Serious LGBT Discussion -

CivilianOfTheFandomWars

Living It
True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
Question to those of you here who are pro-LGB but anti-T: why?

It seems like the LGB at large tend to be pro-T, and this makes sense. The philosophical underpinnings of pro-LGB rhetoric and thought are the exact same used to justify "trans validity" and other pro-trans stances. Justification for LGB stems from queer theory and a libertarian-esque individualism when it comes to sex and gender identity. I'm not saying all - or even most - lesbians and gays read Foucault or Anzaldúa, but their line of thinking and structuring of their arguments is either heavily influenced or the exact same (yes this includes those in this thread). I can't even think of a valid anti-trans argument that couldn't also be spun to justify outright homophobia.

Note that I don't support T, I think it's a mental illness and stems from the same places as other mental illnesses, but in general I'd say the same is true with LGB.
A man is not a woman, a woman is not a man. Sexuality, homo or hetero or whatever, should be between consenting adults and that’s it. For a trans to be ‘valid’, they must have everyone else agree that they are what they say they are. I do not stop being gay if you don’t believe I am, even if you don’t like that, but a TIM isn’t a woman anymore if no one believes they are.
Want to dress like a spaz, dye your hair, whatever I don’t give a shit. When you demand that I agree with your nonsense that does affect me and others, I start to care.
 
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Autumnal Equinox

Let's rock!
kiwifarms.net
Question to those of you here who are pro-LGB but anti-T: why?

It seems like the LGB at large tend to be pro-T, and this makes sense. The philosophical underpinnings of pro-LGB rhetoric and thought are the exact same used to justify "trans validity" and other pro-trans stances. Justification for LGB stems from queer theory and a libertarian-esque individualism when it comes to sex and gender identity. I'm not saying all - or even most - lesbians and gays read Foucault or Anzaldúa, but their line of thinking and structuring of their arguments is either heavily influenced or the exact same (yes this includes those in this thread). I can't even think of a valid anti-trans argument that couldn't also be spun to justify outright homophobia.

Note that I don't support T, I think it's a mental illness and stems from the same places as other mental illnesses, but in general I'd say the same is true with LGB.
I just don’t like them, simple as that. I’ve never met a tranny who wasn’t either doing it for woke points or the “fuck you mom and dad! I’m an edgy rebel!” mentality. I’ve never met a tranny who wasn’t a neurotic nutcase that acts like a 14 year old girl on Tumblr (no trannies, that’s NOT a compliment) I’ve never met a tranny that can’t take the hint not everyone wants to fuck them and they’re not a seig heiling Nazi for having preferences. I’ve never met a tranny that wasn’t trying to groom children into trooning out because little Billy might like baking cookies or little Suzy might like shooting hoops with the guys. They’re obnoxious, they’re degenerate, worst than any mincing twinky faggot I’ve seen
 

Dr. Sexbot

The Positronic Pimp
kiwifarms.net
Question to those of you here who are pro-LGB but anti-T: why?

It seems like the LGB at large tend to be pro-T, and this makes sense. The philosophical underpinnings of pro-LGB rhetoric and thought are the exact same used to justify "trans validity" and other pro-trans stances. Justification for LGB stems from queer theory and a libertarian-esque individualism when it comes to sex and gender identity. I'm not saying all - or even most - lesbians and gays read Foucault or Anzaldúa, but their line of thinking and structuring of their arguments is either heavily influenced or the exact same (yes this includes those in this thread). I can't even think of a valid anti-trans argument that couldn't also be spun to justify outright homophobia.

Note that I don't support T, I think it's a mental illness and stems from the same places as other mental illnesses, but in general I'd say the same is true with LGB.
It's because the T is making a huge fucking mess in the front lawn, and the neighbors are not happy. Their collective spergery IMO threatens to rewind much of the LGB acceptance that gays and lezzies fought for in the 70s-00s.

Also, if trannies want to be able to pretend they're "lesbians" after transition, they can go hang out back with the "Queers" and other genderspecials who aren't, in fact, gay or lesbian. You don't get to have it both ways (unless you're bi).
 

Puerto Pollo

kiwifarms.net
If you don't mind, here's a scrambled list of random interactions with troons according to people I know, and my own of course. Timeline is about 2 decades of a gay man's life in Europe, so this is even before troons became the most important issue of western civilization (thanks Obongo).

Prostitution; starting a relationship with someone then blackmailing him as soon as he wanted to break it off; histrionic behavior in public, literally behaving like some crazy anime character irl; pathological liar, pretending to have a brain cancer and trying to get money from strangers out of it; drugs; aggressively cruising men in clubs, ending up rejected and causing such a scene the owner threatens to call the police; putting a webcam in the women's restroom; digging a glory hole in the public library bathroom; sleeping with a married man, then sending videos to his wife and kids on facebook because he wouldn't pay for a holiday abroad; getting invited to a friend's family dinner and talking about genital electrocution as a sexual practice.

