Shitty Alternate History Thread - If only the Romans had AK-47's they would've survived...

Coleman Francis

True & Honest Fan
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Turtledove is a professor of Byzantine history by training, and it really shows in his work. Anything he writes that isn't (loosely) based on Belisarius and Justinian kind of misses the mark. But both he and Stirling are guilty of adding excessively gratuitous sex scenes into their alternate history novels, making many of them nigh unreadable to me. If I wanted gratuitous sex scenes that don't detract from the main plot, I would read some of the more graphic titles of French uchronie.
I can't speak for Stirling based on the few chapters I read of his online, but yeah, even those few chapters had IIRC a rape, and lots of mention of rape. Turtledove does shoehorn in sex scenes, but IMO they aren't distracting from the plot. I can even understand why he does them. He writes books about war, but he also focuses on the human aspect of it. He writes about adult men and women and because of this he feels it necessary to squeeze in a couple sex scenes. Thankfully, they're typically short and to the point, but I agree, they are unnecessary.

One word:

Draka.

Lol.
That's the one I read a few chapters of online. Super South Africa with lots of rape.
 

Mr. Burgers

Jesse Radin
Person of Interest
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My mom used to complain that the only reason Houston got the rocket launch for moon landing was because we had a Texan (Lyndon Johnson) in office and Texans always give projects to Texas.

So I would go back in time, somehow convince Nixon to wear makeup for his debates with JFK so he could win the 1960 election... and with someone from California in office, the rockets would be somewhere in California.
 
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Guardian G.I.

СНГ scum
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Shitty "alternate" "history" flourishes in Russia, a country where a person's political views can be easily guessed by asking "In what year did everything in Russia go to complete shit?*". Even though the official media ignores it, it brings a lot of money to publishers and writers. People don't buy books often these days, but alt-history sells well.

The most notable, overused and annoying trope of these books is "ordinary Russian Spetznaz trooper finds himself in [insert year here] during [insert war/other important event here] and makes Russia/USSR great again". The fact that linguistic and cultural differences would easily prevent MRGA at day 1 doesn't matter - the wank is more important. On the Internet, these characters are labelled with a nigh-untranslatable derogative term "попаданец"**. Shitty alt-history writers have tried to spice it up with a slightly different idea - "ordinary Russian Spetznaz trooper finds himself in the body of [insert Russian historical figure] during [insert war/other important event here] and makes Russia/USSR great again", which is similarly gay and unrealistic. Said writers often claim to be "retired future Spetnaz/[insert Soviet special force here] fighters", which is somewhat bullshit, because I really doubt Soviet special forces had so many idiots with graphomania in their ranks.

All these writers are, unsurprisingly, Russian nationalists/radical communists/monarchists/etc., and their ideas have never evolved past their deep dark geopolitical fantasies. Their 'work' isn't much different from Mary Sue fanfics, only with their country being the greatest instead of their self-inserts. And it's a shame, because there are plenty of interesting ideas and points of divergence that could be explored by someone with an actual brain. But who would read them? No one - everyone is interested in alternate history wank.

The cover art of these books are a thing on their own. I'm sure the poor guys who design them are deliberately taking a piss out of the bullshit writers.


Some photoshops of that thing:



The book is called "Red Padavan". Yeah.
...replace them with fantasy world Spetznaz! "Tankman: Elf on the frontlines of Great Patriotic War"

There is a modicum of a good idea in here, but it requires an actual writer with actual talent.
Etc. etc. etc. I could go on and on and on about this garbage.
---
* 2000? Pro-Western liberal. 1993? Nationalist. 1991? Communist. 1953? Stalinist. 1920-something? Leninist or Trotskyist. 1917? Monarchist. Etc.
**plural "попаданцы", derived from Russian verb "попадать" (to get into smth.).
 
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neverendingmidi

it just goes on and on and on and on...
kiwifarms.net
Another silly alternate history novel series that I think is pretty fun is Eric Flint's 1632 series. The premise is that a West Virginian coal mining town from the late 1990s gets transported through space and time to the middle of Germany at the height of the Thirty Years War. Cue American rednecks armed with the best in 20th century small arms firepower siding with the Protestants, upgrading their armies with their hands-on knowledge of modern gunsmithing and tactics, and dishing out some serious whoop-ass on the Catholic armies, bringing the American revolution to Europe some 150 years early. Stirring reading for any redblooded, papist-hating American patriot
I liked the first one, but the second kind of dragged for me, and after that I found them good insomnia cures. But that's just my opinion, so grain of salt... dash of tequila... whatever.
 

Elwood P. Dowd

I am the lizard king. I can do ... anything.
kiwifarms.net
Another silly alternate history novel series that I think is pretty fun is Eric Flint's 1632 series. The premise is that a West Virginian coal mining town from the late 1990s gets transported through space and time to the middle of Germany at the height of the Thirty Years War. Cue American rednecks armed with the best in 20th century small arms firepower siding with the Protestants, upgrading their armies with their hands-on knowledge of modern gunsmithing and tactics, and dishing out some serious whoop-ass on the Catholic armies, bringing the American revolution to Europe some 150 years early. Stirring reading for any redblooded, papist-hating American patriot
Odd to think that Eric Flint is about as left of center as it is possible to be without skidding off to cloud-cuckoo land. He actually worked as a union labor organizer in the deep South back when being such a thing could easily earn you a beating, or maybe even worse. 'Course he is published by Baen, which seems on some level or other to always lead to an "America, Fuck Yeah!" outcome.
 

