Steven Universe -

The Pink Panther

Why Can't Man Be More Like Animals?
True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
I'm at the beginning of Season 5 now. Season 4 is the worst season of the show. They pretty much threw out most of the redeeming factors of the show and made them completely boring and a lot of the episodes started to have unexplained implications and writing flaws that made them very terrible to watch. Season 5 is a little better so far, but that's because it had my favorite story arc up to date for the first 4 episodes until that weak ending.
 

Archeops

Whispering seeds of doubt into the ears of troons
kiwifarms.net

If it’s bad we tear it to shreds, lol, and never look back.
Given the kind of shit that's been unnecessarily added to the series (pointless NB rep, a boarder pulling a Zuke and going above Sugar's head and make a character some form of representation that THEM feel validated, turning one character with a somewhat-decent backstory into a retread of one of the main characters, pointless Middle-Eastern rep as a one-shot character, etc.) I'd say SUF has already been ripped to shreds.
 

Nauseated Courgi

It's an Ass-Fuck-Get-Fucked world out there
kiwifarms.net

Archeops

Whispering seeds of doubt into the ears of troons
kiwifarms.net
You know what I just realized? CN is killing one of their bigger viewership magnets. I wonder what'll fill the void?

If anyone suggests TTG or TCR they get fifty lashes with a coronavirus-laced cat o' nine-tails and their negholes pozzed. Just because it's true that doesn't mean we need to be reminded of the horror.
 

Akumaten

kiwifarms.net
You know what I just realized? CN is killing one of their bigger viewership magnets. I wonder what'll fill the void?

If anyone suggests TTG or TCR they get fifty lashes with a coronavirus-laced cat o' nine-tails and their negholes pozzed. Just because it's true that doesn't mean we need to be reminded of the horror.
Steven Universe was always for the 41%/1% Tumblr crowd. It's a bad idea to pander to them.
 
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Private Pyle

I am...in a world...of shit.
kiwifarms.net
You know what I just realized? CN is killing one of their bigger viewership magnets. I wonder what'll fill the void?

If anyone suggests TTG or TCR they get fifty lashes with a coronavirus-laced cat o' nine-tails and their negholes pozzed. Just because it's true that doesn't mean we need to be reminded of the horror.
Steven Universe was always for the 41%/1% Tumblr crowd. It's a bad idea to pander to them.
We could only hope TCR fizzles out the same way PPG 2016 did. Maybe then CN will finally get the memo to stop making reboots.
As for what will replace SU, that’s a big mystery so far. Infinity Train is currently their biggest lore show and rumor has it that it’s going to HBO Max. It’s pretty dry at the moment and the pilots aren’t looking too good.
 

The Pink Panther

Why Can't Man Be More Like Animals?
True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
I am completely caught up now.

How the fuck is Steven Universe Future so kino compared to the original show? The characters have depth, the humor is funny, the stories are great and have weight (with some predictability), like seriously. What a change.
 
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Private Pyle

I am...in a world...of shit.
kiwifarms.net
I am completely caught up now.

How the fuck is Steven Universe Future so kino compared to the original show? The characters have depth, the humor is funny, the stories are great and have weight (with some predictability), like seriously. What a change.
While I can see why people would like Future more than SU, as seen in this thread, I have a lot of gripes with it that will keep it from being kino. For every step forward, they took two steps back and ultimately, it’s something not really needed from a narrative standpoint.
To give you a more concrete answer; mostly new staff+limited episode run=less room to fuck up.
 

The Pink Panther

Why Can't Man Be More Like Animals?
True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
While I can see why people would like Future more than SU, as seen in this thread, I have a lot of gripes with it that will keep it from being kino. For every step forward, they took two steps back and ultimately, it’s something not really needed from a narrative standpoint.
To give you a more concrete answer; mostly new staff+limited episode run=less room to fuck up.
I kinda like it because I think of it as a sort of meta-commentary on the aftermath of a hero finding no purpose within himself after having saved the world.

