San Francisco residents cover sidewalks in rocks to keep away homeless - Well if the city won't help...

Freedom Fries

kiwifarms.net
People say we can't solve the homeless problem, but I have a solution (at least for the worst of them).

We have government agencies like the CIA and FBI infiltrate these communities as drug dealers (again) and junkies. Once in place, the agents will sell meth and heroin that is laced with a highly lethal chemical. Problem solved. We could also allow communities to run them off on their own accord sorta like the Philippines does with drug dealers if we need a more cost effevtive approach.
 

littlearmalite

Neck yourself, faggot.
kiwifarms.net
People say we can't solve the homeless problem, but I have a solution (at least for the worst of them).

We have government agencies like the CIA and FBI infiltrate these communities as drug dealers (again) and junkies. Once in place, the agents will sell meth and heroin that is laced with a highly lethal chemical. Problem solved. We could also allow communities to run them off on their own accord sorta like the Philippines does with drug dealers if we need a more cost effevtive approach.

Call me a bleeding heart, but as someone who's homeless there are plenty of them that actually aren't druggies. Not the majority, just enough to be concerned.

I say that we should tighten the noose on the programs, tbh. If you're looking for aid off the street, you have to submit to a drug test. If you fail, you get rehab. No job assistance, no housing except the rehab center, no food stamps- everything you eat, get, or sleep in is at the rehab center. If you won't take that, you don't get assistance, simple.

Those that pass the drug tests can go out into the programs at large and work on getting their lives traight, if they actually care enough to do it. The same with those who go through the rehab program and show signs of improvement.
 

Ashen One

"Ashen one, hearest thou my voice, still?"
kiwifarms.net
Amazing how the activists care about the homeless so much to devote all that effort and money to force other people to deal with them instead of, you know, doing anything to help them. Guess showing the world how much better you are than those heartless monsters is more important than actually helping the people in need.

My favorite part is this though
Daniel Bartosiewicz, who said he camped in Clinton Park for two months, lamented to NBC Bay Area that none of the neighbors talked to him about their concerns.

“They would have saved a lot of money and a lot of trouble if they just said something to us,” he said. “Use your compassion and love and understanding. We’re humans.”
"Hello Mr. homeless, who is more than likely high on drugs and/or armed right now. I live in that third house on the left and thought it would be a good idea to paint a target in me, my family and my property by coming here and saying the neighborhood is uncomfortable with you and we don't want you and the other homeless here. Could you leave the neighborhood? Pretty please?"

I'm certain that would have worked just fine and dandy. :story:
 

OneEyedCool

kiwifarms.net
There really is no easy solution, especially considering that the reasons that 'home-ing' the homeless is difficult vary from place to place. In the bible belt, for example, it's a lack of agencies designed to help those in such situations. The town druggie will never get any help save through, possibly, a local church, because there is no one there to help him. Meanwhile, back on the West Coast, there's the extremely high cost of living making it an uphill battle for those homeless such as myself, who had a decent education but a couple of blemishes on their ledger, to find work that allows them to financially support themselves off the street.
The West Coast has the best rehabs in the nation with rates of like 90% but the cost is unaffordable and requires insurance. Catholics runs most of them. https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/treatment-rehab/addiction/california?sid=5d9685db42d50

Do you live in a car? That's still pretty damn good in this day of price extortion. Having a older model truck in stick shift to bag up tons of aluminum cans will make some good weekly income.


I can give you at least one solution- a lot of businesses often refuse to speak to the homeless in interviews on principle. Perhaps incentives for low-skill jobs (warehousing, public works, construction) that encourage them to employ and pay homeless folks in the process of rehabilitation, so long as they stand beholden to the law and submit to drug tests, might reduce the number of 'unluckies' like myself who just needed a hand up, rather than a handout.
The other option is to be employed by Goodwill if you have no recent work history for about one year and obtain good references. Then you move up next to like a warehouse job at a temp agency using the forklift thingy.
 

