The Shin Megami Tensei/Persona Thread -

the autist of dojima

Me? Im already half shitpost
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Whats the best way to get into MegaTen as a whole?
Tried getting into 4 a while ago but the fact that the 3DS' L and R buttons were the camera controls kinda killed it for me, heard nocturne is a good jumping on point as well as the SRPGS they put out (majin tensei and Devil survivor respectively). just don't want to wait for SMT5 to come out in 2050 to really sick my teeth into it
Nocturne if you want to get the 3d smt experience
Digital devil saga if you want persona combat but actually not braindead
Strange journey/soul hackers if you want to get into the old smt games
Apart from that if you ever get tired of the formula go IV/apocalypse (be warned, though the story in apocalypse is dog shit) or the raidou series
DeSu is just smt fire emblem and apart from that go wild
 

HeyYou

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I mean, as a quick though experiment, let’s replace Ryuji with a high-school age female, who is being hit on and subjected to the same forward attitudes by these older men. Your character can abandon her to presumably be assaulted by them. Doesn’t that whole premise just make you cringe? It’s unfortunate that this situation as written is the only homosexual representation in the game, but even without the homosexual element the whole sequence is in very poor taste. Atlas is right to recognize that whatever joke they were going for fell flat, and it’ll be interesting to see how they adjust it.
Isn't that the point of the scene, or am I mixing two scenes up? The gay dudes hit on them, they go back to the girls, and see dudes doing the same thing to them. They realize the whole babe hunt thing is really gross and apologize to the girls.

They really don't, Resetera is like that mentally disabled kid you have to talk down from having an outburst, a VA said the same shit for catherine full body and it was barely touched up.
Hell, them having to dox someone to even get their way kinda speaks to their ineffectiveness.
and considering how dumb their ways to """Improve""" persona are I doubt they will get much
Eh, that imgur album has a lot of good suggestions outside of the usual suspect ones. I don't know what they're talking about when it comes to P3P integrating romance though, the only thing it did differently was have flags that you had to meet or the romance would default to friendship, Shinji potentially surviving (which barely matters) and choosing which character speaks to you when you die, which can only be done on New Game+ anyways. Persona 5 does it much better, you choose romance or not. Also, their protagonist having a personality idea would heavily conflict with the ability to choose your gender. Do one or the other, in my opinion.
 
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the autist of dojima

Me? Im already half shitpost
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Isn't that the point of the scene, or am I mixing two scenes up? The gay dudes hit on them, they go back to the girls, and see dudes doing the same thing to them. They realize the whole babe hunt thing is really gross and apologize to the girls.


Eh, that imgur album has a lot of good suggestions outside of the usual suspect ones. I don't know what they're talking about when it comes to P3P integrating romance though, the only thing it did differently was have flags that you had to meet or the romance would default to friendship, Shinji potentially surviving (which barely matters) and choosing which character speaks to you when you die, which can only be done on New Game+ anyways. Persona 5 does it much better, you choose romance or not. Also, their protagonist having a personality idea would heavily conflict with the ability to choose your gender. Do one or the other, in my opinion.
Lol no
Most of the suggestions are either we want smt/persona 1 and 2 but withough the elements that make that serie and duology good
Also lol at them thinking p-studio is able to make party members social links good when ever since p3 the series has been plagued by their most exceptional system : the calendar system
 

UnclePhil

Becoming my parents. Get off my lawn.
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Isn't that the point of the scene, or am I mixing two scenes up? The gay dudes hit on them, they go back to the girls, and see dudes doing the same thing to them. They realize the whole babe hunt thing is really gross and apologize to the girls.
Yes, that's the context and the punchline of the joke. And Atlas USA has chosen to localize the game for people who never understand context and don't like jokes.
 

