Right-wing apathy - I just wanna grill, dammit!

LurkTrawl

If being good was easy the world would be paradise
kiwifarms.net
Note the emphasis on extreme polarization and intractable political differences.

When people talk about how the 9-to-5 is dreary and soulless, how no one can afford a home, how we're all increasingly up to our eyeballs in debt, how our foreign policy is insane and our public works are falling apart, the conversation is inevitably steered away from those things and back onto an approved set of hot-button issues that are intrinsically polarizing and yet do not threaten the ambitions of the extractor class; race, gender, sexuality, sexual liberation, gay marriage, et cetera. In other words, things that have nothing to do with money, wages, debts, labor, pensions, education, the economy and the balance of jobs in general, or any foreign or domestic policy of real-world importance or impact.
While I agree with the concept in general the problem with this outlook is that it supposes that both sides are capable of coming together to find a solution for most of the problems on which they disagree. There are real irreconcilable differences between the right and left, and areas in which there's no room for compromise. For instance, how do you explain to (and convince) someone who wants the minimum wage to be raised that the problem could be solved alternatively by a considerable slowdown or even full-on halt of immigration, throwing out illegals, and policies that incentivize businesses to make their products in the U.S. instead of abroad?
How do you convince someone who believes that college debt is a personal problem that shouldn't be solved by the government, that a government that's already in staggering amounts of debt should foot the bill instead of the person who took the loan?
How do you convince someone who believes in universal healthcare that a better start would be further regulation of insurance companies and hospitals?
I could go on and on, but I think you get my point. It's not as simple as "oh these are differences that could be put aside if we only came together". There's just some things that people simply either won't or can't negotiate. Not to even get into the fact that the social issues are viewed by either side as equally important, and not without good reason either. Nobody who has been paying attention to politics for the last two decades is blind to the fact that the concept of a slippery slope is not only real, but frighteningly efficient in it's ability to drastically change society in a short span of time. One day you get gay marriage, a few years later it's drag queen story time, then you've got trannies telling lesbians to "suck the girldick bigot". These issues and the consequence of them being resolved in one way or another aren't exactly miniscule in their impact, either.
 

Drain Todger

Unhinged Doomsayer
True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
While I agree with the concept in general the problem with this outlook is that it supposes that both sides are capable of coming together to find a solution for most of the problems on which they disagree. There are real irreconcilable differences between the right and left, and areas in which there's no room for compromise. For instance, how do you explain to (and convince) someone who wants the minimum wage to be raised that the problem could be solved alternatively by a considerable slowdown or even full-on halt of immigration, throwing out illegals, and policies that incentivize businesses to make their products in the U.S. instead of abroad?
How do you convince someone who believes that college debt is a personal problem that shouldn't be solved by the government, that a government that's already in staggering amounts of debt should foot the bill instead of the person who took the loan?
How do you convince someone who believes in universal healthcare that a better start would be further regulation of insurance companies and hospitals?
I could go on and on, but I think you get my point. It's not as simple as "oh these are differences that could be put aside if we only came together". There's just some things that people simply either won't or can't negotiate. Not to even get into the fact that the social issues are viewed by either side as equally important, and not without good reason either. Nobody who has been paying attention to politics for the last two decades is blind to the fact that the concept of a slippery slope is not only real, but frighteningly efficient in it's ability to drastically change society in a short span of time. One day you get gay marriage, a few years later it's drag queen story time, then you've got trannies telling lesbians to "suck the girldick bigot". These issues and the consequence of them being resolved in one way or another aren't exactly miniscule in their impact, either.
Both the Left and the Right support the interests of business and finance to varying degrees, depending on the category of business.

In America, the Democrats are the party of Silicon Valley, H-1Bs, outsourcing, et cetera, and with good reason. A lot of the business conducted by tech companies is virtualized to such a degree that it's trivial for them to spread out internationally. A lot of computers and other tech gadgets we take for granted would be too expensive to fabricate in the US. Companies like Apple and Intel don't actually make anything. They're R&D houses. All the actual manufacturing is done by suppliers and contractors on the other side of the planet. Thanks to American universities pumping out armies of useless lawyers, journalists, and bean-counters, these companies have had to import thousands of scientists and engineers, leaving open the possibility of hostile nations undertaking industrial espionage campaigns.


On the other side of the equation are the Republicans; what falls under their aegis is dirty industry. Especially mining, agriculture, petrochemicals; things that cannot be readily offshored. Because they can't offshore it, they want cheap labor and light operating expenses, so that means union-busting, promoting the use of immigrant labor behind the scenes, lowering taxes, et cetera. A great deal of their work, propagandizing to their own base, involves convincing the poorest people in the country that low taxes are actually good for them, and won't lead to public infrastructure and services being curtailed. That's why our infrastructure is absolute dog shit.