Kiwi Lime Pie

So tasteful it's scary. 🥝🥧🐈
kiwifarms.net
Be ye warned, there be personal experience in this here post.
The options for homeless in this region seem to be similar sadly, with only just a couple of exceptions.

And these homeless shelters, while a step in the right direction, merely prolong their existence. Feed them, house them, that's it. Are they weeding out the ones that actually want help and get them back on their feet? Or just keep them contained in one area and spill them out in the streets? Again, many homeless don't care.
Some of the churches in this area sponsor a warming shelter where they each take a week during the coldest winter months to take in the homeless -- whether in their church building, activities center, or other building that has the capacity for them. Unfortunately, they allow any homeless to stay the night -- even those that are drunk, high, or otherwise behaving unstably -- where they get a snack before bed and breakfast in the morning before being sent back out on the street until check-in happens later that night. While people tend to think it's good to have the homeless out of the cold, others question the decision to let anyone and everyone in while doing nothing of significance to help those that could benefit from a hand up as @littlearmalite said.

There is a separate group of churches, albeit smaller, that is more selective in who stays the night (nobody that appears to be drink, high, or a potential threat or nuisance) and actually offers a limited number of ancillary services during the day. One church has a computer wing/lab so those wanting to find jobs or arrange interviews can do so easily. The group as a whole has also made a deal with the local Salvation Army to let guests use their shower facilities to freshen up. I also believe another church in the group has a clothes closet where guests can get a new set of clothes to help with freshening up and looking presentable for interviews and such. As mentioned, though, this particular group of churches is smaller, so they probably can't help too many homeless, and I'm not sure what kind of a success rate they have for those trying to get back on their feet. But at least they're trying to do more than give them hots and a cot (teach a man to fish vs. giving him the fish).

The only homeless program I've seen with consistent success is one that takes a holistic approach. Get them a social worker, a job counselor, in therapy, and in drug treatment. It also hooked clients up with independent charities in the area to get you basic necessities in a small apartment and back to work. The clients still have to be doing the work in their program, but it gives the ones who are serious about changing their situation the resources to actually improve in meaningful and sustainable ways.
The closest inner city to me has a similar nonprofit program designed for those that are homeless through bad luck or domestic violence/abuse. They provide temporary housing in the form of small apartments. In return, they are expected to take advantage of the nonprofit's resources for both job searching with (re)training as appropriate and low-income housing they'd be able to afford once they're employed again. Like any nonprofit, budget is probably the biggest constraint on how many people they can help and how successful they are. But this is the type of program that probably works best because it takes those wanting to better themselves and gives them the resources specific to their situation that they need to achieve that goal.

Unfortunately, many areas are all too happy to give their homeless gibmedats that do nothing to give them a hand up and are easy to squander on vices such as drugs, alcohol or anything else that keeps them in the seemingly-perpetual state of homelessness. Once again, this shows that blindly throwing more money at a problem rarely works and tends to make matters worse instead of better.
 

Echo_Ender

Doggo
kiwifarms.net
Around my neck of the woods, Narcan (The anti-overdose drug) has made the problem with druggies worse.

Since ALL first responders are now legally required to have Narcan on them, the local crackheads are "Pushing the limits", doing shit that they know will almost certainly end in an overdose, because they know some poor cop will be required to save them with Narcan.

Drug fatalities have plummeted, but drug use has skyrocketed and first responders are constantly tied up with "Overdosing crackhead in my back yard" calls.

It's fucking ridiculous. Especially since that Narcan isn't cheap. It's devouring the entire police/fire/EMS budget in a matter of months.

It's to the point where people are talking about actually NOT calling 911 for overdosing bums until they're pretty sure they've croaked or they regain consciousness.
 

Amber the Hedgehog

kiwifarms.net
If I would be tasked to set solve homelessness problems with I would probably go with something like this. To be allowed to resive any benefits, a person has have to id and have confirmed place of resistance or be registered as homeless. Registering as homelessness can happen eather by personally declaring themselves as homeless or getting caught by law enforcement. While homelessness itself would not be criminal, willful homelessness would be.