rotollo

Just some asshole
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Eh, that imgur album has a lot of good suggestions outside of the usual suspect ones. I don't know what they're talking about when it comes to P3P integrating romance though, the only thing it did differently was have flags that you had to meet or the romance would default to friendship, Shinji potentially surviving (which barely matters) and choosing which character speaks to you when you die, which can only be done on New Game+ anyways. Persona 5 does it much better, you choose romance or not. Also, their protagonist having a personality idea would heavily conflict with the ability to choose your gender. Do one or the other, in my opinion.
a lot of the fusion ones come off as "I really don't like or understand the velvet room, please let me be able to use palace personas for maximum benefit", except inheritance but I think that's meant to be more of a risk of strengthening personas then a legitimate design flaw. Its to encourage you to fuze shit rather then just rely on the same ones you have used already.
I don't get why they need personas to be more "characterized" or whatever when aside from the party member's personas most of them are fusion fotter
And considering how they want a "college setting" they really don't get why japan wouldn't find that apealing to, say the high school settings of most of the other game. hell a better idea for a set up was the whole "backpacking" idea P studio had for 5 before the tsunami made them focus more inward on Japanese culture at the time.
The lists main problem though is the fact it's more vague then anything else, it sometimes throws points out there without elaborating on it or only on very specific issues that stem from it
 
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Tanner Glass

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Persona 3 is not in an entirely different canon. It's been stated several times now that the series is in one canon, and 3 went off of EP's world reset. Mitsuru, for instance, states that the Kirijo group split off from the Nanjo group. Unless you're referring to the fact that the series is functionally split into 1/IS/EP and 3/4/5, which is true.
Maybe I should have said "a very fuzzy canon adjustment" instead of an entirely new canon, but Persona 3 changes a lot of the fundamental rules of the series. Just from the top of my head.

- Adults are not able to use/control personas in Persona 3/4/5, despite Persona 1/2 having villians and party members using them without issue.
- "Normal" persona users are not able to change personas at will in Persona 3/4/5, despite the Persona 1/2 party being able to do so.
- "Special" persona users are able to use all personas, marking them with the "Fool" arcana - indiciating they've started a magical journey.
- Normal people are able to see (but not enter) the Velvet Room, which in Persona 1/2 are located in malls like regular stores. Persona 3/4/5 changes this to a magical space only very specific people can even see.
- The Velvet Rooms in Persona 1/2 have a wider variety of employees (pianist, singer, painter) and they aren't (possibly) powerful otherworldly beings unlike the P3/4/5 cast (Elizabeth and company).
- Persona 1/2 have a much closer tie to SMT via the enemies being classed as literal Demons (that can be negotiated with). Persona 3/4/5 they aren't "real" demons, but manifestations of peoples desires/conciousness/etc.

Even though it's one canon (and Persona 3 does reference characters from Persona 1 and 2) - the games are very different on nearly all levels; gameplay wise, huge changes to the narrative, changes to all of the themes and world building.

Persona 1 and 2 feel very much like SMT games, where as Persona 3 forward feel much more like their own thing (with a few homages along the way).
 

the autist of dojima

Me? Im already half shitpost
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a lot of the fusion ones come off as "I really don't like or understand the velvet room, please let me be able to use palace personas for maximum benefit", except inheritance but I think that's meant to be more of a risk of strengthening personas then a legitimate design flaw. Its to encourage you to fuze shit rather then just rely on the same ones you have used already.
I don't get why they need personas to be more "characterized" or whatever when aside from the party member's personas most of them are fusion fotter
And considering how they want a "college setting" they really don't get why japan wouldn't find that apealing to, say the high school settings of most of the other game. hell a better idea for a set up was the whole "backpacking" idea P studio had for 5 before the tsunami made them focus more inward on Japanese culture at the time.
The lists main problem though is the fact it's more vague then anything else, it sometimes throws points out there without elaborating on it or only on very specific issues that stem from it
Hell, nu persona lost their chance to characterize the personas the moment they threw demons out of the window (even though p1 and 2 stablished that they arent the same thing and demons suck at fighting personas, thats why the if... protagonist and the kuzunoha clan dont get involved in those games) because by making them lol not real you destroy any chance of them having any personality because they arent creatures, they are just subconcious manifestationsa of an idea
 