It isn't the ordinary citizen on the street struggling to make ends meet who needs to be persuaded to change their behavior or beliefs. Neither the Republicans nor the Democrats are on the Average Joe's side. As long as the special interests are in control, we are powerless to change any of these things. Ordinary citizens are there to cheerlead whatever the elites want them to, vote for who the elites want them to vote for, and to try and convince the rest of the public to go along with it, even if only reluctantly.



The wealthy and powerful have successfully convinced vast swaths of Americans that all we have to do in order to take back control of the country is for peons from one party to persuade the peons from the other party to join under their banner. As long as our representatives and regulators are captured by the moneyed interests who actually write the laws and propose the policies, that doesn't actually do anything.
 

Shadfan666xxx000

kiwifarms.net
For people who say the right doesn't have any power, what happened to all your guns and farmland?
The reality is most right wingers are pussies hiding behind their "don't tread on me" attitude while letting those they deem immoral and wrong run the whole show.
It honestly just comes down to this. The right loves to play up how macho it is but the moment an affiliate news station turns it's sights on them, they bunker into hiding and cry about it. It's a massive pattern along the entirety of the right wing and the most guilty motherfuckers arent necessarily the normies but are actually the people who say "look after yer own, just let it burn" as if the flames wont jump to the countryside. They talk the most shit about survival and community but will piss their pants at best when they organize or they'll fall for the dumbest shit when their county GOP has a public address and is going to suck your cock out if you show up as a weekend volunteer.
 
at one point the conservatives (such as they were) packed things up and pointed out to the other team "we have to go to work tomorrow, you guys should try it some time"
And that's part of the issue. "Teehee, while we made corpos rich off our wageslaving, you were up all night helping along the process to make 11 year olds trannies. Get owned libtard".
Like others have mentioned, if the right instead of mocking them as losers embraced it's fringe like the left, like all the bitter young male NEETs who feel abandoned by modern society, they could have a sizable army of supporters.
 

XYZpdq

fbi most wanted sskealeaton
True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
And that's part of the issue. "Teehee, while we made corpos rich off our wageslaving, you were up all night helping along the process to make 11 year olds trannies. Get owned libtard".
Like others have mentioned, if the right instead of mocking them as losers embraced it's fringe like the left, like all the bitter young male NEETs who feel abandoned by modern society, they could have a sizable army of supporters.
I think there's probably a case to be made that's where the tea party and Trump-style made gains.
 

Kripolkripa

kiwifarms.net
I think there's probably a case to be made that's where the tea party and Trump-style made gains.
Trump made gains specifically because he was one of the first major candidates in decades to actually stick up for blue collar workers. That used to be the job of the democrats - until they started relying on an entirely minority voter base. When that happened, they didn't have to actually help the working class laborers that used to make up their base. All they had to do was push racial bullshit and sponsor any and all progressive movements and they got their new start from there. Meanwhile Republicans basically kept their same usual message which was corporate/business interests. Now that the corporate and social justice interests are aligning, we see the Uniparty in full effect. Hence, when an outsider comes in and reminds everyone "Hey, working people, I'm going to help you," it tends to make a pretty huge impact.
 

brentkanaris

kiwifarms.net
The last few years I see this more of a problem of the edgy/online right than anything else. At least the boomer/normie right is doing anything, however impotently.

That's the simple nature of basing your ideas on being reactionary rather then being proactive. Largely the right responds rather then sets the terms itself, immediately placing the narrative power to the left. Being more conservative or simply voting right wing won't fix this, but people on the right equate some degree of institutional power with success, but even the most socdem breadtuber will tell you Biden needs to improve and realize that in the grand scheme of things he does little to move his side forward, much like Donald Trump.
Stop accepting table scraps.

You say this, but your 5% "Riding with Biden" plan reeks of the same things you deride.
 

Haim Arlosoroff

Archpolitician June Lapincal
kiwifarms.net
You should know by basic observation that left-wing boycotts tend to be far more effective than right-wing ones. But why is that exactly?
It's certainly not just because there's more lefties, the right are not that far off from being half of the country.
It may be because of some sort of conspiracy, but fuck off schizo.
It may be because of the left tends towards more collectivist ideas and so can more effectively organize that the more individualistic right. This is close.

