The Collectors Market -

Judge Dredd

Senior Layout Artist
kiwifarms.net
An offshoot of @-4ZURE- ‘s Nintendo Fandom thread. One topic that comes up occasionally in that thread is the collectors market. That thread is limited to Nintendo, this one will be about video game collectors more broadly.

On the surface, video game collectors are harmless and perfectly understandable, but when you scratch the surface it can get frustrating, or funny, as collectors and scalpers cause a feedback loop that drives the price of games through the roof and into space.


Retro collectors
Guys in their mid thirties to late forties who use their money to re-buy their childhood game collections and a few games they remember reading about in magazines or playing at a friends house.

Before games came on CDs, it was common to throw away the box (it was just packaging after all) and the manual would usually get lost or damaged, it being a cheap paper booklet in the hands of a child that had no interest in preservation. Over time, inflation, dying hardware, and no new supply meant that steady price rises were to be expected. Especially for mint condition, complete in box games.

Even after CDs, finding games in good condition can be tricky. Boxes that seem to have been used as dart boards, manuals that have been hotboxed and used as a dog's chew toy, and discs so scratched I have to believe they were used as sandpaper. Dreamcast cases were notoriously flimsy and would break in the hands of careful owners. This means that, whether you want a display item or something you can actually play, you’re not likely to find it at the local cash converters.

Where it becomes a problem is when a combination of YouTube hype and scalpers get involved, promoting bad games as classics simply because they’re rare and expensive, making them status symbols, must have products demanding outrageous prices on ebay. I remember the Sega Mega Drive. I don’t think MUSHA was ever mentioned back then.

I suspect it’s not worth the hype, because the “rare classic games” I do own aren’t up to the hype. I own Gotcha Force, I bought it back in the day. I remember it as a middling Pokemon clone where you circle strafe each other to death. Certainly not the crown jewel of the GameCube by any stretch, but it’s rare, so it fetches triple digit prices on ebay, so collectors on YouTube claim it’s one of the best games on the system.

This likely contributes to the strange feeling I see echoed across the internet that these retro collectors don’t play games. They treat them as investments or as displays of wealth, as if they enjoy finding these games rather than actually playing or appreciating them.


Modern Collectors
Digital distribution is a great idea in theory. All the problems that come with physical distribution are gone, while being more convenient for the end user. In practice physical media has a place, especially for those serious about the hobby. Digital services can censor games or pull them from the store completely, that’s assuming the service doesn’t shut down entirely. This is rarely a problem on PC since they’re open and thus games can be archived. This is much harder with consoles.

So physical versions are here to stay. Assuming you buy them within weeks or months of launch day.

“Limited print run” is one way to describe it. “Artificial scarcity” is another. I held off buying Senran Kagura 2 at the time of release, weeks later it had gone from budget price to full price. These days, the price is outrageous.
SenranKagura.png
Iirc the game's RRP was £19.99

In this age of “print on demand” products, where smaller and smaller print runs can be cost effective, why not do a second print run and cash in on the demand? I don’t know. I assume they make more money from scalpers somehow, but I struggle to think of a plausible way of doing that. Perhaps the goal is to create a day one rush and thus give the impression the product is popular, or they want to drive physical copy hold outs to digital where devs get a larger percentage.

The question I have is, who’s buying these? The motive for the scalpers is obvious. Retro collectors don’t want to go down the road of emulation for one reason or another. But weebs or those into niche oddities are tech savvy enough to pirate, buy digital, or even import.


Hardware
I can’t really say much about hardware since covid and me living in the UK might contribute to this more than the collectors or manufacturers. From flash drive carts to high end third party controllers for retro consoles, it seems hardware is announced, official pages will list it as “in stock”, but UK vendors go out of stock indefinitely shortly after release.
 