Have I met particularly unlucky people or do we have a problem with the T?
 

Cool kitties club

The coolest cat in the silver age
kiwifarms.net
Question to those of you here who are pro-LGB but anti-T: why?

It seems like the LGB at large tend to be pro-T, and this makes sense. The philosophical underpinnings of pro-LGB rhetoric and thought are the exact same used to justify "trans validity" and other pro-trans stances. Justification for LGB stems from queer theory and a libertarian-esque individualism when it comes to sex and gender identity. I'm not saying all - or even most - lesbians and gays read Foucault or Anzaldúa, but their line of thinking and structuring of their arguments is either heavily influenced or the exact same (yes this includes those in this thread). I can't even think of a valid anti-trans argument that couldn't also be spun to justify outright homophobia.

Note that I don't support T, I think it's a mental illness and stems from the same places as other mental illnesses, but in general I'd say the same is true with LGB.

I would like to have sympathy for the genuinely mentally ill trannies, but similar the "gay community" the "trans community" has be turned into a battery ram against society itself. Being gay is not intrinsically linked to "gay culture" and much of my criticisms of the trans community would fall back on mainstream gay culture It is just that trannies are uglier and more vocally annoying compared to other queers.
 

polonium

By your genders combined, I am Captain Tumblr
True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
Question to those of you here who are pro-LGB but anti-T: why?
Even setting aside the whole issue of mental health, T shouldn't be lumped in with GLB because T issues aren't GLB issues. We're not confused about our gender identity, we're constantly lectured that trannies are women, well women in general don't belong with GLB either, unless they're lesbian. And if they are, they can talk about lesbian shit at GLB events, pride matches or whatever and have a separate one for tranny talking points, the same way that if a straight woman tried to turn pride into straight feminist marches they'd be pushed out.

I generally hate pride marches but I got dragged to one a few years ago and the whole thing was infested with tranny shit and they were carrying signs that said "This is our pride" and the like. One tranny dude was kind of working the crowd as they marched along and tried to get me to shake his hand, to the point of trying to grab my arm and put his hand in mine to shake it. I said "Consent doesn't mean anything to you people, does it" and he fucking hustled off.

That's my problem with trannies: Their issues aren't anything to do with GLB issues but they force their way in and demand we pander to them and make everything about trannies, and then worst of all they behave in the creepiest most sexual-predatoryish skeevy ways and make everyone look bad by reflection.

Never mind what the public-facing organisations do and say, homos generally don't like trannies and don't want them hanging around. The last time I was out late at a gay bar (with my then fiance), there was one hulking male-pattern-balding tranny standing in the middle of a giant empty space with nobody around him and I didn't see one person talk with or associate with him the whole time we were there.
 
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mr spongecake

kiwifarms.net
For all who answered: thank you. I have a better understanding of where you're coming from.
Never mind what the public-facing organisations do and say, homos generally don't like trannies and don't want them hanging around
Is this the truth? I wouldn't be surprised given gaslighting that goes on nowadays, but I would still be very surprised.
 

XeXerself

kiwifarms.net
Is this the truth? I wouldn't be surprised given gaslighting that goes on nowadays, but I would still be very surprised.
It mostly depends on the individual LG person's knowledge of the trans issue (and personal experiences dealing with trans people) and the kind of trans people they're dealing with. I know back in the day, the T was there in the first place because some LG people transitioned (I'm not very educated on the history of bisexuals who trooned, sorry) but still felt some connection to the community (not to mention transsexualism was seen as "taking gayness to the next level"). "Normie" gays and lesbians generally don't really care about homosexual (and some bisexual) transsexuals or see them as one of their own (not all, obviously, I know a good amount gay people see HSTS as traitors giving into their self-hatred and things like that).

I've read tons of "Peak Trans" stories (AKA the moment where someone goes from being a trans ally to critical/unsupportive of the movement), and the majority of them from gay people (including me, lol) happen when they meet a "transbian" or "gay transman/Aiden" who basically lived their whole lives as straight people and transition because they're so obsessed with gay media and gay people that they want to "become gay" too (it's no coincidence that a lot of transbians love yuri and Aidens love yaoi and claim they discovered their identity through it). And the tide has turn that a lot of spaces for gay and bisexual people are full of these straight people who trooned out for fetish purposes; There are so many lesbians who get pissed when a transwoman that doesn't even pass messages them on dating apps and gay men who have been harassed by transmen sending them vagina pics on Grindr - and you can't even politely turn down most of these people without getting backlash. That's where a big part of the animosity from LGBs who used to be allies and Ts comes from.

