feet or soft moans to clue me in on where a zombie might be hanging out unseen. Or listening for the sibilant breath of a licker so I don’t go galloping off and alerting it.

The lack of creepy music took away a huge chunk of atmosphere.


Dialogue: absolute dog shit.

Iconic lines replaced with Multiple iterations of

“fuck” and “shit”

And “are you kidding me?!”

“Are you fucking kidding me?!”

You didn’t want to pay union VAs for this?!



However,


My biggest gripe is that the heart of this game is gone.

The story is a mess with barely any ties to RE 1, characters die multiple time or don’t interact meaningfully at all.


The A/B scenarios don’t exist...
there is no a/b scenario as we know it. Just a wa slap dash “second run” ‘mode leading to the massive plot holes.

Finally, the characters have diverged so far from what made them memorable I don’t recognize them anymore.

Claire looks and sounds like Jennifer Lawrence.
A bitchy anorexic Jennifer Lawrence that looks like she’s cosplaying as Lara Croft when she takes off her jacket and who barely shows any humanity.

The OG Claire was determined, tough and bad ass but she was also empathetic, warm and frankly seemed way more approachable.

A very balanced mix of masculine and feminine traits with an athletic and unique character design.

There is barely any bond between her and Shari in this remake and every line of dialogue is delivered through gritted teeth and generic rage.

A one note performance if there ever was one.

Oh, except that one time when she was weirdly flirting with Leon as a helicopter exploded behind them.

Fantastic.


Leon:

I am not one to utilize Redpill terminology but the word “cuck” adequately describes what they did to him.

The OG Leon was hot headed, and easily frustrated by people but he took charge, and he operated from a sense of duty to his position as a police officer.
And he certainly wasn’t stupid like he is in this game.

“Hur dur I Have to ask my boss.”
“Hur dur me am stupid boy who think w/ penis!”
“Hur dur I’m getting the G virus for evidence!”

He stands there like a twit while Ben begs him to let him out of his cell as he is being mauled by Birkin (?).

The OG Leon would have at least been horrified by his inability to save Ben. This one barely registers his death like some kind of dim witted sociopath.


And how the fuck does a rookie police officer not know how an FBI agent is supposed to look like and behave?

And why the fuck does CLAIRE have to tell HIM to get to the police station?

“OMG it’s not safe here for me Claire!”

Wtf?

Ada:

This woman is a cunt and she went out like the cunt she is.

The OG Ada was disarming, cool headed and did shit on her own terms including dying in the most bad ass way anyone has ever died in the RE series bar none.

Are we supposed to be impressed by her shitty treatment of Leon, her lingerie and trench coat get up, and her use of her sexuality to manipulate him?

Is this supposed to be a “strong female character”?

How is it that the 98 version was somehow less corny by many magnitudes regarding Ada and Leon’s interactions and made her a truly formidable female character?

Fun fact: why the hell didn’t Ada use her stupid emp gun to get out of the parking garage instead of sending step n fetch it Leon to get a key card?


Annette, chief irons, William Birkin... every one of them suffered tremendously either where the writers crammed too many motivations into a character(Annette) or reduced them to a caricature of a caricature (Chief Irons).

Birkin dies like an idiot as well whining about how no one is going to take away his precious by trying to get the drop on a pair of Umbrella spec ops people... with a HAND GUN.
Instead, of it being an accident like it was in the OG. Yes, he had a gun in that version too but he wasn’t brandishing it. He knew that so long as he had the g virus samples they wouldn’t shoot him on purpose.

I’m sensing a trend here for in this game with the stupefying of the male characters...


Anyways this has become a massive essay so

Tl; dr watch this video instead from someone else
https://youtu.be/Cqr69w5wSx4
 
U

UE 558

Guest
kiwifarms.net
Incoming rant in 3... 2... 1...


I and a handful of other people must be the only ones who were disappointed with the RE2 remake.


This is a game that does a number of things with competency but nothing particularly great and it removed key things from the original that made it unique in the first place.

The graphics might be light but imo this is a mediocre game with limited reasons to replay it.

I’m convinced that the only reason this game has received anything higher than a 7 or 8 out of 10 is due to the fact that it plays the nostalgia angle and in this creatively bankrupt era, this has been one of the few true big budget “survival horror” single player games to come out.
Alien isolation came out 4 years ago. We haven’t had anything since.

I remember when these kinds of games were a dime a dozen in the wake of the Biohazard and Silent Hill franchises.

Had this remake come out during a time of plenty I can’t imagine anyone not noticing it’s numerous flaws.

Or pointing out that a remake is supposed to ADD things and preserve and improve the things we like not remove them completely!

How do you make an RE2 game without proper A/b scenarios period?