L50LasPak

We have all the time in the world.
kiwifarms.net
Might want to correct that remark about Dreamcast cases. I own a small Dreamcast collection and from what I can tell they're identical to regular CD jewel cases. I think you meant the Sega CD, Sega Saturn and early PS1 cases which were basically giant jewel cases. I have a few Sega Saturn games in them, and they're as miserable and fragile as you can imagine.


vol7vd087hz0cpppr1nx.jpg


Decided to add a picture of an empty one to give everyone a better idea:
limited-run-games-saturn-sega-cd-case.jpg

I've never dropped any of mine but I imagine they would instantly explode into a million shards if I ever did.
 
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Massively Strong Greed

Thanks for the money, dummy!
kiwifarms.net
We’re currently in peak GameCube nostalgia, so I’m kinda scared to see how high the prices of games like Skyward Sword or Fire Emblem Radiant Dawn will go in about 5 years.
 

Pissmaster

True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
A while ago I posted about trying to collect Wii games in another thread, so here's that post:

My personal rule of thumb on older games is that they start to really seriously go up in price when the people who grew up with them reach college age, and the Wii came out in 2006 so everyone who had one as a child is likely looking for their long lost games and hidden gems they missed. So I spent a number of years for a while trying to buy up whatever Wii games I'd think I'd ever want to play while the gettin' was good. I still managed to miss a number of them on my list due to:
  • never actually seeing them on shelves (Gunblade N.Y./L.A. Machineguns, Castle of Shikigami 3, Baroque)
  • prices never dropping (Pandora's Tower, Tatsunoko vs. Capcom, Metroid Prime Trilogy)
  • or just flat-out forgetting to look for them whenever I go out (Trauma Team, Monster Hunter Tri, Geometry Wars)
But I did get a lot of the games I wanted, some of them fairly rare ones, like No More Heroes 2 and Rhythm Heaven Fever. Of course, Wii bargain hunting also benefited greatly from the downfall of retail, so I grabbed a number of games from K-Mart and Sears while they were dying on some serious deep discounts. @Marissa Moira, I'll bet you did too.

But yeah, Wiis are pretty good for homebrew too but frankly the homebrew scene on them is all but dead, like there's an N64 emulator but it's been stagnant for ages now and isn't good for much more than playing Mario 64 (and you should just play the official Virtual Console version instead), and some of the more offbeat systems with emulators are fucky as hell, like some of them only work with wired Gamecube controllers and are unstable as all hell, which is really annoying when you start one and your Wii remote completely shuts off and you have to get up and hard shutdown your Wii. But if you have a classic controller and just wanna play NES, SNES, and Game Boy games, then you're good to go.

(i also bought Bully on Wii and was really excited about getting a good deal only to later find out that it's the worst version of the game, built from an earlier build than any other version and it's one of those games that shoehorned in motion controls where they weren't needed, with no option to use a classic controller)

edit: I also just now found out this exists and I want it:
View attachment 1590676

Though it seems like most of the Wii games that ever will get pricey are mostly there.

Something I've noticed is that there's a mix between rarity and quality that determines the price. Very common but beloved games like Super Mario Bros. 3 seem to be about as valuable as a semi-rare games nobody actually wants to play, like Fisher-Price: Firehouse Rescue, which are worth about the same - around $20, cart only. That only goes to a certain point, though, and rarity always trumps all. Even with cases like Stadium Events being, literally, World Class Track Meet with a different title screen. Stadium Events is well into four figures, while World Class Track Meet is like $2. And then on the Wii side, you've got stupid shit like American Mensa Academy and Fritz Chess being valuable entirely from speculation that their prices will soar, due to their low print numbers. There are also a smattering of Latin American-only releases en español, and those are probably gonna skyrocket too.

Speaking of which, it's kinda interesting how there really aren't many valuable PS2 games, despite the overwhelming popularity of the console. https://www.pricecharting.com/console/playstation-2 Though I'm surprised Def Jam: Fight for NY of all things goes for around $100. Can anyone fill me in on what's special about that game?

