Star Wars Griefing Thread (Formerly about Last Jedi) - It's nothing like Empire... like.... at all, we promise

verissimus

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Almost sounds like this movie could be the 3 hour version of Fan4stic or X-men : Dark Phoenix. Jeeze, I cannot imagine people not leaving the theater for this movie or falling asleep.
 

RomanesEuntDomus

May contain nuts.
True & Honest Fan
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Jesus christ, it's going to be two and a half fucking hours of lens flares, member berries, and disjointed aping of the OT's conclusion, but with none of the emotional payoff of having seen Luke complete his journey. Rey has not changed at all and due to her nature as a perfect Mary Sue Snowflake, cannot improve in any way, shape, or form. There's nothing to celebrate when she inevitably defeats Kylo and the Emperor and the entire Dark Side of the Force in a stunning display... because we were here from the start. Nobody cheers at the start of a marathon, and yet, Rey is still sitting right where she started.
If Rey wins over Kylo Ren in this movie, there is literally nothing to cheer about. She bested him several times by now, so there is no tension here.
There is also no personal struggle of any kind since there's nothing distinct that she's trying to achieve. "Defeating the bad guys" is too vague and not her personal motivation.
She gave up on finding her parents in TFA. She gave up on finding them again in TLJ. Now, IX will give us some "She was a Skywalker all along!" plot or she'll give us a "She's a granddaughter of Palpatine all along!" plot. We've fucking abondoned the "Rey's parentage" plot twice already, why bring it up a third time, it should, by all accounts, mean nothing to her.
What else is there to really define her character, to give her a personal goal to work towards?

When Rey finally wins against the First Order and redeems (or kills) Kylo, it will not really feel like much, since there ar no stakes. No personal investment. It will feel like she's going through the motions of the plot.

And of course, there's barely any place remaining for her personal growth as a character since she lacks a character and personality. You said that in the "Marathon" of the plot she's were she started and thus there's no reason to cheer. The problem is: She already started behind the finishing line. We don't have to watch her overcome herself and become capable in using the Force, she already has achieved that non-chalantly with great ease. She's already at the goal, on her way to the podium, while the race officially isn't even over yet. And when you point out that it's bullshit that one of the runners started right behind the finishing line, you're branded a bigot. Here's something funny:

Imagine an alternate cut where Rey is a long-lost Jedi Master, what changes would it take in the movies to accomodate that?
She's already using whatever Force ability she needs at the moment she needs it perfectly. Changing Rey, someone who supposedly doesn't know what the Jedi even are to a Jedi-master, should shift her character to an absolutely ridiculous degree and alter the story completely, but when you really think about it, movie-wise nothing much changes. A few lines of dialogues at best. All her actions remain the same. At no point would you go "Here, she could really profit from doing Jedi-Stuff" cause whenever she's in need of a Force ability, she just pulls it right out of her ass.
Being tortured and questioned by Kylo? She just defends against and even turns around the mind reading.
Captured and held prisoner? She just uses the mind trick.
Has to fight back an angsty Sith-Lord-fanboy-school-shooter with a light sabre? She easily fights him off.
You could even say that her amazing flying skills are part of her Jedi-Powers...

And even though Disney was running the mills of paid Journalism to fight back against the well-earned label of Mary Sue, they are aware that this is a huge criticism against Rey...
So, what I expect: Rey will have a downgrade in power or a few failures in the first and second act of the new movie. Then, she'll overcome the spontaneously errected limits and the movie will treat that achievement, even though she's done things of a similar calibre multiple times already, but Disney has no choice, they need to pretend that she's not perfect and all-powerful, they need to cram some pretend-character-development into this thing.
 

Zaryiu

Nobody important
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Rey is no Jedi, besides not having real jedi training (contrast Yoda's and Luke teachings and she got at best the basics) and if you paid attention she always wins her fight by using the dark side (she always give in to anger in her fights)
 
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Dr W

In the end, the living shall envy the dead.
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So, what I expect: Rey will have a downgrade in power or a few failures in the first and second act of the new movie. Then, she'll overcome the spontaneously errected limits and the movie will treat that achievement, even though she's done things of a similar calibre multiple times already, but Disney has no choice, they need to pretend that she's not perfect and all-powerful, they need to cram some pretend-character-development into this thing.
I disagree with that entirely. Remember it was Abrams who started with Rey sitting on the finish line while the starting gun of the trilogy fired, and remember that it was Abrams who obediently and doggedly insulted the Star Wars fanbase, calling us all misogynists terrified of women.
Kennedy is still in charge, they are still trying to make things Space Twilight, ergo REY WILL NOT FAIL. She'll encounter maybe about as much resistance as she did in TLJ: One scene of semi-vulnerability, less than thirty seconds of weakness, and right back up on the Sue Train she goes. A few swipes from disappearing knives and an easily escaped grapple later, and she's back to total infallibility.
 
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GeneralFriendliness

General of Dokar's Soy-Slaying Anti-Lego Regiment
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Oh, when their big trailer was outdone by the Joker of all people, and the clipshow they made nuked with dislikes, you know that they're not thinking this thing is salvageable.
This is... really embarrassing... The reaction is way more mixed to negative than I expected and comments sections for the trailer (outside of the main SW channel) are all jabbing or outright hating on the film or making fun of the memberberries.
And this reshoot nonsense combined with having to call on George for help for like the third or fourth time this year (first for Mandalorian, then for IX, and now for IX again) is just... really fucking lame... How could you fuck up one of the world's most popular franchises and completely divide and ruin the fanbase in just 5 years?