I think it's sheer apathy the ruins the right. They already feel defeated and can only reeee into the void as the world changes around them. Meanwhile, the left sees themselves as the inevitable future and are quick to form a cohesive group to exact change on their perceived enemies. The right seeks to exclude themselves from society while the left has BECOME society. This is downright suicidal and will only lead to more left-wing policies being enacted, both in government and in business and education. Like sheep to the slaughter, the right lets the world shift beneath their feet while the left is happy to enact those changes. The small number of right-wing individuals who do fight back are but a speed bump. The right seems happy to just let the country fall out of their hands so long as they can enjoy what they have today. Are they niggers with a high time preference?

What is the solution? How can the right begin to do anything more than sperg about social ills on the internet or at their local church or whatever?
  1. Everyone is conservative about what he knows best.
  2. Any organization not explicitly right-wing sooner or later becomes left-wing.
  3. The simplest way to explain the behavior of any bureaucratic organization is to assume that it is controlled by a cabal of its enemies.
These are Robert Conquest’s Three Laws of Politics and they are all true. Scratch a leftist's opinion where the leftist holding it is personally invested and they will confess to a heterodox opinion. Doctors will know of leftist failures in medicine and resent them for it. Every organization that will not bend to public opinion shifting toward greater acceptance and lower standards is attacked, while every organization that lowers its standards to drunks, rapists, and theft is welcomed by the media. Especially if the organization suddenly announces a hate mob is after them for accepting "pedosexuals" or "MAPs", they get free advertising. There is no such thing as bad publicity. The last is hard to understand until you see it in practice.

The answer is that the right are not for talking about organizing. There is a natural spectrum between those who are entirely independent due to the value of their skill sets such that they only become more socially retarded by the day because they can afford to (its a weird flex, but it is a flex) & those who are entirely interdependent due to the value in their social skills such that they only become more functionally retarded by the day (since they can convince you to help keep things afloat and working even to your personal setback). Most people sit in the middle, but those on the left tend to be socially apt and useless while those on the right tend to be self-sufficient and socially inept. This is a problem in society because it means that the better the right makes society the more they surrender control to those who can socially organize but not maintain discipline.

In short we are soft, and our need to save civilization is itself our chief weakness. Let them ruin themselves, while we grill. Just don't help them while civilization fails so the fuckers learn. Its their America, not ours anymore. Keep the founding principles but admit that America doesn't. Once things break, we're going to be in a position to regain the majority. Until then, we should admit we're already in the minority.

People are not conservative when they have nothing to conserve and, frankly, nothing to lose. Nothing makes someone into a dedicated conservative faster than attaining a steady and stable upper-middle-class lifestyle, and that's only possible if people are paid a decent wage.
Which means that the conservatives two or three generations ago conserved nothing of importance and liberalized away every moral bedrock America had. Now the broken pieces are held together by immigrants who want to use America to better themselves, financial schemes of usury which are failing like the petrol-dollar which require an every higher butchers bill, and media lying about how bad it really is. The problems of modern technology were discussed in the 1951 film The Man in the White Suit for Christ's Sake, we've learned nothing about the nature of innovation under Capitalism since but how to ease our workload to much later much greater expense.

It is difficult to comprehend the level of elitism we are dealing with until you've actually spoken with these sorts of people, as I have. They think you are literally too stupid to understand why they do the things that they do. They think that it's entirely valid politics to deceive, manipulate, and brainwash ordinary people into doing what their "betters" want them to do, and they use people's lemming-like behavior as evidence of their need to be ruled in this manner.
God this is so true, I wish I could explain exactly how much overestimating of their own intelligence, wisdom, and dedication they do and how much in the opposite direction they feel about us. A firm hand must be applied to this class like a Napoleon, Hitler, or a Caesar. Another egotistical fanatic bent toward another more brutal game ends the Roman Senators' scheming, but then we live in a brutal dictatorship. If only there was another solution in all of European, middle eastern, or Chinese histories but it is centralize away from oligarchy or collapse into a more honest state. Those are the only examples mankind gives for how to end the oligarchic lies and scheming.
 
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Odnovo

kiwifarms.net
In short we are soft, and our need to save civilization is itself our chief weakness. Let them ruin themselves, while we grill. Just don't help them while civilization fails so the fuckers learn. Its their America, not ours anymore. Keep the founding principles but admit that America doesn't. Once things break, we're going to be in a position to regain the majority. Until then, we should admit we're already in the minority.
I agree with everything that you have said, besides the notion that we're in the minority, at least in terms of numbers. If the past year has taught me anything, it is that democracy is dead (if it was ever viable in the first place), and it does not matter how many people believe in or want something, but rather what those in power (namely, those who control the banks) believe in or want something. This is by no means permanent, but it is the world that we are living in right now. I'm not completely pessimistic about it, personally, because I think that a fair amount of people are starting to realize that. In any case, to be gas-lighted into believing that you are a part of the minority is part of their process to demoralize you; even if it is true, don't give into that.
 

