What was going on with Japanese PS2 games?

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The Ugly One

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I don't know, when I think PS3 I think of ugly looking garbage like Haze, which was such a downgrade over the devs' previous Timesplitters games.

Haze wasn't good, but PS2 launch titles weren't much better.

There some gems on PS3 like Uncharted and God of War III, but overall I never liked it an iota as much as I liked the PS2.

Online gaming was 1000x better on the PS3 than PS2. I played a lot of Call of Duty, Battlefield (BC2 & 3), Killzone 2, and Resistance 2. Open world games also got a lot better, too. Thinking Just Cause 2, GTA IV, and Skyrim. There were more stand-out first party games on PS2, for sure, but on the whole, my PS3 got plenty of use throughout its life. The games weren't as original, but they were bigger, prettier, and fewer issues.

On the PS4, I got it at launch, played 2 or 3 games a year, and finally unplugged it and canceled my PS+ account when Black Ops 4 was one of the worst AAA games I'd ever played.

Now I'm old and just play old shit from when I was in high school.
 

Dom Cruise

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Haze wasn't good, but PS2 launch titles weren't much better.
Too bad Haze wasn't a launch title, coming out two years in the PS3's lifespan and while it wasn't great, the original Timesplitters was a launch title that was better than Haze.

Online gaming was 1000x better on the PS3 than PS2. I played a lot of Call of Duty, Battlefield (BC2 & 3), Killzone 2, and Resistance 2. Open world games also got a lot better, too. Thinking Just Cause 2, GTA IV, and Skyrim. There were more stand-out first party games on PS2, for sure, but on the whole, my PS3 got plenty of use throughout its life. The games weren't as original, but they were bigger, prettier, and fewer issues.

On the PS4, I got it at launch, played 2 or 3 games a year, and finally unplugged it and canceled my PS+ account when Black Ops 4 was one of the worst AAA games I'd ever played.

Now I'm old and just play old shit from when I was in high school.
Never been a big online guy but I'll concede that point.
 

The Ugly One

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Too bad Haze wasn't a launch title, coming out two years in the PS3's lifespan and while it wasn't great, the original Timesplitters was a launch title that was better than Haze.

I had forgotten how long it got delayed. Of course, the PS3 itself got delayed quite a bit as well. That first year or so was a real shitshow for Sony. I didn't get mine until the Slim came out anyway.

Every generation, there are studios that don't make it over the hump, because the new generation requires bigger teams, which means different management structures and different development processes. It's really a shame that Free Radical was one of those that got killed off by the HD generation.
 

Dom Cruise

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I had forgotten how long it got delayed. Of course, the PS3 itself got delayed quite a bit as well. That first year or so was a real shitshow for Sony. I didn't get mine until the Slim came out anyway.

Every generation, there are studios that don't make it over the hump, because the new generation requires bigger teams, which means different management structures and different development processes. It's really a shame that Free Radical was one of those that got killed off by the HD generation.
The HD generation was a complete massacre of developers, it's absurd the sheer number of them that closed.

Free Radical, Bizarre Creations and Terminal Reality are 3 off the top of my head that didn't survive that gen that I miss.
 

LightDragonman1

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The HD generation was a complete massacre of developers, it's absurd the sheer number of them that closed.

Free Radical, Bizarre Creations and Terminal Reality are 3 off the top of my head that didn't survive that gen that I miss.
Seriously, HD development proved to be far more costly and complicated than any of the previous generations, so I guess I can't be too surprised at how many beloved development teams, genres, and series ended up biting the bullet. The Financial Crisis that happened during the same time period only made things worse.

It's also ended up leading to hacks like Keiji Inafune declaring that "Japan is over" in terms of gaming, and the only way to be saved was to Westernize, or outsource to no-name devs just because they were Western (which in his eyes, automatically equals quality). Big mistake.
 

XYZpdq

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yeah PS2 was in this weird sweet spot of "cheap to dev for" and "able to get some decent shit" for a long stretch, combined with the way it burrowed in at the dawn of dvd
like if there was an atari 2600 that as also a vhs deck
 

The Ugly One

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Your average PS2 game cost about $1m to make, and the break even point was around 250K units. Your typical PS3 game was closer to $20m. GTA V cost $500m. A lot of games don't break even on sales any more; they need continuous monetization over a year or two to make money.