Now is as good as a time as any, if you don't mind
Only thing I haven't discussed from the park are little things, like some bios on new aliens created solely for the park despite not appearing in it, the lightsaber ban and a lot of things from Dok Ondar's store like a golden bust of Jar Jar that's hidden away on the second floor for example. Which should I discuss?
 

Kiwi Lime Pie

Uncompromisably tasteful. 🥝🥧🐈
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Reshoots are a pretty common thing in movie making, I guess... but is there any movie that was improved by widespread reshooting of stuff?
I'm thinking about what movies there are where reshoots improved the movie, but I can't really think of one. I can see movies being improved by little reshoots, but this seems much more excessive and Rogue One/Solo already showed us, that this hardly works with the current people behind SW.
And the thing is that with today's use of digital technology, reshoots shouldn't be as common as they used to be.

Fox example, I believe Daisy Ridley has one or more tattoos in inconspicuous spots that can be easily covered. It used to be the case that a filmed close-up of her that showed off one of these tattoos when it shouldn't be visible would result in a reshoot. Now, thanks to digital editing, it's easy to edit it out in post-production (or whatever the process might be properly called).

As a result, reshoots in today's films usually aren't used for trivial matters. The fact that there's so much being reshot so close to the anticipated release date truly is troubling. This suggests that there are major or wholesale changes being made. While we neither know what nor why, it certainly sounds as if one of the following things is happening:
  • There were "creative differences" during the original shooting and the reshoots are being made to resolves those issues;
  • Disney/LucasFilm knows Episode IX needs to hit a home run to salvage both the trilogy and the franchise, so they've decided to go back and change various scenes in hopes of getting the success and positive reception they desperately need from non-diehard fans;
  • Both of the above; or,
  • Some other reason yet to be known.

I can't see how this movie can turn out as anything but an incoherent, disjointed, staggeringly poorly constructed mess of a movie. It'll be its own perfect microcosm of completely botched bullshit in a trilogy of incoherent, disjointed, staggeringly poorly constructed mess of movies.
As I believe I said at some point during the thread, the sequel trilogy has had very little cohesion, if any, so far. A trilogy is supposed to have three parts that either relate to each other or build on each other. There has been none of that so far thanks to having two distinctly different directors with seemingly-opposing philosophies, agendas, etc. At this point, I'm not sure how successful Episode IX can be if it tries to be cohesive with what's been released so far. If it tries to mesh with TFA, it won't be able to have much that ties into TLJ. If it tries to mesh with TLJ, then there will be few connections to TFA. @RomanesEuntDomus has the right idea that this is likely doomed to be yet another disjointed movie no matter how well it might turn out to be.

To use a sports analogy from American football, Disney currently trails by 8 points with 1 second left in the game and faces fourth down from their own 1-yard line. Disney needs to run a play that will gain 99 yards, score a touchdown, and then successfully score a two-point conversion -- all just to tie the game to force overtime. Anything less is a loss.

For non-sports fans: Disney has much to do to show that they can competently handle the SW franchise. While it's not totally impossible for them to accomplish this with Episode IX, the reality is it's quite improbable.

Only thing I haven't discussed from the park are little things, like some bios on new aliens created solely for the park despite not appearing in it, the lightsaber ban and a lot of things from Dok Ondar's store like a golden bust of Jar Jar that's hidden away on the second floor for example. Which should I discuss?
While I'd be interested in any/all of the above, my top curiosity is learning more about the new aliens created solely for the park while not actually existing.
 

Godzilla@1989

DESTROY US ALL!
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While we neither know what nor why, it certainly sounds as if one of the following things is happening:
  • There were "creative differences" during the original shooting and the reshoots are being made to resolves those issues;
  • Disney/LucasFilm knows Episode IX needs to hit a home run to salvage both the trilogy and the franchise, so they've decided to go back and change various scenes in hopes of getting the success and positive reception they desperately need from non-diehard fans;
  • Both of the above; or,
  • Some other reason yet to be known.
Another possibility that I stress a lot since the reshoots is that they had poor test screenings that didn’t go well and scramble from there.
 

Iwasamwillbe

Rational Big-Brained Deep-Thinking Philosopher
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HeyYou

seriousposter
True & Honest Fan
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This was likely posted before, but...


If the Skywalker family live goes extinct, while Rey Palpatine, granddaughter of Sheev Palpatine, becomes the galaxy's sole Jedi, it will be the very height of irony. And stupidity.
If this was before TLJ came out (I was mildly hyped for TFA), I'd be infuriated if the plan was to make the Skywalkers die out and have a fucking Palpatine end up continuing the Jedi. Now it's just hilarious.
 

RumblyTumbly

kiwifarms.net
JJ Abrams isn't useless. If I were one of the powers that be, I'd be happy to see him kick off a film series.

I'd then ban him from the lot while someone else tried to resolve his plot points.

He can't follow up with a successful conclusion. Never has, never will.
I think that was the original intention. Get JJ to kick us off and then whoever does VIII and IX will pay everything off.

Then Last Jedi happened....yeeeeeeah.

And then the director of IX got the shit canned....yeeeeeah.
 
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