Tolkien was racist. Portrayed orcs, trolls and goblins as intrinsically evil - Liking Tolkien harms society. Also co-opted to REE at Trump.

c-no

Duck
True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
To think the corpse of Tolkien being racist would be brought again to be beaten, all while not realizing shit like brown skinned orcs is more of a movie thing. Another clickbait rag is all it is.
This strongly reminds me of the controversy over Goblin Slayer. Like the orcs in LotR, goblins are portrayed as an intrinsically evil, vile species. Some people have unironically said that it’s “fascist” to have an evil species because it promotes genocide or something (I mean, to be fair, I wholeheartedly support genocide against gobs because fuck them).
If one wondered what people meant by "being tired of politics" they would mean this sort of thing. Yeah having a race portrayed as intrinsically evil would be a terrible writing device or trope but then again, Goblin Slayer is nothing more than just Berserk if it focused on the trolls being rapey little green men instead of mole-like monsters. People need to learn to chill and not throw their own opinion on something that isn't even related to an ideology.
 
Last edited:
Fantasy races are not an effective stand in for real life racism. It just doesn't work, orcs are a different species, it's like saying humans are racist against alligators because they're afraid of getting bitten. It just doesn't make sense.

In LOTR (God I'm a nerd) the orcs were created by what is essentially fantasy satan and his helper. Not just that, they created them from an existing race (elves(What a nerd)).

There's no way for this to be problematic, because it doesn't translate to any real life people. If there were people in real life that were known to have been created by the embodiment of evil, we'd be correct to be racist against them.

On top of this, Tolkien himself didn't like the idea of a group unable to be good, even if created by evil itself, because of his own religious beliefs, so he was sort of trying to find a way around the idea.

There were a couple things in LOTR that were kinda sorta old-timey racist, like seemingly all the black humans decided to join up with Sauron, and the poor hobbits talked an awful lot like a minstrel show black person. But that's minor stuff, I mean one of the main themes was that all the people had to come together to defeat evil, and their internal conflicts were as big a problem as the actual bad guys.
 

I Love Beef

Wandering Vagabond the 2nd. In memory
kiwifarms.net
Oh, this is fucking gold.

I'm not surprised "geek and nerd journalism" is proliferated by wannabe hipster dipshits who think picking up the biggest "nerd" thing around gives them "super nerd cred" yet claim that others who delve into series and going hardcore to learn lore is "too nerdy for me lol". Death to pretenders.

Have they ever fucking read any other installment in the Tolkienverse? Don't they fucking know how orcs were created?

Hell, I call bullshit on Wired's fucking inept shit and raise them stakes in that LOTR's conflict is meant to be a simile for World War II. I don't even fucking mind that.

If these dipshits wanted "true nerd cred" or whatever pedantic dicksucking goes online, they should check out Phantasy Star Universe. Their races are wayyyy more rooted in real life racial similarities that goes over their thick as concrete blockass heads. To explain:

Humans are meant to represent white people (coincidentally today, they are secretly repressed due to them having started the eugenics projects that borne all of the other races eons ago, kinda like the Social darwinism and imperialist colonization movements)

Numans or space elves are meant to represent asians (in Asian culture, face reading is a popular form of divination; the ears are said to represent the kind of personality one has. Also they are considered the "smartest" because of their focus on psychic based Techs and brainpower and have the hottest girls and everyone wants to fuck them. I also see Vulcan inspiration to them too)

Beastmen are meant to represent darker colored people (you know like Arabs and Blacks. Best of all, all of the beastmen race was made for mining and hard labor, and to how white people often equated colored people to animals. Their world has this mishmash of Tatooine from Star Wars, with Arabia and the Wild West. Other fun facts include how in real life the Wild West was actually filled with a greater amount of black people and black cowboys because slavery law was loosely enforced in the American west)

CASTs (androids) are meant to represent "communists" and Germans (cold, calculating, rather with a logical and pragmatic outlook on life. Are used as slave labor for more "intricate" tasks like servitude and crafting, and more vanilla white people I mean humans often steal their work. Cue Bender's "Kill All Humans" bit.)

Dumans or infested space virus human mutants are meant to represent "outcast" races, tribal minorities, and displaced ethnic peoples like Jews and Gypsies (they are considered "not clean" for being in contact with SEED, the alien parasite that threatens PSU's world)

And yet, they all live together in perfect harmony.