The worst part is that myself and everyone else just gave capcom 60 bucks for this shit!

knowing how this company operates any remake after this one will just be downhill from here on out.


Gameplay and design:

No, the gameplay isn’t broken or bad but there are a number of things that quickly went from tension inducing to frustrating.

zombies have always been bullet sponges because after all this a videogame but it seems like almost all the weapons had been nerfed in this game.

there is no conceivable reason why a magnum isn’t an goddamn insta kill with headshots.
Or why the shotgun can’t even stagger a zombie or knock them down from medium distance.

And why does it only hold FOUR GODDAMN SHELLS?

I get that it could be open to abuse with people knifing downed zombies but the OG game had a solution for that... by making the knife do so little damage everyone who wasn’t insane ditched it.

Instead they gave us the knife mechanic from RE4 then realized that everyone would spam the shit out of it so they made it have the consistency of a butter knife in terms of durability.
Then for added measure nerfed the shotgun so no one could effectively knock a shambling zombie to the ground and knife it to death.

What an inelegant solution.

The adaptive difficulty is implemented like a brick.
Apparently, not being a spaz and taking your time to aim for your target means instead of 10 bullets in the next room you get 3 and two lickers in a hallway slicing your ass into four.

This is especially egregious with Leon’s scenario. It felt like a sick joke ransacking a room only to find 3, and it was always 3, bullets.

RE4 had adaptive difficulty as well and it was so subtle I never noticed it until someone pointed it out.
It made the game challenging and fun to play.

In the remake this crossed into tedium reaaal quick and felt more like being punished for doing the right things.

And speaking of tedium...

I’m going to get a lot of hate for this but Mr. X also crossed that line from fun to tedious real quick.
Sitting in a save room waiting for his big ass to wander off lost it’s appeal with Claire’s scenario and then we had to do it again with Leon...

I would have preferred more randomized encounters leading to chase sequences than a fairly predictable patrol.

I will say it was fun opening a door or rounding a corner only to get surprised with a punch to the face because you managed to sneak up on him inadvertently. Topped off with everyone in the room yelling “JESUS CHRIST” along with Leon.



Level design:

I have no real problem with the level design except for certain aesthetic choices.

Cutting out the streets section from the OG really does a disservice as to why anyone would stay in the police station after all the horrible shit they find in it.

Yes, many of us died and got beat up on the way in the OG but I think that was the point. The police station is still SAFER than trying your luck out on the streets.

The pristine main entrance is supposed to underscore that. Instead, the developers cluttered it up that shitty reception desk and a whole load of scattered junk because “muh realism.”

The mansion feels a bit smaller around the MC but that might be just because of the OTS camera angles.


The labs are... short. And the switch from a red to a futuristic blue light invokes a completely different mood.
The lighting from the OG made it seem like you were descending into a kind of hell. Not here so much.


The orphanage can go die in a grease fire. It’s not that it was difficult it was just a really shitty and unnecessary short level that seemed like a waste of the dev’s time and resources.


Enemies:

Main issues with the enemies are almost all related to the adaptive difficulty and nerfed weapons.

Lickers were terrifying and they should have had a grand entrance FMV like in the original.

And I don’t know why Claire doesn’t get the window jump scare but Leon does

Sound and music:

This is a big enough issue that even the fanboys have to address it.

capcom stuck the OG music behind a paywall and but then also recorded new music for the remake that is barely used at all.

Wtf? Why?! That just seems like a waste of money.

Ambient sounds are supposed to invoke mood and be a gameplay feature.

We’re traversing the mansion in relative silence for what reason?

What am I listening for?

The zombies shriek and scream when they see you and Mr.X has his own soundtrack that follows him around whenever he gets near

There are the lickers but 90% of the time they’re hanging out in plain view.

It’s not like I’m listening for shuffling feet or soft moans to clue me in on where a zombie might be hanging out unseen. Or listening for the sibilant breath of a licker so I don’t go galloping off and alerting it.

The lack of creepy music took away a huge chunk of atmosphere.


Dialogue: absolute dog shit.

Iconic lines replaced with Multiple iterations of

“fuck” and “shit”

And “are you kidding me?!”

“Are you fucking kidding me?!”

You didn’t want to pay union VAs for this?!



However,


My biggest gripe is that the heart of this game is gone.

The story is a mess with barely any ties to RE 1, characters die multiple time or don’t interact meaningfully at all.


The A/B scenarios don’t exist...
there is no a/b scenario as we know it. Just a wa slap dash “second run” ‘mode leading to the massive plot holes.

Finally, the characters have diverged so far from what made them memorable I don’t recognize them anymore.

Claire looks and sounds like Jennifer Lawrence.
A bitchy anorexic Jennifer Lawrence that looks like she’s cosplaying as Lara Croft when she takes off her jacket and who barely shows any humanity.

