What the fuck even is Hegalian philosophy and the dialectic anyway? -

[LooneyTroons]

Every time I try to look into learning more about Hegel I inevitably hit a wall due to his student's being up their own arse, and the source material being impenetrable cause Hegel's writing is famous for being dogshit.
Someone who understands Hegel please give me a tl;dr that would be comprehensible to a monkey. Comparisons to other philosophers you like or are knowledgeable on are also welcome. Nietzche in particular since he's the philosopher I can read/learn the most about without wanting to go to sleep.

 

[WeWuzFinns]

Reading is gay. Watch the grug version my nigga. I think someone said that not even Hagel understands Hagel.

 

[shameful existence]

 

[Arm_of_the_Lord]

"Philosopher is like a clogged toilet — always full of shit."
Plato

 

[KooksandFreaks]

Every time I try to look into learning more about Hegel I inevitably hit a wall due to his student's being up their own arse, and the source material being impenetrable cause Hegel's writing is famous for being dogshit.
Someone who understands Hegel please give me a tl;dr that would be comprehensible to a monkey. Comparisons to other philosophers you like or are knowledgeable on are also welcome. Nietzche in particular since he's the philosopher I can read/learn the most about without wanting to go to sleep.

I’ve had Hegel’s approach explained to me as two diametrically opposed sides engaging in debate and arriving at a compromise that satisfies no one.

 

[Bonesjones]

All of philosophy is people using as many words as possible to say the obvious, that's why Diogynes is the only one who matters. The true soul of philosophy is dunking on idiots.

 

[LooneyTroons]

Reading is gay. Watch the grug version my nigga. I think someone said that not even Hagel understands Hagel.

Appreciate the link, more or less able to follow along but this is a good example of what I was talking about in terms of his student's being up their own arses. Less flowery language, more explanation that wont hurt my feeble chimp brain.

I’ve had Hegel’s approach explained to me as two diametrically opposed sides engaging in debate and arriving at a compromise that satisfies no one.

So its like those rare youtube comment threads where people actually reach a conclusion instead of devolving into insults?


Thanks for the replies philosofarmers, what I think im getting so far is that its basically just determinism but made unnecessarily complicated in the way only a dead german could manage.

 

[KooksandFreaks]

So its like those rare youtube comment threads where people actually reach a conclusion instead of devolving into insults?

Actually, it was a guy I met from YouTube. He was batshit insane, but actually had some very prescient thoughts on social engineering, transhumanism and mob hysteria. We communicated mostly through direct messaging rather than in public comments.

He said that the internet was the best invention ever for controlling/manipulating large groups of people. I said the internet would enhance freedom of thought and expression, LOL.

 

[LooneyTroons]

Actually, it was a guy I met from YouTube. He was batshit insane, but actually had some very prescient thoughts on social engineering, transhumanism and mob hysteria. We communicated mostly through direct messaging rather than in public comments.

He said that the internet was the best invention ever for controlling/manipulating large groups of people. I said the internet would enhance freedom of thought and expression, LOL.

turns out you were both right

 

[Opticana]

Every time I try to look into learning more about Hegel I inevitably hit a wall due to his student's being up their own arse, and the source material being impenetrable cause Hegel's writing is famous for being dogshit.
Someone who understands Hegel please give me a tl;dr that would be comprehensible to a monkey. Comparisons to other philosophers you like or are knowledgeable on are also welcome. Nietzche in particular since he's the philosopher I can read/learn the most about without wanting to go to sleep.

So I'm not so knowledgeable on Rabbi Kook, but I can give an example of what I'm given to understand is a very Hegelian thought of his (personally my favorite one). If you think Hegel is incomprehensible, Rabbi Kook's original Hebrew is extremely difficult to understand even for a native, so much so that there's a whole market of commentaries devoted specifically to making it more accessible. Translation here is mine:

Atheism emerges like a cry does from the force of pains, to redeem man from the pit of this foreign sorrow, to raise him up from the dimness of words and phrases to the light of the ideal and the emotional, until it takes its place in the center of morality. Atheism has the right of a temporary existence, because it is needed in order to purge the filth that clings to a faith absent of knowledge and of work. This is in actuality its entire destiny - to remove the particularistic forms from the intrinsic ideal of all life, the root of all thought. When this situation continues for a number of generations, atheism will of necessity attempt to uproot any trace of God and all the institutions of service to Him, but what end does divine providence intend for this uprooting? To purge the dross that only separates between man and true godly enlightenment, and on the ruined heights destroyed by atheism the exalted knowledge of God will build its palace.