I read this thread and people say it ruined the characters and I don't look at it that way. In fact, it made the characters more complex. The OG series, the characters were bland and one-note, and here for the most part (with a few exceptions), they deepen the characters, particularly Steven. I'll use one example. With Mr. Universe, for example, I think it expanded the extent of Greg's character and the relationship between Steven and Greg. Greg has always been a well-meaning father or whatnot, but he's too easy on his son. He's always been that way. He's caring and nice, but he's too nice. He's merely only a free-range parent because of the strict way he was raised as a child. Similar to Rose, Greg rebelled against the authority for his own self-interest and in the end, this affected how Steven copes with life. Greg rarely got mad over the course of the show with him, with the exception of Beach City Drift where he sternly said to Steven to not say "hate". Even though Steven has gone through various challenges (some of which in particular within the 5th season, he didn't react to in the most proper way), his father never raised him to be tough, socially, and deal with his own personal problems without breaking down considering Steven was always solving other people's shit. In fact, I look at it as sort of a way of how Greg failed Steven. Steven is way too sensitive and that's due to Greg's sentimentality and Rose's free-spirited shit being projected onto him. Greg never gave Steven challenges, Steven had to go through challenges on his own measures. Imagine, hypothetically, if Steven was not even a Gem and Greg raised Steven in that same manner. Steven would've just learned how to be constantly reliant and needy on others and the slightest challenge would've probably broken him. That final scene in the episode where Greg coddles Steven and shit after the whole car crash and then it just focuses in on Steven deleting the pic off his phone felt to me sort of a defining factor of Steven rejecting his father's easygoing ways. Jasper, within Fragments, metaphorically is supposed to be Steven training to be a tougher person even though most of this is driven by his anger towards the people around him.

Steven, although he's an irrational teenager in some cases, has a point with most of his critiques towards his dad. At the end of the day, Greg didn't raise the boy right. The gems didn't either considering that they basically forced themselves to train Steven to fight for his life.

Edit: Also, I am in NO WAY defending the utterly shitty writing that this entire franchise has delivered up to this point. I'm just saying that I think the way that Future sheds light on the characters doesn't ruin them, but it gives much-needed depth. I hated how the OG show's characters were mostly stereotypes and you saw those stereotypes in stories and none of those interactions had much impact.
 
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Alto

To the stars!
kiwifarms.net
The sad thing is that I really wanted to like this show. I enjoy seeing gentler cartoons with warm messages about love or friendship. Even the boring mundane shit would be fine if it was just about a little boy growing up and not about intergalactic gem battles or some shit. The show and especially its fanbase has really ruined a lot of modern animated pop culture, especially since every show to come out of CN now either looks cheap and lazy like TTG or just full-on bean-mouth Calarts.

I liked Steven himself initially. Sure he had that annoying hyper little kid thing going on but I found it sweet for what it was. And I appreciated that although Steven has a lot of very femmy, nonviolent characteristics, he did accurately act like a little boy and was not necessarily a bad role model to the little kids watching. Out of all the characters, Steven did not need a dark angst arc. I was eager to see him become more mature and responsible over time but I could not begin to imagine that they'd pull this shit with him during the final season.

This show is wasted potential. If it had been given to someone who knew how to write, it could have been a modern classic beloved by all. I don't see it lasting that long in public consciousness after it ends. It's very of its time and will likely be dated af in a few years. Plus, the writing flaws are so glaring that they could very well spoil the whole show in hindsight, especially if the ending is as lazy as I think it's going to be.
 

The Pink Panther

Why Can't Man Be More Like Animals?
True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
I liked Steven himself initially. Sure he had that annoying hyper little kid thing going on but I found it sweet for what it was. And I appreciated that although Steven has a lot of very femmy, nonviolent characteristics, he did accurately act like a little boy and was not necessarily a bad role model to the little kids watching. Out of all the characters, Steven did not need a dark angst arc. I was eager to see him become more mature and responsible over time but I could not begin to imagine that they'd pull this shit with him during the final season.
I didn't really like Steven throughout the show. To me, he started out as a fucking retarded child that got into magical shit (ala Billy and Mandy) and then he mellowed out into some moral guy that pretty much stands by watching other characters going through shit with him occasionally having to go through his own up until the 4th season where he's all about finding out shit about his mother. The little shit was too happy and nice and constantly moralfagging. His only character arc throughout the show was learning his power and his destiny and then learning that shit to save the universe. He never learned how to cope with real life. All he ever knew was the Gems, Greg, Connie, and the people of Beach City. That is a weird way to live a life.