There are a lot of past games that were good, but not good enough to sell 10m units, or keep raking in cash from DLC over years, and therefore simply could not be made today, because the baseline expectation for graphics, sound, etc is so much higher than it used to be. That's why old games are worth playing. They're sort of like classic TV from the 1960s. Budgets were tight, but audience expectations weren't high, so actors and directors alike were allowed to experiment in ways that are flat out forbidden today, like how the Dick Van Dyke show has entire bits that are nothing more than some of the funniest people alive at the time just bullshitting and making each other laugh, or Star Trek would make an hour episode out of the most off-the-wall concept you could think of, just because they found some castoff props in a dumpster and decided to build an episode around them.
 

Dom Cruise

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Seriously, HD development proved to be far more costly and complicated than any of the previous generations, so I guess I can't be too surprised at how many beloved development teams, genres, and series ended up biting the bullet. The Financial Crisis that happened during the same time period only made things worse.
It simply wasn't worth it if you ask me, I'd be fine with still gaming on a CRT if it meant better games.

The only thing HD was truly a boon for was movies.

Your average PS2 game cost about $1m to make, and the break even point was around 250K units. Your typical PS3 game was closer to $20m. GTA V cost $500m. A lot of games don't break even on sales any more; they need continuous monetization over a year or two to make money.

There are a lot of past games that were good, but not good enough to sell 10m units, or keep raking in cash from DLC over years, and therefore simply could not be made today, because the baseline expectation for graphics, sound, etc is so much higher than it used to be. That's why old games are worth playing. They're sort of like classic TV from the 1960s. Budgets were tight, but audience expectations weren't high, so actors and directors alike were allowed to experiment in ways that are flat out forbidden today, like how the Dick Van Dyke show has entire bits that are nothing more than some of the funniest people alive at the time just bullshitting and making each other laugh, or Star Trek would make an hour episode out of the most off-the-wall concept you could think of, just because they found some castoff props in a dumpster and decided to build an episode around them.
Your comparison to 60s TV is very apt, especially in Star Trek, because like Star Trek and PS2 era games you were encouraged to use your imagination to fill in whatever limits there were in the set design or graphics, a lost art today when graphics are advanced enough just to show anything.

And like 60s TV being this legendary thing with a cult following for decades, the same is probably going to be the case with 00s era games, I mean it's kind of that way already.
 
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Pissmaster

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yeah PS2 was in this weird sweet spot of "cheap to dev for" and "able to get some decent shit" for a long stretch, combined with the way it burrowed in at the dawn of dvd
like if there was an atari 2600 that as also a vhs deck
A big part of the DVD thing was how it was also the best and cheapest DVD player for a long time. Something like, a PS2 was just $300, when like the cheapest DVD player you could get in late 2000 was $600. And hey, it also came with the ability to play this enormous slew of past games for PS1. It was such a good deal for a new console when it was new that you'd almost be stupid not to buy one.
 

Sketch Turner

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because the baseline expectation for graphics, sound, etc is so much higher than it used to be.
Yeah, with films even the production and effects and shit may be higher polished or whatever but there's just no... effort or soul in it. It's like "turn up, do thing, paycheck, fuck off" now.
 

Michael Wade

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Haze wasn't good, but PS2 launch titles weren't much better.



Online gaming was 1000x better on the PS3 than PS2. I played a lot of Call of Duty, Battlefield (BC2 & 3), Killzone 2, and Resistance 2. Open world games also got a lot better, too. Thinking Just Cause 2, GTA IV, and Skyrim. There were more stand-out first party games on PS2, for sure, but on the whole, my PS3 got plenty of use throughout its life. The games weren't as original, but they were bigger, prettier, and fewer issues.

On the PS4, I got it at launch, played 2 or 3 games a year, and finally unplugged it and canceled my PS+ account when Black Ops 4 was one of the worst AAA games I'd ever played.

Now I'm old and just play old shit from when I was in high school.
Ps4 finally got some good multiplayer thank god. Insurgency sandstorm is fantastic and actually has good voice chat. Enlisted is a unique AI squad FPS free to play. Battlefield 1 is good, and Battlefield 2042... is an enjoyable clusterfuck.
 

Just Some Other Guy

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Idk, but I sure wish I could have a lot more ace combat holy Trinity gameplay nowadays. Ace Combat 7 was very meh, but Project Wingman was a breath of fresh air. Now I just need more of it. A lot more.
 

Pissmaster

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Did anyone ever play Mister Mosquito? Was it a good game? I always wondered

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also I didn't know that the Japanese box is literally just a fucking foot with a mosquito sucking the pinky toe 🤢
 

Dom Cruise

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Idk, but I sure wish I could have a lot more ace combat holy Trinity gameplay nowadays. Ace Combat 7 was very meh, but Project Wingman was a breath of fresh air. Now I just need more of it. A lot more.
I was pretty upset how disappointed I was with Ace Combat 7, not a bad game but the best moments were simply the ones where you revisit locations from 4.

