Who was more right, Huxley or Orwell? -

[Sergeant Politeness]

What's the more effective way to control people: through appealing to vanity and laziness like in Brave New World, or through their fear and emotions like in 1984?

 

[ICametoLurk]

Why not both?

 

[AnOminous]

What's the more effective way to control people: through appealing to vanity and laziness like in Brave New World, or through their fear and emotions like in 1984?

Probably Huxley at least in terms of Western civ and specifically the U.S. Any really strong dictatorship would use carrot and stick, though, not just one.

 

[Elwood P. Dowd]

FWIW, Huxley liked 1984, but thought Brave New World was the one that got it right...

Letter from Huxley to Orwell

Interesting read if you've got a minute.

Edit: There's a thread about this letter on the front page of Reddit now. All those imaginary internet points I lost by posting this here rather than there.

 

[AnOminous]

FWIW, Huxley liked 1984, but thought Brave New World was the one that got it right...

Letter from Huxley to Orwell

Interesting read if you've got a minute.

That's my source of my opinion, as I found his argument convincing.

 

[RI 360]

The Current Year more closely resembles Ray Bradbury's Fahrenheit 451, in which mass media renders people incapable of understanding complex concepts which turns into society censors itself into totalitarianism.

 

[Sergeant Politeness]

The Current Year more closely resembles Ray Bradbury's Fahrenheit 451, in which mass media renders people incapable of understanding complex concepts which turns into society censors itself into totalitarianism.

Man, I forgot about Fahrenheit 451. Loved that book. I should add it to the poll.

 

[Alec Benson Leary]

That's my source of my opinion, as I found his argument convincing.

Having just read it, I concur.

 

[Enclave Supremacy]

Actually I would say that there is far less between 1984 and BNW. Huxley, like most, appears to have not properly read the book where-in the masses of Oceania are explicitly not placed under any overt means of oppression because they don't have to be; the Proles live their lives as they did before the revolution (i.e. 1930's Londoners) and will be content to continue aimlessly till the end of time whilst being fed crap entertainment from the Ministry of Truth and being strung along with fantasies like winning the Lottery.

I've expounded upon it before but I think the models of control envisioned in 1984 are obsolete in today's world - the internet in-particular renders them pretty hard to practice. The world isn't static like in 1984, its changing and people know it all the time. Plus it relies on an upper-class being so devoted and they'll punish and purge themselves unlike the actual upper-class of dictatorial regimes.

BNW, if you don't consider all of the science-fiction aspects, reveals in change though with its notion of Ford and assembly line economics. Rampant drugs and casual sex. Hyper-consumption economy. I've always thought that there's plenty of people in Britain, in-parts of the London sprawl and elsewhere that would probably genuinely sell their suffrage for an easy gig and some drugs. Far more relevant now than the Proles of 1984 who are basically content serfs rather than the kinds of common attitudes we see in people today when given social media, brands/labels etc.

 

[ICametoLurk]

The world is like 1984 though,

The disputed areas has been and still is full of proxy wars.

And if you're into conspiracy theories you could argue that the political landscape of 1984 is reality, in that three major groups of people have agreed to make the Disputed region their personal playground because actual nuclear warfare would wipe everyone out and no one would win. And that it's done to stop any major change in the world's geo-political background.

I remember @Guardian G.I. mentioned a conspiracy theory that Russians had that matched this perfectly even when not talking about 1984. (Edit: Found it)

So really it's both. New World for the West and 1984 world-wide.

 

[millais]

The world is like 1984 though,

The disputed areas has been and still is full of proxy wars.

And if you're into conspiracy theories you could argue that the political landscape of 1984 is reality, in that three major groups of people have agreed to make the Disputed region their personal playground because actual nuclear warfare would wipe everyone out and no one would win. And that it's done to stop any major change in the world's geo-political background.

I remember @Guardian G.I. mentioned a conspiracy theory that Russians had that matched this perfectly even when not talking about 1984. (Edit: Found it)

So really it's both. New World for the West and 1984 world-wide.

He also came close to articulating the modern concept of the military industrial complex being one of the big drivers of incessant global conflict, though he missed the corporate angle.