I prefer angsty Steven because at the core of his character he still maintains his need to try to help others and all that shit, here, but here we finally get the full extent of Steven's flaws as well as him breaking down and shit. He's matured, but inside he's broken. We see that vividly throughout the series where no normal SU episode had ever gone before. Plus, it's actually fucking interesting. No shitty townie episodes, no stupid Gems, it's Steven front and center, but with actual development. Yeah, Steven perspective is still crap, but I don't mind it here considering SUF is supposed to be a deconstruction of the original series.
 

Private Pyle

I am...in a world...of shit.
kiwifarms.net
I kinda like it because I think of it as a sort of meta-commentary on the aftermath of a hero finding no purpose within himself after having saved the world.

I read this thread and people say it ruined the characters and I don't look at it that way. In fact, it made the characters more complex. The OG series, the characters were bland and one-note, and here for the most part (with a few exceptions), they deepen the characters, particularly Steven. I'll use one example. With Mr. Universe, for example, I think it expanded the extent of Greg's character and the relationship between Steven and Greg. Greg has always been a well-meaning father or whatnot, but he's too easy on his son. He's always been that way. He's caring and nice, but he's too nice. He's merely only a free-range parent because of the strict way he was raised as a child. Similar to Rose, Greg rebelled against the authority for his own self-interest and in the end, this affected how Steven copes with life. Greg rarely got mad over the course of the show with him, with the exception of Beach City Drift where he sternly said to Steven to not say "hate". Even though Steven has gone through various challenges (some of which in particular within the 5th season, he didn't react to in the most proper way), his father never raised him to be tough, socially, and deal with his own personal problems without breaking down considering Steven was always solving other people's shit. In fact, I look at it as sort of a way of how Greg failed Steven. Steven is way too sensitive and that's due to Greg's sentimentality and Rose's free-spirited shit being projected onto him. Greg never gave Steven challenges, Steven had to go through challenges on his own measures. Imagine, hypothetically, if Steven was not even a Gem and Greg raised Steven in that same manner. Steven would've just learned how to be constantly reliant and needy on others and the slightest challenge would've probably broken him. That final scene in the episode where Greg coddles Steven and shit after the whole car crash and then it just focuses in on Steven deleting the pic off his phone felt to me sort of a defining factor of Steven rejecting his father's easygoing ways. Jasper, within Fragments, metaphorically is supposed to be Steven training to be a tougher person even though most of this is driven by his anger towards the people around him.

Steven, although he's an irrational teenager in some cases, has a point with most of his critiques towards his dad. At the end of the day, Greg didn't raise the boy right. The gems didn't either considering that they basically forced themselves to train Steven to fight for his life.

Edit: Also, I am in NO WAY defending the utterly shitty writing that this entire franchise has delivered up to this point. I'm just saying that I think the way that Future sheds light on the characters doesn't ruin them, but it gives much-needed depth. I hated how the OG show's characters were mostly stereotypes and you saw those stereotypes in stories and none of those interactions had much impact.
I like the idea of the exploring the aftermath of the hero’s journey once it’s over. It’s honestly interesting, I just think it needs better execution.

Now this is a controversial opinion, but I think that the characters were complex at the beginning and it rubs me the wrong way that people say only now they’re “deep”. Oh don’t get me wrong, plenty of characters were one note stereotypes but you had characters like Pearl, Peridot and sometimes Amethyst who were fairly complex before flanderization hit. With Greg, what made him complex was that he deceived you; he looked like a complete fuck up at first but the show went to great lengths to prove he was actually better than you think he was. Mr. Universe didn’t really deepen him as a character, it just recasted his good actions as bad because “deconstruction”.

Other points of contention: The argument ignores all the fully responsible things Greg did (Steven only lived in a van until Greg got enough money to build a house) and all his attempts at trying to give him a normal childhood. Yet, for all his desire for normalcy, it never occurred to Steven that normal life wouldn’t have prepared him for all the bullshit either. Yet the show expects us to side with Steven and combined with Greg acting a little OOC, both parties come off as unsympathetic. Finally, Greg failing as a parent hinges on Steven being a completely different character; there’s a reason Greg was the pinnacle of fatherhood until recently.