millais

The Yellow Rose of Victoria, Texas
kiwifarms.net
Why the hateboner for the UK?
They still haven't gotten over the Great Game. In terms of more recent historical memory, they remember Britain meddling in the Russian Civil War at Arkhangelsk and helping out the Czech Legion, and it didn't help that Churchill was a big Russophobe who never fully trusted Stalin and developed contingency plans in 1945 to rearm the Wehrmacht and launch a preemptive attack on Soviet occupied Europe to sweep away the last remnants of fascism and communism in the same blow.
Odd to think that Eric Flint is about as left of center as it is possible to be without skidding off to cloud-cuckoo land. He actually worked as a union labor organizer in the deep South back when being such a thing could easily earn you a beating, or maybe even worse. 'Course he is published by Baen, which seems on some level or other to always lead to an "America, Fuck Yeah!" outcome.
Most of the American "good guys" in the book are West Virginian coal miners, and the local union even becomes the focal point of their initial organizing efforts when trying to lead the defense of the town against the 17th century armies.
 

Syaoran Li

The Anime Night Stalker
kiwifarms.net
Both are sorcerers who made pact with demons.
Fun fact, Rasputin is an evil lich aligned with the Reds in my "Romanovs & Revolutions" old-school D&D campaign, much like he was in Anastasia (which was one of my favorite movies from my childhood, oddly enough)

The alignment system has been changed in Romanovs & Revolutions as well. Taking a page from Original D&D's three-piece alignment system of Law, Neutrality, and Chaos, the alignments are now White (Anti-Communists, equivalent to Good), Green (Peasant militias, equivalent to Neutral), and Red (Bolsheviks, equivalent to Evil).

Each alignment has a unique spin to the Cleric class.

White-aligned Clerics are part of the Russian Orthodox Church and can repel undead

Green-aligned Clerics are either Siberian tribal shamans or Slavic pagan druid-types and can repel constructs but not undead

Red-aligned Clerics are Commissars of the Communist Party and can either command undead (because Dirty Commie Bastards) or command constructs (because the Soviet brands of Marxist-Leninism and Stalinism were extremely technocratic in nature)

Romanovs & Revolutions is a steampunk historical fantasy game with magic, so historical accuracy is obviously not a priority.
 
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Sable

DANGEROUSLY WELCOMING IN THE NEW YEAR
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I think the Alt history site tries to have standards, but basically anyone can join and start a thread so lots of stuff gets through.

The 'Alien Space Bats' thing is for fiction and magic, so there's a lot of stuff that's basically fanfic, but some of it's okay.

p.s Don't check the chat section, they're still melting down about Trump. Heck, they're still in a kerfuffle over Brexit.

If we're talking published things then somebody already mentioned the Draka, which is basically when the edgy bad guys have everything go their way and win forever. I think the author did it on purpose, but that doesn't mean it's not stupid.

In a way awful alternate history is actually better if it's awful, because at least you can laugh at it.
 

Curt Sibling

Napoleon Blownapart
True & Honest Fan
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I've read quite a few alt-history books. I think Turtledove and Stirling's works are quite over-rated, also not too well-written.
However, I suppose their tales are meant to be fun, and not really well-researched, intellectual excercises. The best book of
this type I have discovered tend to be written by small-scale, but scholarly indie publishers...

My favourite is "The Grey Tide", in which Kaiser Bill decides not to invade Belgium in WW1, and instead defeats Russia.
Britain does not get involved. The war ends in summer 1916. France loses 500,000 men, instead of a million. Germany
is generous in the peace treaty. And the world moves forward, never knowing nazism or communism.
 

millais

The Yellow Rose of Victoria, Texas
kiwifarms.net
I'm pretty sure there must be an English translation of the Wunderwaffen series out there (it's an obnoxiously pandering Luft '46 type of scenario), but this is from one of the spinoff volumes that has nothing to do with the main alternate timeline, so it may be too obscure. Anyway, you probably get the gist of it even if you can't read French, and as the weeaboo say, English dubs are for filthy casuals anyway.


 

Pointless Pedant

Disgusting Liberal
True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
I think the Alt history site tries to have standards, but basically anyone can join and start a thread so lots of stuff gets through.

The 'Alien Space Bats' thing is for fiction and magic, so there's a lot of stuff that's basically fanfic, but some of it's okay.

p.s Don't check the chat section, they're still melting down about Trump. Heck, they're still in a kerfuffle over Brexit.

If we're talking published things then somebody already mentioned the Draka, which is basically when the edgy bad guys have everything go their way and win forever. I think the author did it on purpose, but that doesn't mean it's not stupid.

In a way awful alternate history is actually better if it's awful, because at least you can laugh at it.
It's weird that they hate Trump and Brexit so much. The Paradox gaming community has a lot of nationalist types and I thought that overlapped quite heavily with alternate history.

Maybe the forum just has very harsh moderation.
 

Sable

DANGEROUSLY WELCOMING IN THE NEW YEAR
kiwifarms.net
Maybe the forum just has very harsh moderation.
The thing is, whilst the site is rather left-wing, it's usually pretty balanced when it comes to moderation. You'll get banned for being an insane conspiracy theorist no matter what you epouse. Same with wishing death on people, even Trump, is a punishable offense. A lot of times, no amount of REEEEEE-ing at the mods did anything, because they don't drink the cool-aid.

The only real outlier is Gamergate, which doesn't really make too much sense to be honest as there's not actually that much gaming on-site, but it caused an almost unprecedented (and hilarious) banpocalypse. More than Trump, more than MLP.

For the record, there ARE Paradox fans on-site, along with lots of other games along that vein- Y'know, Hearts of Iron, Crusader Kings etc.

Interestingly the instigator of the Financhu crisis is a member, but hasn't been active in almost a year.
 
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