When you’re registered as homeless you will be helped to find or set up with a program that gets you off the streets as soon as possible. These programs can be government, private or nonprofit, permanent housing, temporary housing or even just that a place where you stay for the night but are kicked out during day. The main point is you will have some place to sleep, toilet and take care minimum hygiene needs. You are allowed to change programs, find housing on your own or move somewhere else, but if you fail to show up or are kicked out from your program you will be considered to be willful homeless. If you get caught as willful homeless living on streets you will be locked up. If you’re registered as homeless but don’t have program to go yet, that’s fine. It’s not your fault if programs are full and so your homelessness can’t criminal till you’ra choosing to stay on streets.
 

neverendingmidi

it just goes on and on and on and on...
kiwifarms.net
Around my neck of the woods, Narcan (The anti-overdose drug) has made the problem with druggies worse.

Since ALL first responders are now legally required to have Narcan on them, the local crackheads are "Pushing the limits", doing shit that they know will almost certainly end in an overdose, because they know some poor cop will be required to save them with Narcan.

Drug fatalities have plummeted, but drug use has skyrocketed and first responders are constantly tied up with "Overdosing crackhead in my back yard" calls.

It's fucking ridiculous. Especially since that Narcan isn't cheap. It's devouring the entire police/fire/EMS budget in a matter of months.

It's to the point where people are talking about actually NOT calling 911 for overdosing bums until they're pretty sure they've croaked or they regain consciousness.
They should treat it like they do sterilizing stray cats. They get one dose, their ear is notched and dyed with something. Next time they get nothing.
 

Alec Benson Leary

Creator of Asperchu
Christorical Figure
kiwifarms.net
Around my neck of the woods, Narcan (The anti-overdose drug) has made the problem with druggies worse.

Since ALL first responders are now legally required to have Narcan on them, the local crackheads are "Pushing the limits", doing shit that they know will almost certainly end in an overdose, because they know some poor cop will be required to save them with Narcan.

Drug fatalities have plummeted, but drug use has skyrocketed and first responders are constantly tied up with "Overdosing crackhead in my back yard" calls.

It's fucking ridiculous. Especially since that Narcan isn't cheap. It's devouring the entire police/fire/EMS budget in a matter of months.

It's to the point where people are talking about actually NOT calling 911 for overdosing bums until they're pretty sure they've croaked or they regain consciousness.
That reminds me of those ineffective laws designed to protect endangered species. If you own land and you find an endangered bird nesting there like the blue-veined tittycock or whatever, suddenly your land is a "protective space" for the bird and you're not allowed to develop it, farm it, or even sell it off except to the state for a major loss. So what did land owners do, did they let the appropriate agency know they found an endangered bird to protect? No, they quietly choked that tittycock to death and then buried it without telling a soul. These wonderful pie-in-the-sky laws designed to protect the animal actually had the opposite effect of endangering them further.

Difference is, those birds might actually provide some use to the local ecology. I think San Francisco is half a c-hair away from declaring that homeless people automatically get squatting rights wherever they feel like it even if it's in the front doorway to your house, so I don't blame people at all for keeping quiet and letting the endangered animal problem solve itself rather than risk effectively facing extreme punishment to their livelihood and prosperity for doing the "right thing". I can see it now - some city councilman saying "oops, looks like 3 or more homeless people congregated in your backyard last Wednesday night to shoot up. That officially qualifies your private residence as a shelter! Thank you for informing us by calling 911 to say they threatened you with knives, now please fill out these forms and pay the surcharge fee so we can deliver the cots to your property, also we will send over a contractor to make sure your building meets shelter safety requirements and you will be fined if you don't make necessary steps to meet code within 45 days."

What if someone needs the cops for real problem but 911's response time is 25+ minutes because all the cops are occupied taking care of selfish drug addicts who are abusing the city's system?
 
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Belligerent Monk

Kiwi Farms is the Batman Universe
kiwifarms.net
Around my neck of the woods, Narcan (The anti-overdose drug) has made the problem with druggies worse.