I see what they’re going for, it just comes off as inorganic.
I didn't really like Steven throughout the show. To me, he started out as a fucking retarded child that got into magical shit (ala Billy and Mandy) and then he mellowed out into some moral guy that pretty much stands by watching other characters going through shit with him occasionally having to go through his own up until the 4th season where he's all about finding out shit about his mother. The little shit was too happy and nice and constantly moralfagging. His only character arc throughout the show was learning his power and his destiny and then learning that shit to save the universe. He never learned how to cope with real life. All he ever knew was the Gems, Greg, Connie, and the people of Beach City. That is a weird way to live a life.

I prefer angsty Steven because at the core of his character he still maintains his need to try to help others and all that shit, here, but here we finally get the full extent of Steven's flaws as well as him breaking down and shit. He's matured, but inside he's broken. We see that vividly throughout the series where no normal SU episode had ever gone before. Plus, it's actually fucking interesting. No shitty townie episodes, no stupid Gems, it's Steven front and center, but with actual development. Yeah, Steven perspective is still crap, but I don't mind it here considering SUF is supposed to be a deconstruction of the original series.
I put forth the question that if a lighthearted series needs to be angsty to be seen as good by others, is it not the fault of the audience? Of course I do admit I have my own bias; what got me into the show was the lore and world building in addition to the characters, not necessarily the melodrama and accuracy to real life.

Even setting that aside, it’s so erratic about being a deconstruction; you have Mr. Universe and Growing Pains but then you have Homeworld Bound where the Diamonds are redeemed no questions asked. I would think that would be something serious to tackle.
 

The Pink Panther

Why Can't Man Be More Like Animals?
True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
I like the idea of the exploring the aftermath of the hero’s journey once it’s over. It’s honestly interesting, I just think it needs better execution.

Now this is a controversial opinion, but I think that the characters were complex at the beginning and it rubs me the wrong way that people say only now they’re “deep”. Oh don’t get me wrong, plenty of characters were one note stereotypes but you had characters like Pearl, Peridot and sometimes Amethyst who were fairly complex before flanderization hit. With Greg, what made him complex was that he deceived you; he looked like a complete fuck up at first but the show went to great lengths to prove he was actually better than you think he was. Mr. Universe didn’t really deepen him as a character, it just recasted his good actions as bad because “deconstruction”.

Other points of contention: The argument ignores all the fully responsible things Greg did (Steven only lived in a van until Greg got enough money to build a house) and all his attempts at trying to give him a normal childhood. Yet, for all his desire for normalcy, it never occurred to Steven that normal life wouldn’t have prepared him for all the bullshit either. Yet the show expects us to side with Steven and combined with Greg acting a little OOC, both parties come off as unsympathetic. Finally, Greg failing as a parent hinges on Steven being a completely different character; there’s a reason Greg was the pinnacle of fatherhood until recently.

I see what they’re going for, it just comes off as inorganic.
Yeah, they were kinda complex characters, but my problem with the original series is that I don't think it did a good job at making the audience connect with the character. The focus of the show is always on STEVEN, and really Steven just overseeing. The characters never get their own solo episodes focusing on them separate from Steven, so the perspective of making them likable characters for me always faded away because of that. So when you see it from Steven's view of the situation, it just makes the characters look like assholes for the most part. I don't really relate with any of the characters (until Spinel came around) because they never really took the effort to go and develop them all the way. They develop scenarios and situations that make them flawed, but they never really enticed me. The only reason why SUF works is that majority of the focus is taking advantage of that Steven perspective and actually using that to go deep dive into the character and take apart aspects of the world and analyze them. It goes in and takes perspectives on what Steven is and expands on them.