The OG Claire was determined, tough and bad ass but she was also empathetic, warm and frankly seemed way more approachable.

A very balanced mix of masculine and feminine traits with an athletic and unique character design.

There is barely any bond between her and Shari in this remake and every line of dialogue is delivered through gritted teeth and generic rage.

A one note performance if there ever was one.

Oh, except that one time when she was weirdly flirting with Leon as a helicopter exploded behind them.

Fantastic.


Leon:

I am not one to utilize Redpill terminology but the word “cuck” adequately describes what they did to him.

The OG Leon was hot headed, and easily frustrated by people but he took charge, and he operated from a sense of duty to his position as a police officer.
And he certainly wasn’t stupid like he is in this game.

“Hur dur I Have to ask my boss.”
“Hur dur me am stupid boy who think w/ penis!”
“Hur dur I’m getting the G virus for evidence!”

He stands there like a twit while Ben begs him to let him out of his cell as he is being mauled by Birkin (?).

The OG Leon would have at least been horrified by his inability to save Ben. This one barely registers his death like some kind of dim witted sociopath.


And how the fuck does a rookie police officer not know how an FBI agent is supposed to look like and behave?

And why the fuck does CLAIRE have to tell HIM to get to the police station?

“OMG it’s not safe here for me Claire!”

Wtf?

Ada:

This woman is a cunt and she went out like the cunt she is.

The OG Ada was disarming, cool headed and did shit on her own terms including dying in the most bad ass way anyone has ever died in the RE series bar none.

Are we supposed to be impressed by her shitty treatment of Leon, her lingerie and trench coat get up, and her use of her sexuality to manipulate him?

Is this supposed to be a “strong female character”?

How is it that the 98 version was somehow less corny by many magnitudes regarding Ada and Leon’s interactions and made her a truly formidable female character?

Fun fact: why the hell didn’t Ada use her stupid emp gun to get out of the parking garage instead of sending step n fetch it Leon to get a key card?


Annette, chief irons, William Birkin... every one of them suffered tremendously either where the writers crammed too many motivations into a character(Annette) or reduced them to a caricature of a caricature (Chief Irons).

Birkin dies like an idiot as well whining about how no one is going to take away his precious by trying to get the drop on a pair of Umbrella spec ops people... with a HAND GUN.
Instead, of it being an accident like it was in the OG. Yes, he had a gun in that version too but he wasn’t brandishing it. He knew that so long as he had the g virus samples they wouldn’t shoot him on purpose.

I’m sensing a trend here for in this game with the stupefying of the male characters...


Anyways this has become a massive essay so

Tl; dr watch this video instead from someone else
https://youtu.be/Cqr69w5wSx4
You need a cigarette or something, you seem kinda tense
 
N

NN 401

Guest
kiwifarms.net
Outlast 2? Darkwood? Evil Within 2? RE7?

C'mon bruh
We haven’t had anything on the scale of alien isolation since then until RE7 as you pointed out.

2 of those were indie titles.

Outlast 2’s creators did exactly what I was afraid they would do which is double down on the shock factor thinking that’s what made them successful with outlast 1 and whistleblower.

I’ll give you Resi 7 but no one seems to really like the Evil Within franchise no matter how much money was dumped into it.

There is still a drought in the industry. The same industry that up and declares that this genre doesn’t make money.
 

Duncan Hills Coffee

Awakes you from a thousand deaths
kiwifarms.net
I’m going to get a lot of hate for this but Mr. X also crossed that line from fun to tedious real quick.
Sitting in a save room waiting for his big ass to wander off lost it’s appeal with Claire’s scenario and then we had to do it again with Leon...

I would have preferred more randomized encounters leading to chase sequences than a fairly predictable patrol.

I will say it was fun opening a door or rounding a corner only to get surprised with a punch to the face because you managed to sneak up on him inadvertently. Topped off with everyone in the room yelling “JESUS CHRIST” along with Leon.
Mr. X straight up killed the game for me because I found him to be extremely annoying. I never figured out how to lose him, and with the game just deciding to spawn more lickers I had nowhere to run to get him to stop. That said, I wasn't having a lot of fun with the game up until that point so he was more or less just the final nail in the coffin.

No, the gameplay isn’t broken or bad but there are a number of things that quickly went from tension inducing to frustrating.

zombies have always been bullet sponges because after all this a videogame but it seems like almost all the weapons had been nerfed in this game.
This wasn't so much an issue for me since in theory having more resilient zombies would make it more terrifying. My problem is their grab range, which is straight up unfair in the extremely narrow hallways the game runs you through. If you're so much as a couple feet away from them, they will latch onto you and do insane amounts of damage. One of my favorite things to do in the OG Resident Evil games was outmaneuvering zombies, especially in 2 where the animations were easy to read and the zombies had slower reaction times. You can't really do that in the remake, which is a major reason why I find it a weaker experience. There's no way to squeeze through a pack of zombies and make it through without expending a single bullet. I mean hell, RE4 allowed you to squeeze by enemies easily and that game had much more aggressive enemies.