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Hans

"We're having a SALE!"
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Is the 3ds port of strange journey good? I know people thought it was wasted potential but its pretty cheap and the original is a classic.
 

the autist of dojima

Me? Im already half shitpost
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Is the 3ds port of strange journey good? I know people thought it was wasted potential but its pretty cheap and the original is a classic.
It makes it more tolerable in certain parts, the space yukiko shit is mediocre but not bad (looking at you fes and golden) and the new endings are good instead of a neutral wankfest
So yeah, its good if you arent bothered by the jap dub
 
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Arm_of_the_Lord

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Is the 3ds port of strange journey good? I know people thought it was wasted potential but its pretty cheap and the original is a classic.
The gameplay improvements are very solid and make dungeon crawling much more fun but story additions are Apocalypse-tier garbage that spits on the game's themes(you can mostly ignore these changes thankfully). Some folks also dislike the redrawn character art but it's a minor thing imo. Overall I'd say it's very much worth playing.
 

HeyYou

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Maybe I should have said "a very fuzzy canon adjustment" instead of an entirely new canon, but Persona 3 changes a lot of the fundamental rules of the series. Just from the top of my head.
I think you're misremembering the games and/or using Trinity Soul as evidence, when it's firmly non-canon now. Adults can use Personas just fine. For instance, Mitsuru and Akihiko are firmly out of college in the Arena games and I don't recall them ever mentioning having issues using their Personas. And, then, spoiler, the adult villain in Royal can use a Persona, and iirc it's implied it awoke during his adulthood, too. You might be thinking of the concept of artificially awakened personas introduced in 3, but even that was given a brief mention in Eternal Punishment. Otherwise, as far as I know, the fact that people can't openly use a bunch of personas anymore is hand waved as Philemon still being weak after the events of 2. It's certainly an excuse for the gameplay style of 3/4/5, but it is mentioned. Also, even in 3/4/5 I don't think you have to be a Fool to be a wild card. Akechi is a wild card, and he is firmly the Justice arcana. Igor is stated to be a servant of Philemon in 1 and 2, so he definitely is an otherworldly being in those games. Otherwise, you're right, it is a soft reboot fucntionally.
 
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Tanner Glass

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I think you're misremembering the games and/or using Trinity Soul as evidence, when it's firmly non-canon now. Adults can use Personas just fine. For instance, Mitsuru and Akihiko are firmly out of college in the Arena games and I don't recall them ever mentioning having issues using their Personas. And, then, spoiler, the adult villain in Royal can use a Persona, and iirc it's implied it awoke during his adulthood, too. You might be thinking of the concept of artificially awakened personas introduced in 3, but even that was given a brief mention in Eternal Punishment. Otherwise, as far as I know, the fact that people can't openly use a bunch of personas anymore is hand waved as Philemon still being weak after the events of 2. It's certainly an excuse for the gameplay style of 3/4/5, but it is mentioned. Also, even in 3/4/5 I don't think you have to be a Fool to be a wild card. Akechi is a wild card, and he is firmly the Justice arcana. Igor is stated to be a servant of Philemon in 1 and 2, so he definitely is an otherworldly being in those games. Otherwise, you're right, it is a soft reboot fucntionally.
I can't speak for P4Royal, but how is Trinity Soul non-canon? I thought a big deal in Persona 4 A/AU was Akihiko expressly stating that he's going to leave the "team" and join the "real" police force meaning that Trinity Soul could still happen.

Akechi is a weird case (as is Adachi) but I'm not 100% certain he's strictly justice. When Adachi is revealed as the villian in P4, his arcana changes. Akechi probably is given the Justice tarot as a cover and ironically. Additionally, Aigis is able to switch arcana to Fool during the Persona 3 expansion.

Akechi and Adachi also aren't 100% shown to be "wild cards" because they aren't shown to use multiple personas. Specifically, It isn't stated if Akechi's RobinHood isn't just Loki in disguise. There is also the problem of them both having literal divine intervention to awaken thier powers.
 