But as soon as it veered off into the twist of you being a prisoner I knew it wasn't going to be great, that was dumb and simply not any fun to play as.

Was still very nice to see the return of Strangereal though.

Did anyone ever play Mister Mosquito? Was it a good game? I always wondered

View attachment 2874323

also I didn't know that the Japanese box is literally just a fucking foot with a mosquito sucking the pinky toe 🤢
Always wanted to but never wound playing more than a demo due to never seeing the game on the shelves of video stores and not feeling like it was worth buying (which I regret now)
 

Marissa Moira

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Did anyone ever play Mister Mosquito? Was it a good game? I always wondered

View attachment 2874323

also I didn't know that the Japanese box is literally just a fucking foot with a mosquito sucking the pinky toe 🤢
I've got it, it was originally released as a budget title series in the west with other games like Mad Maestro.

Each stage is a singular room and you're supposed to suck a specific number of vials of blood from the human in order to clear it.
 

Scarlett Johansson

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It was called the "Computer Entertainment System" in some adverts which also caused many spergs to sperg out about this being the last generation of consoles.

Still hasn't fucking happened.


Well I can't let this go unnoticed since you allow me to live rent free after all, would be very inconsiderate IMO.

For playstation consoles, the first year is never the year where big sales are made, Sony consoles take awhile to ramp up to full strength and it's not uncommon for it to be four years out and having it's sales quadruple from what the first year did.

View attachment 2804013

View attachment 2804015

This is the list of most of the Playstation's console shipments for a few of their generations and their top selling games for PS4, none of them are year one outside of Killzone. Software always drives console sales way more for the following years because normally Sony never has a big must have launch game for the first year. Current the PS5 is sitting well above average compared to the PS3 in the global market. The stuff in japan would be deemed a regional deficiency. There's yet to be a console that's sold in the high double digit millions in it's first year that's gone on to actually flop. The PS5 is still very much in demand for Japan but they can't make enough to sate it. You would maybe have an Argument if the PS5 only sold around 4 million it's first year globally and had stock wasting away on shelves after launch like the PS3. It's expected to be around 18-20 million sold by Quarter 1 of 2022 which is going to put it well ahead of any previous lowpoints made by the PS3.

Mind you it took 3-4 years to salvage the PS3 before it had a somewhat suitable library and it eventually made around 90 million consoles worlwide. The PS3 sold more in it's later years than it did at launch. And it had a godawful launch and even needed a newer model revision put out as a means of remedying the flaws the hardware had.
Ngl I don't believe Uncharted has that high a sale. Idk...I just can't.
But also lmao battlefront and Detroit. Would have thought God of War would be on the list tbh...(or Yakuza?)

Also wasn't there a game called Giant Lady or something? It was this giant woman stomping people. I remember seeing it listed with Mr Mosquito as odd Japanese games. Iirc she had a bikini or something on?....
 

LightDragonman1

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Man, I know that a lot of these titles brought up are extremely out there and bizarre, but I sometimes long for gaming to go back to that period.

Titles like that simply wouldn't even be so much as glanced at by publishers and studios nowadays, because that means risking losing money, due to how expensive development has become compared to then. It's why we hardly see any genres like stealth anymore, because the audience simply isn't large enough to warrant the costs. It's much safer for publishers and developers to stick with the same safe formulas and heavy monetization over and over, lest you risk running your studios into the red.
 

Dom Cruise

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Man, I know that a lot of these titles brought up are extremely out there and bizarre, but I sometimes long for gaming to go back to that period.

Titles like that simply wouldn't even be so much as glanced at by publishers and studios nowadays, because that means risking losing money, due to how expensive development has become compared to then. It's why we hardly see any genres like stealth anymore, because the audience simply isn't large enough to warrant the costs. It's much safer for publishers and developers to stick with the same safe formulas and heavy monetization over and over, lest you risk running your studios into the red.
To be fair, there was a lot of junk back then, there's an overall higher standard of quality among published titles outside of free for all open markets like Steam, but consequently there's less innovation and oddball titles, the past had lower lows, but higher highs, today most stuff falls into middle of the road, not terrible, but not something that inspires real passion.
 

Marissa Moira

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To be fair, there was a lot of junk back then, there's an overall higher standard of quality among published titles outside of free for all open markets like Steam, but consequently there's less innovation and oddball titles, the past had lower lows, but higher highs, today most stuff falls into middle of the road, not terrible, but not something that inspires real passion.
You're going to have to be more specific on what you're looking for I think. Because as someone who buys a ton of niche shit, I have not really been at a loss for titles for the past console generation and the current one.

You may want to look into VR if you want extremely experimental titles.