I never figured out how I was supposed to get by the zombies in the game, especially when there were two blocking the halls. And I especially never figured out how to do it using as little ammo as possible since I ended up wasting a ton just trying to get through. It says a lot that the most fun moments in the game for me were the moments where there were no zombies just so I wouldn't have to deal with them.
 
N

NN 401

Guest
kiwifarms.net
Mr. X straight up killed the game for me because I found him to be extremely annoying. I never figured out how to lose him, and with the game just deciding to spawn more lickers I had nowhere to run to get him to stop. That said, I wasn't having a lot of fun with the game up until that point so he was more or less just the final nail in the coffin.


This wasn't so much an issue for me since in theory having more resilient zombies would make it more terrifying. My problem is their grab range, which is straight up unfair in the extremely narrow hallways the game runs you through. If you're so much as a couple feet away from them, they will latch onto you and do insane amounts of damage. One of my favorite things to do in the OG Resident Evil games was outmaneuvering zombies, especially in 2 where the animations were easy to read and the zombies had slower reaction times. You can't really do that in the remake, which is a major reason why I find it a weaker experience. There's no way to squeeze through a pack of zombies and make it through without expending a single bullet. I mean hell, RE4 allowed you to squeeze by enemies easily and that game had much more aggressive enemies.

I never figured out how I was supposed to get by the zombies in the game, especially when there were two blocking the halls. And I especially never figured out how to do it using as little ammo as possible since I ended up wasting a ton just trying to get through. It says a lot that the most fun moments in the game for me were the moments where there were no zombies just so I wouldn't have to deal with them.

I forgot about this but fuckin’ A.

The inability to evade was a far bigger problem than the weapons damage being wonky.

You also used to be able to push zombies into other zombies, even knocking them down sometimes, for some breathing space but not in the ReMake.


It was cycle of get bit, stab/grenade (which does no splash damage) them and then pump them full of bullets. Run out of bullets, then have to rely on your knife which means getting bit while using them. :/
We burned through a lot of health items doing this.
 

Judge Dredd

Associate Game Designer
kiwifarms.net
I hated the shotgun changes too. I think it was because, with practice, it was an instant point blank decap. It can turn some portions of the game into a joke.

We haven’t had anything on the scale of alien isolation since then until RE7 as you pointed out.

2 of those were indie titles.

Outlast 2’s creators did exactly what I was afraid they would do which is double down on the shock factor thinking that’s what made them successful with outlast 1 and whistleblower.

I’ll give you Resi 7 but no one seems to really like the Evil Within franchise no matter how much money was dumped into it.

There is still a drought in the industry. The same industry that up and declares that this genre doesn’t make money.
By your own logic, the "dime a dozen" golden age of horror games didn't exist either. Most horror games were mid budget games. You could argue that the split between big budget, middle market, and indie has gotten bigger. But games like Project Zero, Overblood, and Cold Fear were not pulling in Resident Evil or Silent Hill money.

I think you could make the case that games with a fixed camera and tank controls need to make a return. Vaccine was hated and Banned Memories still hasn't come out. I won't be surprised if we see it become an indie fad once this throwback FPS fad is done.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: Syaoran Li

Oh Shit I'm Sorry

MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM
kiwifarms.net
Horror games are probably the hardest ones to actually make correctly. Most of the time people just make an action game and slap horror elements (ie, jump scares) onto it (which is something RE too is guilty of, primarily with 5 and 6). Dead Space is a good example of this. It's got great atmosphere (and not just cuz it's in space) but in terms of actual "horror" the only things it really has to offer are jump scares which it relies on to an almost laughable extent. Yahtzee's DS2 review did a good job of explaining it, the first time a monster that was pretending to be dead jumps up and attacks you you jump in your seat a bit but then it happens 50 or 60 more times over the course of the game and it ultimately just annoys you. The most tension I got out of the series was doing the 3 save run in 2 and that's just cuz I didn't wanna lose hours of progress. They're worth playing for the neat setpieces and sound and level design but they take themselves far too seriously for games about monsters jumping out of closets (or in this case, vents).