I'm drunk so this post is probably retarded and makes no sense and I'll regret publishing it, lol. I'm not wholly anti-trans (I don't give a shit what people do to themselves as long as they know what they're getting into and don't rope others into it; the issue is that most of them do try to get everyone else to play along) but I understand movements like "Drop The T"/"Get The L Out"/"LGB Alliance" because the issues that LGB people have (wanting to be able to marry and have relationships with other adults of the same sex without getting hate crimed or disowned by family, wanting to ban religious people from putting them through therapy to make them become straight, etc.) with what the trans movement is pushing (basically bending reality and the meaning of words to cater to their feelings, roping children into transitioning, silencing detransitioners, etc.) are so different I wonder why they're still being lumped together. It's like how people on Tumblr tried really hard to lump LGB with the Asexuality community, it just doesn't work out in the long run.
 

Puerto Pollo

kiwifarms.net
For all who answered: thank you. I have a better understanding of where you're coming from.

Is this the truth? I wouldn't be surprised given gaslighting that goes on nowadays, but I would still be very surprised.

There's always the woke lefty sjw faggot poisoning the wells for attention and validation, but the overwhelming majority of gay men wants nothing to do with them. Conforming to the common thought in the contemporary woke society is an issue, but let's not fool ourselves into believing that gay men feel anything but contempt for women, especially women larping as men/men larping as women. The stuff you hear about women in a gay bar is Afghanistan sharia law tier.
 

Kornula

kiwifarms.net
I swear 99 percent of couples are either indistinguishable from siblings, a weird combination of handsome and fugly, two fugly, but almost never two handsome, at least not in the long term, and that's the biggest red flag in the world because nobody will ever be good enough for them for more than a year or so.

About signaling first...yeah, here's some feels. The soul can take only that much rejection, at some point you just show appreciation for good manners, grammar and eyes that communicate anything more than a 300.000 cocks stare.
One, that is again, "triabliasm" at work driving our sexual attraction.
Two; the longer a couple stays together, the more likely they will manage to look similar.. The chance of it happening skyrockets if they already look similar enough. But don't fret, you're very likelyi not related -IF - you can't stand the smell of each other.. literally. If you really like and notice the smell of someone else, odds are you are not related...and/or will be super into each other.
 

Kornula

kiwifarms.net
Pride events are odd. Very crowded men in jockstraps and nipple rings and lots of random straight girls there as well.
I was never a fan of the "Pride" parades/events.. even in the 1980s. It astounds me that nearly every single The Gays™ have totally forgotten what the Pride day orginally celebrated; The Gays™ not being arrested for being gay in a gay bar. The federal goverment amended the Civil Rights act to include us... The Gays™ shortly thereafter.

Why does this astound me that The Gays™ seem to forget what we have accomplished (legally speaking)? Today's LGBTLMNOP Alphabet Nazi brigade cries that we The Gays™ are still "oppressed" and "marginalized" by society at large.. When I point out all the major companies like Alaska Airlines, Wells Fargo, Kroger, Heck, even Communist "News" Network gushes on about Gay Pride week is pure acceptance when companies cash in on advertising dollars.. they still manage to cry "victim".

...then you have the actual "Pride" event itself.. which is as you described.. rather shameful display of self indulgence.
 

Souroti

I'm stealing from you
kiwifarms.net
I was never a fan of the "Pride" parades/events.. even in the 1980s. It astounds me that nearly every single The Gays™ have totally forgotten what the Pride day orginally celebrated; The Gays™ not being arrested for being gay in a gay bar. The federal goverment amended the Civil Rights act to include us... The Gays™ shortly thereafter.

Why does this astound me that The Gays™ seem to forget what we have accomplished (legally speaking)? Today's LGBTLMNOP Alphabet Nazi brigade cries that we The Gays™ are still "oppressed" and "marginalized" by society at large.. When I point out all the major companies like Alaska Airlines, Wells Fargo, Kroger, Heck, even Communist "News" Network gushes on about Gay Pride week is pure acceptance when companies cash in on advertising dollars.. they still manage to cry "victim".

...then you have the actual "Pride" event itself.. which is as you described.. rather shameful display of self indulgence.
the "LGBTLMNOP Alphabet Nazi brigade" as you put it doesnt give a shit about genuine homosexual men or women anymore.
 

Banditotron

What's the ugliest part of your body?
True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
the "LGBTLMNOP Alphabet Nazi brigade" as you put it doesnt give a shit about genuine homosexual men or women anymore.
LGB are the bad guys, to them. No different from nazis or whatever in the eyes of such crazies.
 