I've never dropped any of mine but I imagine they would intantly explode into a million shards if I ever did.
They do (:_(

Well, the hinge tabs fly off and they get cracked easily, even worse than jewel cases.
 

Billy_Sama

♂Love and Muscle in Heaven♂
kiwifarms.net
Might want to correct that remark about Dreamcast cases. I own a small Dreamcast collection and from what I can tell they're identical to regular CD jewel cases. I think you meant the Sega CD, Sega Saturn and early PS1 cases which were basically giant jewel cases. I have a few Sega Saturn games in them, and they're as miserable and fragile as you can imagine.


View attachment 1818511

Decided to add a picture of an empty one to give everyone a better idea:
View attachment 1818526
I've never dropped any of mine but I imagine they would intantly explode into a million shards if I ever did.

You can buy newly made Longbox Jewel cases now to replace the cracked and broken cases.

Also video game collecting changed past 10 years. I used to go to pawn shops, flea markets, and resale places and got a stack of games for $20 and now you need to play more for one game. I am thinking of cashing out but have trouble piecing them out.
 

L50LasPak

We have all the time in the world.
kiwifarms.net
Also video game collecting changed past 10 years. I used to go to pawn shops, flea markets, and resale places and got a stack of games for $20 and now you need to play more for one game. I am thinking of cashing out but have trouble piecing them out.
Any store I go to just looks up the average retail price for any games you bring in right in front of you now as if you're buying gold bullion or something. I did make a surprise $14 off a random Gamegear game I thought was worth a buck at most though, so I guess that ended up doing me a favor.

I feel you about cashing out. I have a Sega Saturn and some choice rare games that I never play, but since my collection is so small I feel the need to keep carrying them around with me for the novelty of being able to say "Hey, check it out, I've got Nights Into Dreams" when I have guests over. If I had something really pricey like Panzer Dragoon or something I'd be more tempted to sell, but right now having an extra $100ish in my pocket doesn't feel worth it for something I've held on to for so long.
 

whatever I feel like

Disney Diaper Size Fetish Enthusiast
kiwifarms.net
Also video game collecting changed past 10 years. I used to go to pawn shops, flea markets, and resale places and got a stack of games for $20 and now you need to play more for one game. I am thinking of cashing out but have trouble piecing them out.
Flippers ruined it. Killed all the fun in game hunting, the bastards.
 

Duncan Hills Coffee

Whaddya mean booze ain't food?!
kiwifarms.net
I like to buy retro games. Always have. Part of it is fascination with old stuff (this extends beyond video games; I love old tech in general like radios and televisions) and part of it is because most of the games I like just tend to be old. I don't do it for status or anything, which is what frustrates me about collectors who buy old stuff just to say, "Look! I have old stuff! Pay attention to me!" If I buy an old game, it's because I want to play it. If it's ultra rare and expensive, I don't bother. $100-300 is too much for any video game, no matter how great it is.

The last few years though have gotten really fucking bad though. It used to be that you could buy most SNES games in the ballpark of $20, but if it's valuable at all anymore you can expect that price to triple. PS1 games are getting ungodly expensive as well. The price for older games is getting hiked up because suddenly everyone wants these old games and it's getting annoying for people like me who are actually interested in playing them and not getting them as a status item.
 

Pissmaster

True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
Also, place your bets as to how much Super Mario 3D All-Stars will be worth in April.
It'll have a strong bump up to around $80 from panic buyers, but then peter back down to $40-$50 and stay there after they realize just how many copies were made

I like to buy retro games. Always have. Part of it is fascination with old stuff (this extends beyond video games; I love old tech in general like radios and televisions) and part of it is because most of the games I like just tend to be old. I don't do it for status or anything, which is what frustrates me about collectors who buy old stuff just to say, "Look! I have old stuff! Pay attention to me!" If I buy an old game, it's because I want to play it. If it's ultra rare and expensive, I don't bother. $100-300 is too much for any video game, no matter how great it is.