Then you have adventure games where the main problem is making death actually scary when all it does it respawn you a short distance away. Outlast 2 is the perfect example of that because the whole game is pretty much based around trying not to die and almost everything in it can kill you (as opposed to something like Amnesia or Penumbra where you've puzzles or exploring to break up the action/stealth segments). The worst thing about the game is that you're pretty much guaranteed to die almost immediately given the very first Marta encounter barely a couple minutes in that comes out of nowhere and is almost impossible to react to on one's first playthrough. There is of course the option to introduce permadeath (which the Outlast games have) but the problem there becomes trying to keep it from becoming too frustrating (which is something O2 definitely struggles with).

For the record I'd still rec O2 even with all of its problems. The atmosphere is great, the graphics are fantastic and the school setpieces in particular are absolutely phenomenal. Though nothing is ever gonna top that one moment in Whistleblower (you know which one I'm talking about)

RE7 got off to a great start with you trapped in a unfamiliar house being slowly stalked by an unkillable family man and his bugwife but then the second half turned into a goo monster shooter which was disappointing (still wholeheartedly recommend it though). RE2make was tense for a little while but once you learned all X can do is punch you and you can hide in saferooms it became a lot less so (a mod that makes him follow you everywhere and/or turns him into a Dr. Salvador instakill would probably break the game's balance but make it a hell of a lot more nerve-wracking).

I dunno, maybe I'm just too picky in my old age. You'll probably never see true AAA horror games, you need guns and lots of monsters to shoot because that's what audiences want so it's up to the smaller budget titles (like Darkwood) instead.
 

CitizenJane

Very naughty girl
kiwifarms.net
The other day I made a thread about this, but it got locked so I guess I'll post it here if anyone is interested. This article details Resident Evil 4's imagery, setting, and cult. Quite interesting imo. It also points out that Shinji Mikami seems to be a conspiracy nut, and did anyone else notice this guy seems to be wearing Leon's jacket in the teaser for Ghostwire?

Screenshot_2019-06-27-GhostWire-Tokyo-–-Official-E3-Teaser---YouTube.jpg
 
N

NN 401

Guest
kiwifarms.net
I hated the shotgun changes too. I think it was because, with practice, it was an instant point blank decap. It can turn some portions of the game into a joke.


By your own logic, the "dime a dozen" golden age of horror games didn't exist either. Most horror games were mid budget games. You could argue that the split between big budget, middle market, and indie has gotten bigger. But games like Project Zero, Overblood, and Cold Fear were not pulling in Resident Evil or Silent Hill money.

I think you could make the case that games with a fixed camera and tank controls need to make a return. Vaccine was hated and Banned Memories still hasn't come out. I won't be surprised if we see it become an indie fad once this throwback FPS fad is done.

To be fair I’m probably getting the derth of single player experiences mixed up with the overall poor showing horror games have had until recently.

So I’ll grant you that.

It just seems like back in the day we were seriously spoiled for choice and now not so much.

I’d point out that despite the lack of any real broken game mechanics people weren’t lining up to open their wallets with the Residen Evil Series after, arguably, the heights 2 reached.


If it hadn’t been for re4 the series would have been binned after Code Veronica.

I guess my point is that had the RE2make come out during a different era people would be quicker to point out the distinct lack of key features being translated and the lack of content period.
 
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Reactions: Syaoran Li

kadoink

kiwifarms.net
I haven't played RE2Remake but after watching loads of videos and stuff I went from dying to buy it, to wanting to avoid it instead.

First problem is the games music. Its not bad by any means, but I have a huge problem with them making up new music for the Remake and not doing what the Previous REmake did where they took all the games music and updated it with a beautiful orchestral soundtrack. It just doesn't have the same feeling to it and is something I could have done without, and that summarizes how I feel about the game as a whole.

There are a lot of really great things the dev team did with the game and its easy to see they worked their asses off on it...but theres just a lot of stuff that doesnt really sit right with me. First, cut content. The removal of the Ivy plants and the Web Spinners was disappointing. They were the enemies who dealt poison damage and provided more monster variety that the game really needs. The plant zombie Ivy replacements doesn't work for me, if that was an entirely new enemy I'd be cool with it though.

The changes to Annette Birkins character pissed me off. In the original game she's a half crazy grieving widow desperate to protect her work as well as Williams legacy from Umbrella. Shes got little idea of whats going on outside of the lab and isn't right mentally due to the trauma of everything thats happened. This is wonderful conflict for a character to have because it ultimately splits her goals: Save Sherry, Save the G virus. Her reaction to William being shot up was a really big moment in the game because it was the catalyst for raccoon cities demise.

In the new game shes pretty much "Meh, my marriage is poop. Gotta work on SuperAids" walks in and finds William shot up and giving himself Super Aids "What'd ya do‽" Then she mulls over killing him but naws out and spends the bulk of the story trying to fix her mistakes. Thats really fucking faggy and weak. She was a great antagonist in the original game because of everything she was going through.

