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I think Punisher is a pretty cool guy. Eh fights the criminal underworld and doesnt afraid of rule of law.
Haven't seen it, but if it's as badass as you say, then I'll have to watch it.
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Its very military/veteran heavy show and really speaks more to the damage that war does to people, as well as the trauma it brings. It explicitly shows why 'The Punisher' does what he does in the best way possible. Its not like 'Death Wish' or anything.
If you are expecting any heavy links to the MCU, it doesn't have them. Which is expected, since the other shows barely reference them or have them involved in their plots. Its just more amplified and noticeable since the Punisher doesn't involve any superheroes, superpowers or really even sci-fi. If you read the Ennis comics, that's the style of the show (with the humor typically removed). Its basically very disconnected from Superheroes and more to the nature of the Punisher, war and what it does to those that fight them.
If you are expecting any heavy links to the MCU, it doesn't have them. Which is expected, since the other shows barely reference them or have them involved in their plots. Its just more amplified and noticeable since the Punisher doesn't involve any superheroes, superpowers or really even sci-fi. If you read the Ennis comics, that's the style of the show (with the humor typically removed). Its basically very disconnected from Superheroes and more to the nature of the Punisher, war and what it does to those that fight them.
He was great as Shane in The Walking Dead. And subsequent events showed that that crazy motherfucker was more right than wrong.
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If Shane had been as competent as Frank Castle, All Out War would actually be worth watching.
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I saw that they fucked up his origin but tries to stay optimistic.
I saw the middling reviews and tries to stay optimistic.
I gave it one more episode than I should have (for a total of four) and that was all I could take.
It's just way too fucking boring. It's like they were afraid of making an adaptation of "big guy shoots criminals in the face" the comic so they tried to dilute it as much as possible and turn it into a spy thriller. Which could have worked, had the plot been good, or if the characters were interesting, but the plot has minimal amounts of mystery or intrigue and all the characters are super bland.
I mean I watched less than half of it, but those 4 epusides already felt full of filler (for example: 90% of the annoying NSA chick's screentime) and from what I've heard it does not get better.
I saw the middling reviews and tries to stay optimistic.
I gave it one more episode than I should have (for a total of four) and that was all I could take.
It's just way too fucking boring. It's like they were afraid of making an adaptation of "big guy shoots criminals in the face" the comic so they tried to dilute it as much as possible and turn it into a spy thriller. Which could have worked, had the plot been good, or if the characters were interesting, but the plot has minimal amounts of mystery or intrigue and all the characters are super bland.
I mean I watched less than half of it, but those 4 epusides already felt full of filler (for example: 90% of the annoying NSA chick's screentime) and from what I've heard it does not get better.
The first episode felt really slow (I know they were building the tension, but they already showed him killing people in the opening, so it wasn't 'shocking') but the action at the end was great and had some real weight to it.
My dad's a veteran and I watch a lot of these shows with him, but he didn't have much to say based off the first episode other than that the action was good.
My dad's a veteran and I watch a lot of these shows with him, but he didn't have much to say based off the first episode other than that the action was good.
Watched all of it and can say it was good.
Was tempted to leave it after the first 4 episodes due to the pacing, but the different takes on soldiers with PTSD and how society tends to ignore at best or manipulate them at worst kept me watching.
Hopefully the writers considered his appearance in Daredevil as his first season, since this would take care of the sequel/season 2 aspect of most media, where the second installment is always a darker narrative where the protagonist is deconstructed and forced to overcome unfair odds. I hope this is the case so a second season of the Punisher can focus on more action.
Was tempted to leave it after the first 4 episodes due to the pacing, but the different takes on soldiers with PTSD and how society tends to ignore at best or manipulate them at worst kept me watching.
Hopefully the writers considered his appearance in Daredevil as his first season, since this would take care of the sequel/season 2 aspect of most media, where the second installment is always a darker narrative where the protagonist is deconstructed and forced to overcome unfair odds. I hope this is the case so a second season of the Punisher can focus on more action.