Scarlett Johansson

Hello, I'm Shelley Duvall
True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
LGB are the bad guys, to them. No different from nazis or whatever in the eyes of such crazies.
"I HAVE RIGHT TO USE THE WAMENS RESTROOM YOURR INVADING MY PERSONAL SPACE YOU TERF YIURR RAPING ME STOP RAPIMG ME I WILL SCREAM. RAAAAAAPE!!!!! RAAAAAPE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

lol troons really are scary tbh

It's interesting to me about black trans women...ppl seem much more *concerned* about it but what about the man troons lmao
 

Noir drag freak

kiwifarms.net
I was never a fan of the "Pride" parades/events.. even in the 1980s. It astounds me that nearly every single The Gays™ have totally forgotten what the Pride day orginally celebrated; The Gays™ not being arrested for being gay in a gay bar. The federal goverment amended the Civil Rights act to include us... The Gays™ shortly thereafter.

Why does this astound me that The Gays™ seem to forget what we have accomplished (legally speaking)? Today's LGBTLMNOP Alphabet Nazi brigade cries that we The Gays™ are still "oppressed" and "marginalized" by society at large.. When I point out all the major companies like Alaska Airlines, Wells Fargo, Kroger, Heck, even Communist "News" Network gushes on about Gay Pride week is pure acceptance when companies cash in on advertising dollars.. they still manage to cry "victim".

...then you have the actual "Pride" event itself.. which is as you described.. rather shameful display of self indulgence.

The problem is that I think it's more complicated. I think that there is a "the personal is political" grey area. For one thing, companies may accept you, but what about your parents? Does political/social activism really solved the emotional problems or traumas that LGBs faced? I am at the point where I think that most politics are therapeutic defense mechanisms to work through individual issues.
 

Kornula

kiwifarms.net
The problem is that I think it's more complicated. I think that there is a "the personal is political" grey area. For one thing, companies may accept you, but what about your parents? Does political/social activism really solved the emotional problems or traumas that LGBs faced? I am at the point where I think that most politics are therapeutic defense mechanisms to work through individual issues.
If we as a society have major companies openly sponsoring Gay Pride events all over North America, It's a safe bet parents in general are more accepting. I don't think its grey at all. We have gone past the point of needing gay pride for at least 35 years..

There will always be shitty parents - but that number has been dwindling for decades.
As for "activism" its equally unnecessary as it's proven beyond the shadow of a doubt The Gays™ have not needed anything legally to be active for (or against) We are all protected fully under federal law as far as we can or should need. Heck, Alaska's state constitution has individual rights strongly spelled out better than the Federal one.

Furthermore, regarding activism: all I have seen since I came out is The Gays™ bitching, nagging, name calling and outright lying in all that time (1982) None of it has helpled..or been necessary.
 

Noir drag freak

kiwifarms.net
If we as a society have major companies openly sponsoring Gay Pride events all over North America, It's a safe bet parents in general are more accepting. I don't think its grey at all. We have gone past the point of needing gay pride for at least 35 years..

There will always be shitty parents - but that number has been dwindling for decades.
As for "activism" its equally unnecessary as it's proven beyond the shadow of a doubt The Gays™ have not needed anything legally to be active for (or against) We are all protected fully under federal law as far as we can or should need. Heck, Alaska's state constitution has individual rights strongly spelled out better than the Federal one.

Furthermore, regarding activism: all I have seen since I came out is The Gays™ bitching, nagging, name calling and outright lying in all that time (1982) None of it has helpled..or been necessary.

I guess you're right. I watched this movie called "Straight UP!" about this "gay" guy that starting dating a woman through they didn't have sex. One scene that touched me was when the guy's father hugged him and told him he was proud of him. The guy even mentioned that it probably wouldn't happened if he brought home a guy. I think that parent's love and accept their gay children, but prefer it if they were straight.

You make very good points. :)
 

RavenCrow

It's only gay if the balls touch.
kiwifarms.net
I just don’t like them, simple as that. I’ve never met a tranny who wasn’t either doing it for woke points or the “fuck you mom and dad! I’m an edgy rebel!” mentality. I’ve never met a tranny who wasn’t a neurotic nutcase that acts like a 14 year old girl on Tumblr (no trannies, that’s NOT a compliment) I’ve never met a tranny that can’t take the hint not everyone wants to fuck them and they’re not a seig heiling Nazi for having preferences. I’ve never met a tranny that wasn’t trying to groom children into trooning out because little Billy might like baking cookies or little Suzy might like shooting hoops with the guys. They’re obnoxious, they’re degenerate, worst than any mincing twinky faggot I’ve seen

100%. I'm gay, and I can admit it isn't exactly normal, but I personally hate being lumped into this tranny bullshit. Every single tranny I've ever met has been nuts. The one I kinda gave a chance as a friend turned out to rape kids. This was someone I met when writing for a newspaper that I interviewed. They "she" seemed fine, but their degeneracy was eventually revealed. I also know a lot of homos who want nothing to do with them too. Yet for some reason we're forced to allow them in "our group" and act like a 6ft tall dude pretending to be a girl is completely normal... when it's actually creepy and likely a sign of severe mental illness.
 
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