Gravityqueen4life

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i always took Akechi not using more personas beacuse he didint bother forming bonds and taking advances of the wild card. as for Adachi, Izanami only gave them different versions of Izanagi but since yu is the recarnation of Izanagi, he also gets the wild card.
 
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HeyYou

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I can't speak for P4Royal, but how is Trinity Soul non-canon? I thought a big deal in Persona 4 A/AU was Akihiko expressly stating that he's going to leave the "team" and join the "real" police force meaning that Trinity Soul could still happen.
The Persona 3 Portable fanbook confirmed that it is non-canon. Or as they charitably put it, it takes place in an alternate universe. Akihiko only gets stronger when it comes to Persona use in Arena, he confirms that he can now summon one without an evoker.

Akechi is a weird case (as is Adachi) but I'm not 100% certain he's strictly justice. When Adachi is revealed as the villian in P4, his arcana changes. Akechi probably is given the Justice tarot as a cover and ironically. Additionally, Aigis is able to switch arcana to Fool during the Persona 3 expansion.
Adachi was always the Hunger arcana. Social links arcanas don't have to be the actual person's arcana, as evidence in P3P. But, in fact, he went from the Fool-analogue to the Strength-analogue, so that only adds to my point about Wild Cards not needing to be Fools. We're given no evidence that Akechi is not truly the Justice arcana, as Loki and his third tier persona (which is created after he fuses Robin Hood and Loki together) are both Justice, and statistical info is usually considered to be accurate. Aigis and Elizabeth only switch to the Fool because they have their own metaphysical journey to go through, and because they were inspired by the protagonist. I don't even know if you need to be the Fool to go through the journey. We're not told if Sho Minazuki changed arcana, for example.

Akechi and Adachi also aren't 100% shown to be "wild cards" because they aren't shown to use multiple personas. Specifically, It isn't stated if Akechi's RobinHood isn't just Loki in disguise. There is also the problem of them both having literal divine intervention to awaken thier powers.
Persona 5 explicitly confirms that Akechi has the same power as the protagonist. He can't summon a bunch of Personas because he's created absolutely no bonds and refuses to trust anyone. I can't blame you for forgetting this, because in the base game Akechi completely disappears from the story after his "death" and him being a wild card is only talked about in a couple lines. As to your point about Robin Hood being a mask for Loki, in Royal he summons both and fuses them into his third tier Persona in a scene very much resembling Velvet Room fusion. They're definitely separate Personas. Also, "divine" intervention has always been a method to awaken Personas. Philemon grants the Persona 1 cast the ability to use Personas. He does in Eternal Punishment as well.
 
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Severus Snope

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Nocturne if you want to get the 3d smt experience
Digital devil saga if you want persona combat but actually not braindead
Strange journey/soul hackers if you want to get into the old smt games
Apart from that if you ever get tired of the formula go IV/apocalypse (be warned, though the story in apocalypse is dog shit) or the raidou series
DeSu is just smt fire emblem and apart from that go wild
Which one do you prefer and why? the original strange journey on ds or redux on 3ds?
 
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Severus Snope

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Whats the best way to get into MegaTen as a whole?
Tried getting into 4 a while ago but the fact that the 3DS' L and R buttons were the camera controls kinda killed it for me, heard nocturne is a good jumping on point as well as the SRPGS they put out (majin tensei and Devil survivor respectively). just don't want to wait for SMT5 to come out in 2050 to really sick my teeth into it
If you want featuring of Dante from the Devil May Cry series go for Nocturne
 

the autist of dojima

Me? Im already half shitpost
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Which one do you prefer and why? the original strange journey on ds or redux on 3ds?
Redux is the "superior" version but due to the stupid alex plot it loses some points in my book
But it makes the dungeon crawling more tolerable in a certain sector that i refuse to even remember its name and adds more demons so if its your first time playing go redux
 
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