See Wired? I can pull the same shit too AND make an effort with actually using my brain without a need for ad revnue. True nerds died by the end of the 1990s by the way, when every faggot and their mom could log into the internet and "geek culture" exploded for the cash money. You know, kind of like Wired's writers.
 

Brooklyn Red Leg

Future Citizen of AnCapitsan
kiwifarms.net
Orcs were Elves corrupted by Melkor
Actually, The Wise THINK they were Elves that had been corrupted by Melkor. However, in The Unfinished Tales is it revealed the Druedain (Ghan-buri-Ghan's ancestors, think Neanderthals) and Orcs see each other as renegades. Orcs likely were a mixture of fallen Maia (since we know Maia CAN reproduce with The Children of Eru), Men (both Druedain and Edain) and maybe a few Elves (likely Avari who didn't make The Great Journey).

In his last writings Elves, Men and Dwarves all awoke at the same time. Its just the distances between the groups (Cuiviénen, Hildórien, Orocarni, Hithaeglir & Ered Luin) made contact almost impossible until Men reached Beleriand near the end of the First Age. In fact, its said the Edain were fleeing the darkness that had enveloped their ancestors in Hildórien. That puts most Orcish "blood" clearly in the Mannish-side of humans. Given Elves can simply die at will, and Men having fallen being unable to pass peacefully into Death (which the Numenoreans were granted, but really the last to do so was Aragorn II Elessar), there would probably be little Elvish blood in Orcs.

Of course, Orcs, Men and Elves are all Homo Sapiens (they can successfully cross-breed and have non-sterile offspring). Trolls can breed with Men (the Half-Trolls/Troll-Men of Far Harad being a thing during The Battle of the Pelennor Fields). Dwarves, being made by Aule without the full knowledge of The Children of Eru, but blessed by Eru after-the-fact, are unlikely to be able to produce viable offspring. The same is likely true of Hobbits. They're all Hominids of some type, but just not Homo Sapiens. This doesn't even touch on the really weird ones like Tom Bombadil and Goldberry (who may have been something akin to a Nixie).
 

Tasty Tatty

kiwifarms.net
I'm just patiently waiting for these people to realize that Harry Potter is way way worse.

I mean, I like HP, but how is that these people haven't noticed wizards are practically ethno-nationalists who consider themselves being superior to every other group and want to live segregated from other people? Even the good guys like Harry or Mr. Weasley consider Muggles to be laughable or useless and are highly patronizing of them. Just because they don't want them dead doesn't mean they consider them equals. And not only muggles. They even consider wizards from other communities to be inferior too.
 

Brooklyn Red Leg

Future Citizen of AnCapitsan
kiwifarms.net
I'm just patiently waiting for these people to realize that Harry Potter is way way worse.
That does bring up an interesting fact: all the Peoples of Middle-Earth (Elves, Ents, Eagles, Men, Dwarves, Orcs, Trolls, Hobbits) were capable of "magic" as Tolkien pointed out. Some were naturally more gifted (Elves, for instance), while others had more "mundane" sorts like Hobbits (their capability to go unnoticed, etc).
 

Graffiti canvas

True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
Actually, The Wise THINK they were Elves that had been corrupted by Melkor. However, in The Unfinished Tales is it revealed the Druedain (Ghan-buri-Ghan's ancestors, think Neanderthals) and Orcs see each other as renegades. Orcs likely were a mixture of fallen Maia (since we know Maia CAN reproduce with The Children of Eru), Men (both Druedain and Edain) and maybe a few Elves (likely Avari who didn't make The Great Journey).

In his last writings Elves, Men and Dwarves all awoke at the same time. Its just the distances between the groups (Cuiviénen, Hildórien, Orocarni, Hithaeglir & Ered Luin) made contact almost impossible until Men reached Beleriand near the end of the First Age. In fact, its said the Edain were fleeing the darkness that had enveloped their ancestors in Hildórien. That puts most Orcish "blood" clearly in the Mannish-side of humans. Given Elves can simply die at will, and Men having fallen being unable to pass peacefully into Death (which the Numenoreans were granted, but really the last to do so was Aragorn II Elessar), there would probably be little Elvish blood in Orcs.