Since ALL first responders are now legally required to have Narcan on them, the local crackheads are "Pushing the limits", doing shit that they know will almost certainly end in an overdose, because they know some poor cop will be required to save them with Narcan.

Drug fatalities have plummeted, but drug use has skyrocketed and first responders are constantly tied up with "Overdosing crackhead in my back yard" calls.

It's fucking ridiculous. Especially since that Narcan isn't cheap. It's devouring the entire police/fire/EMS budget in a matter of months.

It's to the point where people are talking about actually NOT calling 911 for overdosing bums until they're pretty sure they've croaked or they regain consciousness.
I could never be trusted with that responsibility simply because I wouldn't do it.
One of the funniest things on Earth to me is the sight of a heroin junkie who can't get a fix. I've never personally experienced this phenomena myself but knowing people who have and having seen what some went through I can paint a pretty clear picture.

It's as though their veins are on fire. They are rotting from the inside out, almost. The pain is quite intense.
They can't even get the mercy of passing out to avoid the pain until they pass out from the pain.
It's hysterical to me in a macabre sort of way. So many people do whatever they want to themselves or others without fear of consequence. One could argue they do it because there aren't any real consequences. Not for the junkie though. The stupidity of their decision literally becomes painful.

But for whatever reason your garden variety crackhead just will not fucking die. They could smoke a 100 bucks worth of crack a day and still be kicking. It's fascinating.
 

Capsaicin Addict

Spooky skeleton heat!
kiwifarms.net
That reminds me of those ineffective laws designed to protect endangered species. If you own land and you find an endangered bird nesting there like the blue-veined tittycock or whatever, suddenly your land is a "protective space" for the bird and you're not allowed to develop it, farm it, or even sell it off except to the state for a major loss. So what did land owners do, did they let the appropriate agency know they found an endangered bird to protect? No, they quietly choked that tittycock to death and then buried it without telling a soul. These wonderful pie-in-the-sky laws designed to protect the animal actually had the opposite effect of endangering them further.

Difference is, those birds might actually provide some use to the local ecology. I think San Francisco is half a c-hair away from declaring that homeless people automatically get squatting rights wherever they feel like it even if it's in the front doorway to your house, so I don't blame people at all for keeping quiet and letting the endangered animal problem solve itself rather than risk effectively facing extreme punishment to their livelihood and prosperity for doing the "right thing". I can see it now - some city councilman saying "oops, looks like 3 or more homeless people congregated in your backyard last Wednesday night to shoot up. That officially qualifies your private residence as a shelter! Thank you for informing us by calling 911 to say they threatened you with knives, now please fill out these forms and pay the surcharge fee so we can deliver the cots to your property, also we will send over a contractor to make sure your building meets shelter safety requirements and you will be fined if you don't make necessary steps to meet code within 45 days."

What if someone needs the cops for real problem but 911's response time is 25+ minutes because all the cops are occupied taking care of selfish drug addicts who are abusing the city's system?
I'm astonished there haven't been pogroms. Chalk it up to San Fran still being bleeding-heart liberal -- for now.

Assaults, robberies, those will erode the empathy until all that's left is hate. Then you'll see some fun as the sun goes down, the masks go on, and the molotovs get tossed into the encampments.
 

AnotherPleb

kiwifarms.net
I'm astonished there haven't been pogroms. Chalk it up to San Fran still being bleeding-heart liberal -- for now.

Assaults, robberies, those will erode the empathy until all that's left is hate. Then you'll see some fun as the sun goes down, the masks go on, and the molotovs get tossed into the encampments.
At the very least you'll find out just how fast San Fran's cops can respond since you know the mayor would light a fire under their ass. Look at the Jussie Smolett hoax if you want an example.
 

Alec Benson Leary

Creator of Asperchu
Christorical Figure
kiwifarms.net
I'm astonished there haven't been pogroms. Chalk it up to San Fran still being bleeding-heart liberal -- for now.