I don't think Greg really ever deceived me. We probably have different views of the characters. To me, Greg is just a nice father that wants the best for his who got lucky with raising a gem after being a "failed" musician. I never was tricked by Greg and I never really thought of him as a loser character despite him looking like one. Steven Universe isn't the type of show I would expect, even being a newfag who only had watched the first episode 7 days ago, to have the "loser father" character. Plus, I don't think Mr. Universe makes Greg look like a bad character. Unlike Rose, it's not like he started a fucking war because "running a colony is SO BORING". He just gave Steven the ideal free life that he felt his parents didn't give him, which is relatable because everyone has those parental or authority figures you want to rebel against, the problem is that his free-range parenting didn't really help Steven. I'm not saying that Greg teaching Steven lessons about life was BAD, but I don't think Greg is really the IDEAL father figure, he's just some overly nice guy that ended up as a father who raised a son to be overly nice, but never have some backbone. Also, it's not really the normal life that I'm talking about, rather it's Greg's parenting. Steven lacked a parental figure that gave him tough love. Everyone always sucked his dick and Steven is upset at his father not because he needs to find someone to blame (well partially), but because no one really taught him how to be a tough person...but himself. Steven is in every right to criticize his father for treating him too nicely. Sometimes you need a balance of nice and tough love. That makes a person better. I know this is probably from my viewpoint given my stances on social issues and I don't think my perception is probably the writers knowing how those people are, but I think of it sort of like Fences where you have a teenager character trying to find himself, but he realizes the faults of his dad's parenting and tries to figure out things for himself to decide.

I put forth the question that if a lighthearted series needs to be angsty to be seen as good by others, is it not the fault of the audience? Of course I do admit I have my own bias; what got me into the show was the lore and world building in addition to the characters, not necessarily the melodrama and accuracy to real life.

Even setting that aside, it’s so erratic about being a deconstruction; you have Mr. Universe and Growing Pains but then you have Homeworld Bound where the Diamonds are redeemed no questions asked. I would think that would be something serious to tackle.
It doesn't need to be angsty to be good. Angsty doesn't always equal good. Adventure Time is proof of this. All I wish for is a balance of humor and character exploration instead of lore explanations and shit. A balance of both. SUF not only had WAY better writing, SUF had better jokes than all seasons of the show combined (though I will never forget "Thank you so much FOR FIXING MY VAN!") and I think that's thanks to the fact that most of it is done by the newer writers and story writers (as well as the fact that you can see some AT and Spongebob alumni in the credits; Jack Pendarvis is a surprising name to read). The jokes started hitting while also giving contrast to the very dark parts of Steven Universe, being Steven's mental trauma. I prefer the way this series is written because of ground and humor.

The Diamonds were redeemed no questions asked in the arc in the final few episodes. I really hated that they built them up as authoritarian leaders over the Gems and then BOOM right there, Steven solves their problems in 4 episodes. They only focused on the extent of the Diamonds' relationships with each other in the last few episodes and by then it felt extremely underdeveloped and incredibly rushed particularly with all of the filler-y shit surrounding Steven taking Pink Diamond's place, time that could've been spent on developing the Diamonds. The core issue of the series as a whole is that it constantly focuses on Steven I don't take issues with it in SUF because "natural progression" I guess. The Diamonds are bad characters bar none and I blame the OG series for not developing them because it was always STEVEN! STEVEN! STEVEN! STEVEN! Homeworld Bound is one of the weaker ones despite being one of the darker ones.
 

keyboredsm4shthe2nd

CRUSH YOUR ENEMIES! GRIND THEIR BONES INTO DIRT!
kiwifarms.net
I don't remember where I heard this, probably at the endless autism that is tvtropes, but someone suggested that the reason pink Steven is even a thing is not only because it got ripped out of him, but then it got reset by Spinel, It sort of makes sense if you figure half of Steven's DNA is his mom's, so in a hardware sense the gem was never fully wiped of her data so when White Diamond removed it, it split him in half (even in fusions one half can come out more) then when he was hit with the rejuvenator it reset Pink's lingering data back to day 1. Could be great, could be rarted, either way I guarantee you that's not where Becky's going because it would actually make sense.
 

Nauseated Courgi

It's an Ass-Fuck-Get-Fucked world out there
kiwifarms.net
I don't remember where I heard this, probably at the endless autism that is tvtropes, but someone suggested that the reason pink Steven is even a thing is not only because it got ripped out of him, but then it got reset by Spinel, It sort of makes sense if you figure half of Steven's DNA is his mom's, so in a hardware sense the gem was never fully wiped of her data so when White Diamond removed it, it split him in half (even in fusions one half can come out more) then when he was hit with the rejuvenator it reset Pink's lingering data back to day 1. Could be great, could be rarted, either way I guarantee you that's not where Becky's going because it would actually make sense.
Besides, didn't Steven reverse that anyway as he did with the others?