Of course, Orcs, Men and Elves are all Homo Sapiens (they can successfully cross-breed and have non-sterile offspring). Trolls can breed with Men (the Half-Trolls/Troll-Men of Far Harad being a thing during The Battle of the Pelennor Fields). Dwarves, being made by Aule without the full knowledge of The Children of Eru, but blessed by Eru after-the-fact, are unlikely to be able to produce viable offspring. The same is likely true of Hobbits. They're all Hominids of some type, but just not Homo Sapiens. This doesn't even touch on the really weird ones like Tom Bombadil and Goldberry (who may have been something akin to a Nixie).
You just wrote a 3 paragraph version of this meme.

 

Brooklyn Red Leg

Future Citizen of AnCapitsan
kiwifarms.net
Just wait until these people hear about Dungeons and Dragons and the alignment system.
Already a problem with tabletop gaming, since the SJWs have invaded that too. Its bad enough that too many idiots for years on end thought Lawful Good meant Lawful Nice and Chaotic Neutral was the best way to play Chaotic Shit-Flinging Insane. Over 35 years playing and its no better than now than when I was a snot-nosed 10 year old cracking open the D&D Basic set for the first time.

People forget that Paladins are partly based upon Crusader groups like the Knights Templar and such. E. Gary Gygax put it no plainer than stating "An Eye for an Eye and a Tooth for a Tooth are perfectly in-line with Lawful Good". And Orcs really are EVIL with a capital E. Alignment isn't some pseudo-moralistic system in the game. It is an actual force in the Multiverse and your alignment is your place in the grand scheme of things. Only in settings like DragonLance must there be "Balance". Greyhawk, Gary's original setting, is a post-apocalyptic Swords & Sorcery setting (with High Fantasy varnish) where all kinds of evil cults flourish and where civilization is literally composed of tiny points of light surrounded by a howling wilderness of darkness. Every bandit, Orc warrior and Troll is trying their damnedest to chip away at the forces of civilization, to push the world closer to Chaos.

Hack & Slash: On Alignment, by Gygax
 

The Shadow

Talk to the Hand
kiwifarms.net
There were a couple things in LOTR that were kinda sorta old-timey racist, like seemingly all the black humans decided to join up with Sauron, and the poor hobbits talked an awful lot like a minstrel show black person. But that's minor stuff, I mean one of the main themes was that all the people had to come together to defeat evil, and their internal conflicts were as big a problem as the actual bad guys.
I think these aren't as necessarily racist as the modern perspective might think. The Southrons and Easterlings are both from unidentified points east and south of Middle Earth, and the only reason in the text to infer that the Southrons are Africans is that they use elephants in battle. As for the poor hobbits, I thought they were intended to represent rural, uneducated English types. They always seemed to be depicted as the English country bumpkin equivalent to me.
 

Shura

kiwifarms.net
If you want to find a few culprits, look for the artists and writers. Both of these are heavily infested with far left progressives, and SJW types, and they do affect the outcome of the products, boost the voice of the loud few.

I have been expecting this Tolkien=racist for years, ever since /pol/ had some actually decent threads on this, after that it was just a matter of time until one journalist went full exceptional.

Can't find for the life of me how 40k is mostly untouched on the current year of our lord.
 

Matthew216

kiwifarms.net
I was thinking more of how they overthink cartoons and other fiction, but there's that too. Look at how they insist certain people are always "marginalized," which seems to promote keeping them that way.
Of course. Without a marginalized race there would be no one for them to champion, and if there’s no one for them to champion, how will they prove their moral superiority to the world?
 
Tags
None

About Us

The Kiwi Farms is about eccentric individuals and communities on the Internet. We call them lolcows because they can be milked for amusement or laughs. Our community is bizarrely diverse and spectators are encouraged to join the discussion.

We do not place intrusive ads, host malware, sell data, or run crypto miners with your browser. If you experience these things, you have a virus. If your malware system says otherwise, it is faulty.

Supporting the Forum

How to Help

The Kiwi Farms is constantly attacked by insane people and very expensive to run. It would not be here without community support.

BTC: 1DgS5RfHw7xA82Yxa5BtgZL65ngwSk6bmm
ETH: 0xc1071c60Ae27C8CC3c834E11289205f8F9C78CA5
BAT: 0xc1071c60Ae27C8CC3c834E11289205f8F9C78CA5
LTC: LSZsFCLUreXAZ9oyc9JRUiRwbhkLCsFi4q
XMR: 438fUMciiahbYemDyww6afT1atgqK3tSTX25SEmYknpmenTR6wvXDMeco1ThX2E8gBQgm9eKd1KAtEQvKzNMFrmjJJpiino