Assaults, robberies, those will erode the empathy until all that's left is hate. Then you'll see some fun as the sun goes down, the masks go on, and the molotovs get tossed into the encampments.
You know how the saying goes. There are no atheists progressives in a foxhole slum neighborhood.
 

queue-anon

kiwifarms.net
It's to the point where people are talking about actually NOT calling 911 for overdosing bums until they're pretty sure they've croaked or they regain consciousness.
I've been torn for a while about what to do when I see vagrants passed out on the street. Some of them basically just stop and drop where they're standing, so it looks like there's some health crisis going on. On the one hand, I want to call 911 on them at least in part to try to harass them out of the neighborhood. Don't want to be bothered while you're sleeping off your latest hit? Then go shoot up in a greenbelt, not on a city sidewalk. But, on the other hand, it's an enormous waste of EMT resources to call them out on a junkie just sleeping that shit off.

The deciding factor was when I heard that 911 generally demands that you go up to the person and check on them, and that's when I decided not to call unless I see blood or there's an easily observable medical problem like a seizure. I'm not risking my own safety. Even if the junkie doesn't wake up in a violent rage, I don't want to contract staph or pick up fleas, lice, or bedbugs.

What if someone needs the cops for real problem but 911's response time is 25+ minutes because all the cops are occupied taking care of selfish drug addicts who are abusing the city's system?
Average response time in Portland is apparently 26 minutes.
 

Capsaicin Addict

Spooky skeleton heat!
kiwifarms.net
I've been torn for a while about what to do when I see vagrants passed out on the street. Some of them basically just stop and drop where they're standing, so it looks like there's some health crisis going on. On the one hand, I want to call 911 on them at least in part to try to harass them out of the neighborhood. Don't want to be bothered while you're sleeping off your latest hit? Then go shoot up in a greenbelt, not on a city sidewalk. But, on the other hand, it's an enormous waste of EMT resources to call them out on a junkie just sleeping that shit off.

The deciding factor was when I heard that 911 generally demands that you go up to the person and check on them, and that's when I decided not to call unless I see blood or there's an easily observable medical problem like a seizure. I'm not risking my own safety. Even if the junkie doesn't wake up in a violent rage, I don't want to contract staph or pick up fleas, lice, or bedbugs.



Average response time in Portland is apparently 26 minutes.
Considering California made assaulting a cop a misdemeanor, I'm surprised it's that good.
 
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Lissamine Green

Spiteful Chicken Eater
kiwifarms.net
I've been torn for a while about what to do when I see vagrants passed out on the street. Some of them basically just stop and drop where they're standing, so it looks like there's some health crisis going on. On the one hand, I want to call 911 on them at least in part to try to harass them out of the neighborhood. Don't want to be bothered while you're sleeping off your latest hit? Then go shoot up in a greenbelt, not on a city sidewalk. But, on the other hand, it's an enormous waste of EMT resources to call them out on a junkie just sleeping that shit off.

The deciding factor was when I heard that 911 generally demands that you go up to the person and check on them, and that's when I decided not to call unless I see blood or there's an easily observable medical problem like a seizure. I'm not risking my own safety. Even if the junkie doesn't wake up in a violent rage, I don't want to contract staph or pick up fleas, lice, or bedbugs.



Average response time in Portland is apparently 26 minutes.
This was it for me too. I am kind of soft hearted, despite whatever impression I may give off online, and I hate to see someone sick and suffering. So I used to call. But then when the problem started to get worse, the operator wouldn't just say "we will send someone out" she would get snarky and ask me if I had dealt with it myself. The last straw was when one of these guys was actually threatening people and being aggressive, and trespassing, and I called and the dispatcher told me to "go out there and tell him to leave." I said, ok, I am here alone in charge of some small kids, I do not have a backup to watch them while I go fight with some idiot, I do not have a weapon on me, this guy is waving some kind of implement around and screaming threats, what should I do if he attacks me? And she says, that's up to you. Well fuck you too, City of Portland.
 
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