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The problem is with Disney starting its own Streaming, the whole thing is up in the air. Fucking 'Iron Fist' is getting a second season, and 'The Punisher' is superior to that show in every way. So I hope its getting another season on it. And Berenthal is really an amazing actor. He can sound hard while you know he cares. Lots of emotional range.
Also I thought I would totally hate Micro but he's really really good. Even if it doesn't get a second season, the series is left in a good place so you could see where it could go if they do it again, but it also works if it doesn't get another season (which fuck everything, because I want a second season).
Also I thought I would totally hate Micro but he's really really good. Even if it doesn't get a second season, the series is left in a good place so you could see where it could go if they do it again, but it also works if it doesn't get another season (which fuck everything, because I want a second season).
The Punisher's warcry/war face combo is goddamn terrifying.
I am loving the slow burn of this show actually. You can do a slower pacing right, Hannibal on NBC was rather okay at being mildly paced.
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Just finished it, overall it was damn mear flawless for the story it was telling. I almost hope they don’t revisit him because that ending is perfect. Marvel Netflix seasons haven’t made such good use of their runtime since Daredevil season one. Solid narrative with a beginning, middle, and end, no stupid worldbuilding shit got in the way, the acting was superb, the action was great, and it had lots of heart. I could recommend this to anyone whether they’re a Marvel fan or not.
Billy Russo getting his face mirrored suggests there will be be a sequel at some point
I hope it gets a 2nd season too, the middle & end thirds of the season were OUTSTANDING!
I think what we're looking at is either the show stays @ Netflix, or it moves to Disney (No way Marvel didn't cover their backs after the disaster that was the Fox/Sony deals, plus, the Punisher wasn't part of the original Netflix Defenders deal, so it's very possible that it's on its own separate terms), both of which are fine by me.
Honestly, I can't even pretend to be objective about this one. I don't usually fanboy about shit but I just fucking love the Punisher. Grew up with the comics, have been hoping for a proper treatment of the story for years, and I went into this really hoping that this was the one where we'd get a real Punisher, as opposed to the milquetoast adaptation that we usually get in film/shows/video games/ect.
That bias having been admitted, I actually really dig the Netflix series because it understands a few very important things that any Punisher fan will demand. I now will go full fucking autist and explain the things that longtime fans demand, and why it did it right:
-Frank Castle is, intrinsically, a violent, broken, bitter, sadistic, hateful sociopath with very few redeeming qualities. He is not a hero, or even a particularly good person, and his absolute unflinching adherence to his personal code of "no mercy, no shades of gray" means that attempting to portray him as a traditional hero (as opposed to more of a tragic antihero or even a sympathetic villain) is doomed to fail from the word "go".
-The Punisher series is uncharacteristically dark and fatalistic for a Marvel property. Frank does not have a happy ending. He already lost everything he gives a shit about, and he exists now only to spread his suffering to people who he feels deserve it. Any plot that focuses on him getting better is going to suck, because he doesn't want to get better. He wants to get even, and he will never truly achieve that.
-Crossovers with other Marvel properties are risky. As stated earlier, Frank is fucking grim compared to Marvel's usual lineup of "Hey gang, let's go and stop these nasty crooks for America!" song and dance. He's done some great crossover work, but usually that is done where Frank acts as an antagonist or foil to the others, not a comrade or hero. The choice not to focus on connections to the other shows was a wise decision. He doesn't play well with others.
-Over the years, both the iconography and the character of the Punisher have resonated strongly with military servicemen and police, to the point that if you know 3 men who've served, you know a guy who owns a Punisher tee. Know your audience and use that to explore issues that are important to them. The show's dealings with life after service, PTSD, survivor's guilt, and the alienation they face in civilian society is a good example of this.
-Resist the urge to fall into traditional superhero story tropes. The Punisher is poorly suited to the old "crisis of ethics/dark side" storyline, he abandoned the ability to give a shit long ago. The "female will they/won't they love interest" is also something you need to back off from, the only people he ever loved are dead, and the entire character hinges on his refusal to move on or change.