The last few years though have gotten really fucking bad though. It used to be that you could buy most SNES games in the ballpark of $20, but if it's valuable at all anymore you can expect that price to triple. PS1 games are getting ungodly expensive as well. The price for older games is getting hiked up because suddenly everyone wants these old games and it's getting annoying for people like me who are actually interested in playing them and not getting them as a status item.
Yeah, prices really exploded at the beginning of the Coronavirus, but have dropped somewhat since. I'd imagine whenever Coronavirus ends, there might be a big selloff.
 

Marissa Moira

kiwifarms.net
Might want to correct that remark about Dreamcast cases. I own a small Dreamcast collection and from what I can tell they're identical to regular CD jewel cases. I think you meant the Sega CD, Sega Saturn and early PS1 cases which were basically giant jewel cases. I have a few Sega Saturn games in them, and they're as miserable and fragile as you can imagine.


View attachment 1818511

Decided to add a picture of an empty one to give everyone a better idea:
View attachment 1818526
I've never dropped any of mine but I imagine they would instantly explode into a million shards if I ever did.
Limited Run games remade official Saturn cases and they're made with much stronger plastic.
 

Billy_Sama

♂Love and Muscle in Heaven♂
kiwifarms.net
Flippers ruined it. Killed all the fun in game hunting, the bastards.
That and fakes are flooding the market and everywhere. However I do like newly released games though and might keep me interested in my Genesis collection.

But them Everdrives are really getting better with save states and game genie support, give it some time and you can get a cartridge with all the fixings of emulator features.
 

Dark Edea

kiwifarms.net
Nintendo collection and the scene around it has always fascinated me. Good thread.

So here's the weird thing. There may not be many like me. I was the kid that listened to his parents when they told me to take care of my baseball cards. And when I was a teenager around the time Nintendo started saving the fucking games industry, I was buying their hardware/software with my allowance and keeping it in decent condition. We're talking boxes, some shrinkwraps (but if you're going to buy an item, why not use it?), and otherwise no smoking and good condition all around.

As I've gotten older, gotten decent jobs, and had some time to spare on weekends when not dealing with real life (so scary), I've contributed to disparate wikis and forums and topics like this. There's a lot of "rare" games out there; but maybe not so many that you need to dedicate your adolescent fortune to buying them when you could be doing better things. Which brings me to a question of the "collectibility" of modern games and even stuff from ten or fifteen years ago.

Did the digital market really change things so much as to destroy the "retro collectible" market? I know stuff like OG Panzer Dragoon are pretty desirable; but what makes that so different from a gold Punch-Out cart other than sheer age? How is a lot of this value determined? I know in my collectible endeavors I have a very hard and fast line around the early 90s; basically after the SNES fell from "in vogue" status and became undesirable. And despite the N64 still being cartridge-based, those games are not nearly as collectible as earlier games or even some later, limited productions.

Especially in the last... maybe five to eight years, the market has changed substantially. I see "valuable" games on the marketplace that don't really seem collectible in the same way as many of my original games or convention-finds have been. Something about being able to go to eBay and just buy stuff has taken the fun/value/whatever out of the entire process. It's very transactional and much much less personal.

For example: I had to fight to find a new stand for my Virtual Boy console. That system exhibits a design flaw in which the tripod stand can crack at its weakest point (the plastic union between the legs); and many of the sellers at conventions knew this. Nowadays I am unsure if the fight to find what you want is the same. But then what is the real fight? Is it the process of going out of your home, traveling and finding a seller? Or is it as simple as clicking "buy now" and getting what you desire without haggling or any skin in the game, so to speak?

I am convinced that collecting in terms of video games (and maybe a few others like card games and figurines) has changed significantly in the last decade and not for the better. And I question the commitment some of these buyers have to the hobby they claim to love. Where there used to be an ownership of the product (consoooooom) and a desire to preserve the artifact, there is now increased competition (not that it didn't exist before) and a simple display of wealth that diminishes the whole thing.