TL;DR - the secularization the world has been going through the past couple centuries is actually a good thing, because atheism forces religion to reexamine itself and get rid of the stupid parts.

 

[Lone MacReady]

Every time I try to look into learning more about Hegel I inevitably hit a wall due to his student's being up their own arse, and the source material being impenetrable cause Hegel's writing is famous for being dogshit.
Someone who understands Hegel please give me a tl;dr that would be comprehensible to a monkey. Comparisons to other philosophers you like or are knowledgeable on are also welcome. Nietzche in particular since he's the philosopher I can read/learn the most about without wanting to go to sleep.

Let me Barnie it for you.

Reminder, there's a lot of good information in old books.

 

[Unsmug Anime Avatar]

Every time I try to look into learning more about Hegel I inevitably hit a wall due to his student's being up their own arse, and the source material being impenetrable cause Hegel's writing is famous for being dogshit.

It's basically impossible. There are parts of Hegel that Hegel scholars today clearly can't make heads or tails of. You have to understand Hegel in the context of Kant and as an outgrowth of his concepts of reason, especially his critique of rationalism that Rationalists were unable to actually have positive knowledge about most subjects, so he introduced Analytical-Synthetic distinction to amend epistemology. Hegel was concerned with talking about coherence of mind with the outside world, and keeping assumptions out of philosophy. So he argued that we can't assume mind causes matter or matter prior to mind, therefore a third entity is necessary to reconcile the two which is Geist. To give another explanation, Hegel asks readers to envision a pure existence without properties--this object would have no attributes to actually distinguish it from nothing, so there needs to be something else to distinguish between being and non-being, which he calls Becoming. Everything is in dialectic until these opposite things (which, though opposite, mutually imply each other) are reconciled through Synthesis until the Absolute Idea which basically adopts all the positive things in previous ideas but doesn't contain any of their flaws.

 

[KooksandFreaks]

It's basically impossible. There are parts of Hegel that Hegel scholars today clearly can't make heads or tails of. You have to understand Hegel in the context of Kant and as an outgrowth of his concepts of reason, especially his critique of rationalism that Rationalists were unable to actually have positive knowledge about most subjects, so he introduced Analytical-Synthetic distinction to amend epistemology. Hegel was concerned with talking about coherence of mind with the outside world, and keeping assumptions out of philosophy. So he argued that we can't assume mind causes matter or matter prior to mind, therefore a third entity is necessary to reconcile the two which is Geist. To give another explanation, Hegel asks readers to envision a pure existence without properties--this object would have no attributes to actually distinguish it from nothing, so there needs to be something else to distinguish between being and non-being, which he calls Becoming. Everything is in dialectic until these opposite things (which, though opposite, mutually imply each other) are reconciled through Synthesis until the Absolute Idea which basically adopts all the positive things in previous ideas but doesn't contain any of their flaws.

So, Hegel thought it's possible to arrive at a state of perfection?

 

[LooneyTroons]

So, Hegel thought it's possible to arrive at a state of perfection?

I got that impression too, like i said, determinism but needlessly complicated

 

[KooksandFreaks]

I got that impression too, like i said, determinism but needlessly complicated

I'm beginning to think if you want to understand Hegel? You have to understand Germans first.

 

[Just Dont]

In short Hegelian Dialectics is the thesis that postulate that everything is cyclical, especially in History.

 

[LooneyTroons]

I'm beginning to think if you want to understand Hegel? You have to understand Germans first.

Being a basic bitch Nietzchean I'm just gonna chalk Hegel up as "Virgin Determinism vs Chad Eternal Return"

 

[KooksandFreaks]

In short Hegelian Dialectics is the thesis that postulate that everything is cyclical, especially in History.

I think history, especially human/biological does tend to be cyclical overall. Except, every now and then a monkey wrench gets thrown into the works and changes everything.

 

[KooksandFreaks]

Being a basic bitch Nietzchean I'm just gonna chalk Hegel up as "Virgin Determinism vs Chad Eternal Return"

I thought you said you didn't know nothing about philosophy?

 

[LooneyTroons]

I thought you said you didn't know nothing about philosophy?

I knew nothing about Hegel. Also a bit murky when it comes to Kant despite knowing hes incredibly important and influencial. Most of my philosophical knowledge is Nietzche, also know a handful about certain eastern philosophies and some Christian theological philosophy. I feel like I can grasp Nietzche much easier because he writes more like a novelist, and, at times, a satirist, rather than a dry academic