Pentex

You're Ridin' With Biden...STRAIGHT TO HELL!
kiwifarms.net
It may be because of some sort of conspiracy, but fuck off schizo.
But they are a conspiracy, and they've had a lot of practice at it. What we're seeing in America is simply a longer version of the strategy enacted in Czechoslovakia in 1948. What 'the right' has suffered from, pretty much since Nixon, is that their leadership, their elites have been compromised. Nixon in China, Reagan on illegal aliens, Bush on taxes, Dubya and the Patriot Act (written nearly 20 years prior).

Basically, 'the right' is caught in a pincer. From above are the elites who will sell out 'the right's interests while making it easier for socialists/marxists to operate and stymieing any effort from 'the right' to similarly organize or act (see Summer of Antifa Love vs. The Great Unscheduled Capitol Tour). From below are 'the activists' who will attempt to terrorize 'the right' into submission, or terrorize the squishy center into submitting to their demands (just turn against 'the right' and we'll leave you in peace [for now]).

How does the right get out of the pincer? First step is purge their own treacherous elites, which has been long overdue. Second step is develop their own media/propaganda to degrade and expose the socialists/marxists to the center and promote their own position and successes. Third step is to chase the socialist/marxists out of local/municipal offices and then work up to state and federal offices.

But all of that is work and 'the right' would rather have an Orange Daddy come along and fix everything...which is why they don't deserve liberty anymore.
 

Male Idiot

Das rite!
kiwifarms.net
While I agree with the concept in general the problem with this outlook is that it supposes that both sides are capable of coming together to find a solution for most of the problems on which they disagree. There are real irreconcilable differences between the right and left, and areas in which there's no room for compromise. For instance, how do you explain to (and convince) someone who wants the minimum wage to be raised that the problem could be solved alternatively by a considerable slowdown or even full-on halt of immigration, throwing out illegals, and policies that incentivize businesses to make their products in the U.S. instead of abroad?
How do you convince someone who believes that college debt is a personal problem that shouldn't be solved by the government, that a government that's already in staggering amounts of debt should foot the bill instead of the person who took the loan?
How do you convince someone who believes in universal healthcare that a better start would be further regulation of insurance companies and hospitals?
I could go on and on, but I think you get my point. It's not as simple as "oh these are differences that could be put aside if we only came together". There's just some things that people simply either won't or can't negotiate. Not to even get into the fact that the social issues are viewed by either side as equally important, and not without good reason either. Nobody who has been paying attention to politics for the last two decades is blind to the fact that the concept of a slippery slope is not only real, but frighteningly efficient in it's ability to drastically change society in a short span of time. One day you get gay marriage, a few years later it's drag queen story time, then you've got trannies telling lesbians to "suck the girldick bigot". These issues and the consequence of them being resolved in one way or another aren't exactly miniscule in their impact, either.

Never, ever assume that lesbians and terfs are your allies. They are rainbow snakes like the rest, and will bite you when your back is turned. Nationalism must sweep away all branches of communism, anti-troon feminism included.

I know they look cute and based in anime, but that ain't real life.
 

LurkTrawl

If being good was easy the world would be paradise
kiwifarms.net
Never, ever assume that lesbians and terfs are your allies. They are rainbow snakes like the rest, and will bite you when your back is turned. Nationalism must sweep away all branches of communism, anti-troon feminism included.

I know they look cute and based in anime, but that ain't real life.
That's another problem with the idea of people just "coming together and solving things" is that even if you agree on one thing, that "alliance" will be broken the moment you get to a contentious issue. Most people can agree that trannies are mentally ill at best, but that terf who's right there with you on that issue will have some choice words when you get to the problem of what to do with the healthcare system.

Also feminists are universally ugly. Some on the inside but most both in and out. Never seen an anime with a feminist in it either.
 
That's another problem with the idea of people just "coming together and solving things" is that even if you agree on one thing, that "alliance" will be broken the moment you get to a contentious issue. Most people can agree that trannies are mentally ill at best, but that terf who's right there with you on that issue will have some choice words when you get to the problem of what to do with the healthcare system.

Also feminists are universally ugly. Some on the inside but most both in and out. Never seen an anime with a feminist in it either.
So, ultimately one side will have to completely wipe out the other before anything can happen?
Good to see people some are finally realizing this.
 