-Above all, remember that the key theme of the series is not justice but stagnancy. Frank is unable to move on, unwilling to change, and married to his grief and his instincts as a killer. He does not grow, resolve, move on, or accept, and no amount of victory or dead criminals will every change that fact. The violent, broken man he is at the beginning will always be more or less who he is at the end, and that's the point, because the whole goal of the best Punisher stories are to depict an examination of loss and grief and the importance of how we choose to process it.
Every point listed above was hit with the show. It may or may not have broad appeal, but as a diehard fan?
It manages to do what 3 movies and a fistfull of other media adaptations have failed to do by giving us a real, honest to God Punisher story, and I think that's worth applauding.
That bias having been admitted, I actually really dig the Netflix series because it understands a few very important things that any Punisher fan will demand. I now will go full fucking autist and explain the things that longtime fans demand, and why it did it right:
-Frank Castle is, intrinsically, a violent, broken, bitter, sadistic, hateful sociopath with very few redeeming qualities. He is not a hero, or even a particularly good person, and his absolute unflinching adherence to his personal code of "no mercy, no shades of gray" means that attempting to portray him as a traditional hero (as opposed to more of a tragic antihero or even a sympathetic villain) is doomed to fail from the word "go".
-The Punisher series is uncharacteristically dark and fatalistic for a Marvel property. Frank does not have a happy ending. He already lost everything he gives a shit about, and he exists now only to spread his suffering to people who he feels deserve it. Any plot that focuses on him getting better is going to suck, because he doesn't want to get better. He wants to get even, and he will never truly achieve that.
-Crossovers with other Marvel properties are risky. As stated earlier, Frank is fucking grim compared to Marvel's usual lineup of "Hey gang, let's go and stop these nasty crooks for America!" song and dance. He's done some great crossover work, but usually that is done where Frank acts as an antagonist or foil to the others, not a comrade or hero. The choice not to focus on connections to the other shows was a wise decision. He doesn't play well with others.
-Over the years, both the iconography and the character of the Punisher have resonated strongly with military servicemen and police, to the point that if you know 3 men who've served, you know a guy who owns a Punisher tee. Know your audience and use that to explore issues that are important to them. The show's dealings with life after service, PTSD, survivor's guilt, and the alienation they face in civilian society is a good example of this.
-Resist the urge to fall into traditional superhero story tropes. The Punisher is poorly suited to the old "crisis of ethics/dark side" storyline, he abandoned the ability to give a shit long ago. The "female will they/won't they love interest" is also something you need to back off from, the only people he ever loved are dead, and the entire character hinges on his refusal to move on or change.
-Above all, remember that the key theme of the series is not justice but stagnancy. Frank is unable to move on, unwilling to change, and married to his grief and his instincts as a killer. He does not grow, resolve, move on, or accept, and no amount of victory or dead criminals will every change that fact. The violent, broken man he is at the beginning will always be more or less who he is at the end, and that's the point, because the whole goal of the best Punisher stories are to depict an examination of loss and grief and the importance of how we choose to process it.
Every point listed above was hit with the show. It may or may not have broad appeal, but as a diehard fan?
It manages to do what 3 movies and a fistfull of other media adaptations have failed to do by giving us a real, honest to God Punisher story, and I think that's worth applauding.
With how great the actor they chose for Russo was, we are owed a fucking Jigsaw arc in season 2 or 3.
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I've only been able to complete the first 5 episodes and it is damn good!
They managed the impossible and made Micro Chip into a solid character.
They managed the impossible and made Micro Chip into a solid character.
I remember watching Season 2 of Daredevil and realizing I just didn't care about anything when the Punisher wasn't on screen. When Marvel announced he was getting his own show I flipped my shit and realized I no longer had to care about the rest of that boring Defenders crap.
And boy was I not disappointed. This was badass and was exactly the kind of treatment Frank Castle deserved as a character. Jon Bernthal is probably the most solid superhero franchise casting since Heath Ledger. It's like the guy was chiseled out of a slab of granite specifically for this role.
And boy was I not disappointed. This was badass and was exactly the kind of treatment Frank Castle deserved as a character. Jon Bernthal is probably the most solid superhero franchise casting since Heath Ledger. It's like the guy was chiseled out of a slab of granite specifically for this role.
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