This is very autistic. Please rate me on merits other than autism; I already have a doctor's note. :lit:

That and fakes are flooding the market and everywhere. However I do like newly released games though and might keep me interested in my Genesis collection.
Sidenote on this: this is a thriving market for Famicom fakes and multicarts. I am sure this is the same for other older systems. Multicarts are fucking rad and unique.
 

Duncan Hills Coffee

Whaddya mean booze ain't food?!
kiwifarms.net
That and fakes are flooding the market and everywhere
I remember a couple years back I checked eBay to see the status of EarthBound. It's mostly out of curiosity; like I said, I'm not paying $300 for a SNES game, but I'm always curious if I'll ever see one below $100, especially in this day and age where EarthBound's at least somewhat more available. To my surprise, I found several, but they were all from China and the descriptions were in broken English. It wasn't even subtle that these weren't the real deal. It's disturbing to me that if you want to buy this old cult game, you not only have to deal with outrageous prices from sellers but now also the possibility that you're getting a fake.
 

L50LasPak

We have all the time in the world.
kiwifarms.net
This is very autistic. Please rate me on merits other than autism; I already have a doctor's note.
I dunno, its hard to argue with what you're saying. I got into collecting retro games when I was 16, about 10 years ago, when stuff like AVGN was just hitting the normie audience and game collecting was becoming the hip new thing. In the couple of years it took me to get out of high school i already thought the price of retro stuff was getting expensive. I stopped collecting around 2013 but I still kept track of the market since I'd get stuff as gifts for people.

These days the market is insanely expensive and I seriously wonder where people get all the money for this stuff. I'm also wondering if this is going to end up being some kind of passing fad, that maybe once my generation ages out of having disposable income the luster of retro games will wear off from the zoomers and whatever generation will come after them. We're already starting to see that happen with the retro computer market to some extent, its not hard to believe that consoles may go the same way.
 

Dysnomia

Is Reimu gonna have to smack a bitch?
kiwifarms.net
Might want to correct that remark about Dreamcast cases. I own a small Dreamcast collection and from what I can tell they're identical to regular CD jewel cases. I think you meant the Sega CD, Sega Saturn and early PS1 cases which were basically giant jewel cases. I have a few Sega Saturn games in them, and they're as miserable and fragile as you can imagine.


View attachment 1818511

Decided to add a picture of an empty one to give everyone a better idea:
View attachment 1818526
I've never dropped any of mine but I imagine they would instantly explode into a million shards if I ever did.

They are super brittle. Especially as they age. Time is not kind to the plastic even if you are. I still have a copy of Vay for Sega CD and while the case was cracked a bit when it was given to me it's even worse now despite me being careful. That might have to do with it originally being kid owned. The case was already cracked in half. It was a goodbye present from a kid who lived next store and was moving away. And that was probably 25ish years ago.

Honestly, if you still play those games I would just display the original cases and put the discs in something else. I found the jewel cases easier because they are smaller. The big cases are just so clunky and the hinges are trash.

Anyway, half my game collection was stolen so my sister and her boyfriend could get high. Some of those games were gifts from people I will likely never see again. Some of the games had special memories tied to buying them. I'm just gonna emulate the PS1 stuff and buy back a few things I really want over time. But I am never going to rebuild the collection.

What's funny though is discarded in an empty bin that formerly held PS1 games were Phantasy Star Online Episodes 1&2 for Gamecube and .hack/Quarantine for PS1. They also didn't find my pristine copy of Tail Concerto. Maybe God doesn't hate me so much after all. :lol:
 

Marissa Moira

kiwifarms.net
Have fun with your worthless reproduction cases. :evil:
They are branded and sanctioned by Sega itself.

They also got shit in like official sega transparent pink and turquoise Saturn controllers.

So of course I did the sane thing and bought one of each so I could attach it to a white Sega Saturn.

Not only that but when was the last time was anything made in transparent pink? Especially when it comes to electronics, that shit is a rare event in itself.
 
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