She went from Mad Scientist to Sad Scientist, trapped in a loveless marriage who cared more about her work than anything else...They went out of their way to make her more of a victim trying to make things right and it doesn't work.

Also theres a lot more they could have done with Brian Irons and they just oversimplified things and it felt a little lazy.

The team did expand on the games settings some, which was nice, but they didn't go far enough. In the first remake the expanded content(The Lisa Trevor arc) was a good 30% or so of the game, and it all flowed beautiful. It looks like theres only an extra 15% or so expanded content(The Orphanage, RPD re-design) but theres no new monster arc to go with it to add a sub plot.

I think that they ran out of time on this game and ended up cutting out chunks of the project to make the deadline. I know this happens to games a lot of times, but I suspect that the game was going to be a little larger than it is and they had to scale back when things go rough. I know they spent a lot of time trying to sort out whether or not to include the gator among other things.

But in the end as a remake I'd give it a 6/10. Theres just a lot more they could have done storywise, gameplay wise, and monsterwise.
 

Sinners Sandwich

Eid Htrad Redav Eid !
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The other day I made a thread about this, but it got locked so I guess I'll post it here if anyone is interested. This article details Resident Evil 4's imagery, setting, and cult. Quite interesting imo. It also points out that Shinji Mikami seems to be a conspiracy nut, and did anyone else notice this guy seems to be wearing Leon's jacket in the teaser for Ghostwire?

View attachment 817841
I really love the lovecraftian elements in RE4.

A strange village, a cult, ancient creatures (plagas) which turn people & animals into tentacle monsters and so on.

This could be straight out of a Lovecraft novel.
 

RadicalCentrist

kiwifarms.net
But in the end as a remake I'd give it a 6/10. Theres just a lot more they could have done storywise, gameplay wise, and monsterwise.
Agreed 100%. It was quite the spectacle the first time through, but I couldn't be bothered to do the half-assed B scenario.

Once you realize the gameplay is set up for speedrunners, you blaze through it.

This could be straight out of a Lovecraft novel.
Lol what? The central aspect of Lovecraftian horror isn't the window dressing, it's the protagonists utter helplessness in the story.

Leon in RE4 butchers every enemy he faces with a murderboner that cannot be denied. It's fun to be sure but let's not kid ourselves.
 

Duncan Hills Coffee

Awakes you from a thousand deaths
kiwifarms.net
Horror games are probably the hardest ones to actually make correctly. Most of the time people just make an action game and slap horror elements (ie, jump scares) onto it (which is something RE too is guilty of, primarily with 5 and 6). Dead Space is a good example of this. It's got great atmosphere (and not just cuz it's in space) but in terms of actual "horror" the only things it really has to offer are jump scares which it relies on to an almost laughable extent. Yahtzee's DS2 review did a good job of explaining it, the first time a monster that was pretending to be dead jumps up and attacks you you jump in your seat a bit but then it happens 50 or 60 more times over the course of the game and it ultimately just annoys you. The most tension I got out of the series was doing the 3 save run in 2 and that's just cuz I didn't wanna lose hours of progress. They're worth playing for the neat setpieces and sound and level design but they take themselves far too seriously for games about monsters jumping out of closets (or in this case, vents).

Then you have adventure games where the main problem is making death actually scary when all it does it respawn you a short distance away. Outlast 2 is the perfect example of that because the whole game is pretty much based around trying not to die and almost everything in it can kill you (as opposed to something like Amnesia or Penumbra where you've puzzles or exploring to break up the action/stealth segments). The worst thing about the game is that you're pretty much guaranteed to die almost immediately given the very first Marta encounter barely a couple minutes in that comes out of nowhere and is almost impossible to react to on one's first playthrough. There is of course the option to introduce permadeath (which the Outlast games have) but the problem there becomes trying to keep it from becoming too frustrating (which is something O2 definitely struggles with).

For the record I'd still rec O2 even with all of its problems. The atmosphere is great, the graphics are fantastic and the school setpieces in particular are absolutely phenomenal. Though nothing is ever gonna top that one moment in Whistleblower (you know which one I'm talking about)

RE7 got off to a great start with you trapped in a unfamiliar house being slowly stalked by an unkillable family man and his bugwife but then the second half turned into a goo monster shooter which was disappointing (still wholeheartedly recommend it though). RE2make was tense for a little while but once you learned all X can do is punch you and you can hide in saferooms it became a lot less so (a mod that makes him follow you everywhere and/or turns him into a Dr. Salvador instakill would probably break the game's balance but make it a hell of a lot more nerve-wracking).