LurkTrawl

If being good was easy the world would be paradise
kiwifarms.net
So, ultimately one side will have to completely wipe out the other before anything can happen?
Good to see people some are finally realizing this.
Not necessarily. Progressivism for good or ill is a very top-down, artificially inflated ideology. A lot of the people who are it's adherents publicly are only doing so out of fear of retribution for being a kaffir should they go against the grain. Either that, or are going along with it for other reasons such as grifting or even social climbing. That said my main and only point is that when people make statements along the lines of "well if only we could just put aside our differences..." it's showing a naive and myopic outlook on behalf of the one making such a claim.

The phrase "irreconcilable differences" exist - shockingly - because such differences are a real part of life. Some are more understandable than others.
 

Male Idiot

Das rite!
kiwifarms.net
That's another problem with the idea of people just "coming together and solving things" is that even if you agree on one thing, that "alliance" will be broken the moment you get to a contentious issue. Most people can agree that trannies are mentally ill at best, but that terf who's right there with you on that issue will have some choice words when you get to the problem of what to do with the healthcare system.

Also feminists are universally ugly. Some on the inside but most both in and out. Never seen an anime with a feminist in it either.

Yeah I said lesbian, not feminist. Unfortunately, in real life they are quite different than portrayed for horny Japanese men in their chinese tiddy cartoons. So they look like a hairy water buffalo or a fat, old trucker without a dick.
 

LurkTrawl

If being good was easy the world would be paradise
kiwifarms.net
Yeah I said lesbian, not feminist. Unfortunately, in real life they are quite different than portrayed for horny Japanese men in their chinese tiddy cartoons. So they look like a hairy water buffalo or a fat, old trucker without a dick.
Terf is an acronym for T.rans E.xclusionary. R.adical F.eminist.

And I didn't mention lesbians so I don't know why they were brought up other than a lot of terfs, are lesbos. I also never mentioned being attracted to them as I'm not.
 

Bad Gateway

Oops!
kiwifarms.net
  1. Everyone is conservative about what he knows best.
  2. Any organization not explicitly right-wing sooner or later becomes left-wing.
  3. The simplest way to explain the behavior of any bureaucratic organization is to assume that it is controlled by a cabal of its enemies.
These are Robert Conquest’s Three Laws of Politics and they are all true. Scratch a leftist's opinion where the leftist holding it is personally invested and they will confess to a heterodox opinion. Doctors will know of leftist failures in medicine and resent them for it. Every organization that will not bend to public opinion shifting toward greater acceptance and lower standards is attacked, while every organization that lowers its standards to drunks, rapists, and theft is welcomed by the media. Especially if the organization suddenly announces a hate mob is after them for accepting "pedosexuals" or "MAPs", they get free advertising. There is no such thing as bad publicity. The last is hard to understand until you see it in practice.

The answer is that the right are not for talking about organizing. There is a natural spectrum between those who are entirely independent due to the value of their skill sets such that they only become more socially retarded by the day because they can afford to (its a weird flex, but it is a flex) & those who are entirely interdependent due to the value in their social skills such that they only become more functionally retarded by the day (since they can convince you to help keep things afloat and working even to your personal setback). Most people sit in the middle, but those on the left tend to be socially apt and useless while those on the right tend to be self-sufficient and socially inept. This is a problem in society because it means that the better the right makes society the more they surrender control to those who can socially organize but not maintain discipline.

In short we are soft, and our need to save civilization is itself our chief weakness. Let them ruin themselves, while we grill. Just don't help them while civilization fails so the fuckers learn. Its their America, not ours anymore. Keep the founding principles but admit that America doesn't. Once things break, we're going to be in a position to regain the majority. Until then, we should admit we're already in the minority.


Which means that the conservatives two or three generations ago conserved nothing of importance and liberalized away every moral bedrock America had. Now the broken pieces are held together by immigrants who want to use America to better themselves, financial schemes of usury which are failing like the petrol-dollar which require an every higher butchers bill, and media lying about how bad it really is. The problems of modern technology were discussed in the 1951 film The Man in the White Suit for Christ's Sake, we've learned nothing about the nature of innovation under Capitalism since but how to ease our workload to much later much greater expense.


God this is so true, I wish I could explain exactly how much overestimating of their own intelligence, wisdom, and dedication they do and how much in the opposite direction they feel about us. A firm hand must be applied to this class like a Napoleon, Hitler, or a Caesar. Another egotistical fanatic bent toward another more brutal game ends the Roman Senators' scheming, but then we live in a brutal dictatorship. If only there was another solution in all of European, middle eastern, or Chinese histories but it is centralize away from oligarchy or collapse into a more honest state. Those are the only examples mankind gives for how to end the oligarchic lies and scheming.
Yee yee ass manifesto
 
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