I dunno, maybe I'm just too picky in my old age. You'll probably never see true AAA horror games, you need guns and lots of monsters to shoot because that's what audiences want so it's up to the smaller budget titles (like Darkwood) instead.
My general problem with horror games is that they walk a very thin line between scary and annoying. The original Resident Evil is a perfect example; the zombies are scary to deal with because they can do a lot of damage but if you're good enough you can figure out how to run around them in the narrow hallways. It's still nerve-wracking because there is a chance it can go wrong, but for the most part it feels natural and scary. The hunters in the second half of the game however are the exact opposite. You can't really run around them since they're such wide targets, they attack much faster, and they have a super-deadly jump swipe that can decapitate and they're invincible while they're jumping. They're super irritating to deal with. I don't find it scary, I just find it annoying.

Even modern Resident Evil has this issue for me. I've already bitched about RE2Make, but RE7 has shades of it as well. That basement before the chainsaw duel is the single worst area in the game for me; the Molded are so annoying to deal with with just the pistol, and I don't know if it's because I'm using a controller since I'm a console pleb, but the aiming is so finicky I have trouble landing headshots. I die more often in that basement than literally anywhere else in the game. And it's the point where the atmosphere dies for me and it just turns to sheer frustration. And it's a shame since the rest of the game is so good and isn't nearly as irritating.

Or to give a non RE example, Harvester falls apart completely when combat is introduced, which sucks since the game's got such a rich and creepy tone. The second half becomes a lite survival horror with some of the best scares in the whole game, but the mere act of fighting feels so broken that the game becomes a slog.

I get that the games have to have dangerous enemies to maintain the atmosphere, but it really is a balancing act between having something be dangerous yet scary and something being flat out annoying.
 

Judge Dredd

Associate Game Designer
kiwifarms.net
First problem is the games music. Its not bad by any means, but I have a huge problem with them making up new music for the Remake and not doing what the Previous REmake did where they took all the games music and updated it with a beautiful orchestral soundtrack. It just doesn't have the same feeling to it and is something I could have done without, and that summarizes how I feel about the game as a whole.
The deluxe edition (or whatever it was called) had an option to use the original soundtrack, and it doesn't fit the game at all. It's too different of a game, the transitions between areas is faster and smoother. It results in jarring cuts and music that either overshadows what's happening or plain seems out of place. The exception in the 4th survivor mode.

Once you realize the gameplay is set up for speedrunners, you blaze through it.
Was it? Because that unskippable Sherry stealth section and to a lesser extent to Leon walk and talk section hurts replayablity a lot.

I get that the games have to have dangerous enemies to maintain the atmosphere, but it really is a balancing act between having something be dangerous yet scary and something being flat out annoying.
It's also something that is impossible to get right in the age of the internet.
Take ammo rationing. I've seen people complain original RE2 has too much ammo. I don't see a similar complaint about the Silent Hill games despite being able to easily avoid most monsters outside and bash their head in with a pipe when inside. In REmake 2 I thought the game was way too stingy with ammo. But on repeat plays it's trivial to make it through the game with ammo to spare. Especially if you learn to set up the shotgun decap and shoot the legs.

I agree the enemies should have been avoidable, but at the same time there are people who still criticize the enemies for being too dumb. I don't where the middle ground is that would make people happy. Maybe it's impossible and you have to choose a portion of the player base to piss off.
 

Duncan Hills Coffee

Awakes you from a thousand deaths
kiwifarms.net
Shoot the knees you aimless dorks.
For REmake 2? I've tried it and I know it's supposed to stun them but I swear it doesn't work for me, especially when there are multiple zombies. Half the time I end up destroying their legs entirely and reduce them to crawling, which I almost find worse since they're harder to notice, especially when I'm getting chased.

I dunno, the most frustrating thing about REmake 2 for me is that all the strategies and methods people use to get around zombies don't work for me and in some cases make it more difficult. I do think I just totally suck at the game though so maybe I'm just not good enough.
 
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ProfDongs

kiwifarms.net
For REmake 2? I've tried it and I know it's supposed to stun them but I swear it doesn't work for me, especially when there are multiple zombies. Half the time I end up destroying their legs entirely and reduce them to crawling, which I almost find worse since they're harder to notice, especially when I'm getting chased.

I dunno, the most frustrating thing about REmake 2 for me is that all the strategies and methods people use to get around zombies don't work for me and in some cases make it more difficult. I do think I just totally suck at the game though so maybe I'm just not good enough.
I find that just a few quick popshots at the head work better than body or limb hits generally with handguns. You get the benefit of random crits as well that will permanently down them. If you're going for a ranked run never bother with focus aim, the benefits are trivial. If there's any stagger from their moving animation or lunge animation at all you open up a few seconds to get past them. If you're dealing with a zombie thats in the standing up animation you have no worries for the most part until the second after they finish standing up. Zombies that start focused on a wall with their head a little bit down you can run beside them before they go into the a regular active state. If you're running behind an active zombie that hasn't noticed you then they have a quick turn into a grab but I think they only have a left quick turn so if you run on the right your safer generally.

For CC grenades and flash are your best option although thats generally not too much of an issue except for a few parts (unless you let too many build up). Mainly the part right after getting the card from Ben with Leon, and when you have to get the jack from hallway with the lickers if you haven't cleared them out prior or boarded up the windows are when crowds could be an issue. With Claire and the submachine gun knee shots aren't bad but you can still get a decent stagger on zombies with small bursts to the head. There is also apparently a way to get out of side grabs as well but I'm not sure on the mechanics for it, when they grab you from the left or right by the shoulder there is a way to push them off you and keep you moving forward but it only happened by luck for me mostly.

Adult G and the Dogs I found to have the more dangerous attacks for the most part because you can just get grabbed immediately seemingly without an animation from the G, and the Dogs can just graze you get a free small bite on you.

I'm probably just an apologist, fanboy, blind or something but I never had too many issues with the game.

Edit: The part about standing up animations might be inaccurate because I haven't played much at all recently but thats what I remember when I was really into the game.
 

desertfoxgoggles

romantic~
kiwifarms.net
I'm a little special so bare with me, but I can get why some people aren't big fans of RE2remake.
I've played the RE2 remake literally over around 50 times (because I'm an extremely sad, autistic human being) and I can totally see people's gripes with it.
I'm a huge fan of the original. It's one of my all time favourite video games. The remake went wrong for me in certain aspects.
For example, the characterisations - Claire's model was wrong from the get-go (the plump face and weird teeth felt like they'd deliberately made her weird looking) but her characterisation was pretty spot on, Leon's characterisation felt extremely flip-floppy. As stated above, in the original, he comes across as frustrated, bossy and a little short-tempted. You can tell he's a good guy and a rookie, but he also comes across as someone who could fend for himself. In this one he just feels a little double-edged. He plays and achieves feats like the original Leon while simultaneously sounding like a fifteen year old totally taken aback and being walked all over by everybody around him. Ada was great in this game but fucking hell that 'secret weapon time' line is terrible and Barry Burton is ashamed of you Capcom. I also hated what they did to Chief Irons. In the old game, he was an articulate rapist who focused on his taxidermy and came across as a nihilistic weirdo who simultaneously seemed a little threatening (ESPECIALLY to a young woman). In the remake, he's just some fat, sweaty douchebag who beats around Claire a little. Talk about dumbing down a villain, even if you do see his OG self as over the top or silly (that was RE).
Anyway, Gameplay wise. I was very disappointed by the tossed in B scenario. Capcom. If you didn't have the time to make it properly, you shouldn't have put it in. The first ten minutes are different and aside from a few changed up items, it was largely the same as the A scenario. I think the game would have benefited greatly from a randomiser mode rather than the B mode. It would have kept fans happy while bringing something new to the game. (Hell, Ben Powell's randomizer is the reason I've played it so many times!)
Difficulty wise, the hardcore mode is stupid. I've beaten it a number of times on Hardcore and can get S+ now, but it wasn't enjoyable when I started to try it and I think for a lot of old fans, this was a little jarring. One zombie bite and you're in danger? Not cool. The lack of inventory space and the lack of bullets is superb, but the weird hitboxes and insane damage you take is just a little sad. Not to mention, Standard mode is so incredibly easy in comparison. The spike in difficulty doesn't make much sense.
I also felt some things were rushed in the game. Story-wise. It really seems like if you played through this game having never played an RE game before, you'd have no clue what was happening. Even playing the campaigns back-to-back is jarring and doesn't make much sense. The game really expects you to have played the original, which, while understandable - is still a little lazy.
I didn't think much of the additional content either - Hunk and Tofu were good fun as always but the Ghost Survivors felt like a little bit of a let down. I sort of wanted to see more of these characters, they might as well have done a Revelations style mercenaries with them as it would have been more enjoyable (if they didn't want to give them characters).
The music as well. I know some people jizz over the remake music but it really isn't that great. Super Tyrant theme and Hunk's theme are bomb but the silent noises otherwise aren't great.
All in all, the game is a great little game. It's (somewhat) replayable (get a randomizer) and I'd recommend it to most newbie fans of the series but there are definitely silly mistakes that it makes that affect it's overall likeability. I can totally see why some people have gripes with it.
OH and shooting knees? Fuck that, one pop in the head you good, fam, just run past them bitches.
 
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NN 401

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Idk what it was, maybe we played on hard by accident, but the chance for a head shot crit did not come often enough and just scalped zombies without killing them.

Shooting them in the legs just made them crawl up our asses.

Also, the magnum wasn’t any real improvement especially since it wasn’t the insta kill that it was in the OG.
 
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